Why would someone acknowledge the existence of God but refuse to worship Him?

[Father Heathen]

You just gave your position away.

Eh? What would that be?

 

[Willamena]

Tell me and then we will both know.

Ditto.

 

[Trailblazer]

Haven't met a human who doesn't worship something.

You just met one.
I love my cats and my husband but I do not worship them.
I hold some people in high regard but I do not worship them.

 

[Trailblazer]

Eh? What would that be?

I dunno for sure.... A non-religious believer or an deist???

 

[Trailblazer]

I see it is because all the attractions of the world have been loved, over preference to Love in obedience to God.

I understand what you are saying Tony but I do not understand why.
Obedience I understand, Love I don't.

Remember that thread I started on Baha'i Forums?
Clearly, God wants us to worship Him, but why should we?

Yet I STILL don't understand.

 

[Trailblazer]

Maybe the stories told about God describe 'Him' as someone/something unworthy of worship? You know, by promoting slavery, bigotry, ignorance, etc.

Yeah, I talk to so many Christians and atheists those stories kind of stick in my head, so even though the Baha'i version of God is nothing like those stories depict, I have a problem with Him.

But the primary problem I have with God is that he created this world, which is a storehouse of suffering. I cannot logically accommodate an All-Loving God that would create such a world and allow innocent people to suffer, most often through no fault of their own. My husband keeps saying I should be an atheist, and I would be were it not for one minor detail, I believe God exists.

I keep thinking God is going to get me for saying this, but then I think that if God can't even understand why I feel this way, He is unworthy of my belief anyway. But God has got us over a barrel if we believe in the Abrahamic God because you know what He can do if He wants to, not a pretty picture.

 

[QuestioningMind]

I guess you and I think alike because I asked that on a thread I started not long ago...

Why should we love and trust God? Is God loving and trustworthy?

And I never really got an answer that was acceptable to me.

Sadly I've yet to receive an answer here as well.

 

[Trailblazer]

Exactly.
I believe in God. Just not the petty primitive warlord God image generally imagined by Abrahamic religionists. God is so far beyond our understanding and perception that I cannot* believe It is concerned about nonsense like worship.

I am with you on that, even though I believe in the Abrahamic God.
That puts me in a kind of Catch-22.

The saving grace is that Baha'is do not believe in the primitive warlord God image of God that Christians believe in, but we are still supposed to Love and Fear God. I Fear Him but I cannot say I love Him, and still be honest.

 

[ajarntham]

He has sent many messengers and created a world filled with signs for people to reflect. Why would someone acknowledge His existence, but refuse to worship Him and to obey the commands He has told people to obey (or, the commands people think he has made known)?

The standard account of Bible-believing Christians, as I have heard it anyway, is that all people in human history (with One exception) either 1) know what God wants them to do, but suppress that knowledge, or 2) despite knowing what God wants them to do, constantly fail to do it.

Now it seems to me that if somebody manufactures ten billion units of something, and they all fail to do the task they were made to do, either the manufacturer is incompetent or he wants them to fail. Are there any other possibilities?

 

[Quintessence]

You just met one.
I love my cats and my husband but I do not worship them.
I hold some people in high regard but I do not worship them.

Some folks have narrow criteria for what they consider "worship." In my studies across religions, I find I can't muster that because it inevitably ends up excluding many rituals of worship. I think people make worship much more complicated than it actually is (or needs to be, perhaps). I also have observed many people have a problematic relationship with the word "worship" for some reason, much like they have problematic relationship with the word "god." I used to be one of those people, so I get it on some level.

In any case, I really don't care what people call it. I'll call people's behavioral expressions of their most deeply held values "worship" because that's the heart of what it's about. The word put to it doesn't matter, and humans are creatures of passions and values. They inevitably deem things deeply worthy. A spouse should always be on that list if one hopes the marriage to last.

 

[Trailblazer]

Sadly I've yet to receive an answer here as well.

