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Why?
- Thread starter Useless2015
- Start date
I think Bible tells there is only one true God that is greater than Jesus, that is why Jesus doesn’t seem to be the one and only true God according to the Bible.
But I think God is the same, eternal life is only for righteous and others will die.
These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
Mat. 25:46
For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Romans 6:23
Kelly of the Phoenix
Well-Known Member
And how many are actually related to the dispersed ancients?
PruePhillip
Well-Known Member
All of them actually.
Jacob, Moses, Ezekiel, Isaiah etc all spoke of the Jews
losing their land. Isaiah said they would lose it twice, first
to Babylon.
After Jesus the Jews went into exile, again. Many became
slaves in Egypt, again.
They suffered pogroms, genocide and final solutions.
(Including my own family.)
But through it all the Jews knew that one day they would
return because their scripture told them so. This scripture
isn't like the myth of the Rainbow Serpent, or Zeus on Mt.
Olympus - it claims to be historic.
GoodbyeDave
Well-Known Member
Is this even true? It's true that the OT is full of murder and genocide at divine command, but is that any better than Jesus's obsession with "hell, where the devouring worm never dies and the fire is not quenched"? What of the people of Capernaum, who are threatened with that fate merely because they wouldn't listen to his sermon?
Then consider the Gadarene Swine. Many have criticised this miracle, if it actually happened, on the grounds of cruelty to animals. Personally, I always wonder why no-one sympathises with the poor pig farmer, whose livelihood was destroyed. Presumably Jesus thought him just another goy with no rights.
The philosopher John McTaggart wrote to a friend "if one were a Christian, one would have to worship Christ and I don't like him very much…" I know what he meant.
PruePhillip
Well-Known Member
Exactly. There is no difference between the God of the Old and New Testament.
Historically this can be seen in the fate of the Jewish people.
Unfortunately, a serious omen was given by Jesus when he said that the Jews
would once again return to Jerusalem "when the Gentile's time is fulfilled." What
is THAT supposed to mean? Methinks it means that the Gentile will suffer as the
Jew once did.
lukethethird
unknown member
Christianity brought eternal punishment for nonbelievers, because God loves everyone, right.
Kelly of the Phoenix
Well-Known Member
You can be Jewish religiously but not