And you probably won't get an answer either because the only reason religious believers believe that they are supposed to worship God is because their scriptures tell them to.... But that is not good enough for me, I need a reason that makes sense to me. Saying that God created me is not adequate either, because I did not ask to be created.

 

[Trailblazer]

The word put to it doesn't matter, and humans are creatures of passions and values. They inevitably deem things deeply worthy. A spouse should always be on that list if one hopes the marriage to last.

I only wish I could feel that way about God, but love cannot be forced.

The thing is, I can SEE what my husband is doing to be worthy of my love, but I cannot SEE what God is doing, yet I am supposed to believe anyway.

 

[The Hammer]

I only wish I could feel that way about God, but love cannot be forced.

The thing is, I can SEE what my husband is doing to be worthy of my love, but I cannot SEE what God is doing, yet I am supposed to believe anyway.

If you cannot SEE what the gods do for you, are you even really looking?

 

[Trailblazer]

Well, picture yourself as an omnipotent, eternal being.

Now picture yourself as an omnipotent, eternal being with millions of voices in your head singing your praises and asking for a boon. Are these voices real, or they just products of your all-powerful mind? (delusions)

How long could you maintain your sanity in such a state?

Oh, so you mean the potential harm would be to God.

I do not believe that there is anything an omnipotent God cannot handle, and if He did not want to hear all of us praying all at once, He could turn off his cell or put some of us on hold and get back to us later.

As you can see, this hot weather is starting to get to me. I am a Washingtonian, so I don't like hot weather, can you ask God to turn down the temp?

 

[Trailblazer]

If you cannot SEE what the gods do for you, are you even really looking?

Where is there to look?
You tell me and then we'll both know.

 

[The Hammer]

Where is there to look?
You tell me and then we'll both know.

I see the gods everywhere I look. The plants, the trees, the animals around me, the sky, clouds and heavens, even in my spouse. These are the signs of gods you're looking for. Life is a sign of the gods, creation is a sign of the gods.

 

[Trailblazer]

I worship a subset of about a dozen+ or so. While also acknowledging the importance and place that other Deities have for other people. I also consider deities I don't actively worship as having things of value I can learn from them.

But why do you consider them worthy or your worship?
Moreover how do you know that did it?

 

[The Hammer]

But why do you consider them worthy or your worship?
Moreover how do you know that did it?

Because they have had a real and impactful effect on my life, even when I wasn't looking for them directly. Any deity that goes out of their way to make their presence known to me, deserves at least a passing mention, if not active worship.

Edit: I don't understand your last question. "That did it", that did what?

 

[Trailblazer]

The standard account of Bible-believing Christians, as I have heard it anyway, is that all people in human history (with One exception) either 1) know what God wants them to do, but suppress that knowledge, or 2) despite knowing what God wants them to do, constantly fail to do it.

Now it seems to me that if somebody manufactures ten billion units of something, and they all fail to do the task they were made to do, either the manufacturer is incompetent or he wants them to fail. Are there any other possibilities?

Yep, there are other possibilities... the manufactured human product has a "on" position for following teachings and laws of God and an "off" position for failure to do so.

God gave us free will to choose between good and evil, between obeying or disobeying Him, etc.

God wants us to succeed and that is why God sends Messengers to guide us on the straight path, but since not everyone follows the teachings and laws of the Messengers, some people fail. Some people might not be aware of those teachings and laws and some people might be aware of them and fail to follow them for various reasons.

 

[Trailblazer]

Because they have had a real and impactful effect on my life, even when I wasn't looking for them directly. Any deity that goes out of their way to make their presence known to me, deserves at least a passing mention, if not active worship.

I like your deity better than my deity. Can I come to Tacoma and look him up, it is only a short drive.

My deity goes out of its way to hide from me.
In too would worship a deity if I saw he was doing something.

To be fair to my deity, he is called "the most manifest of the manifest and the most hidden of the hidden" because He manifests His attributes in His Messengers, and reveals His message to His Messengers, but He hides his Essence.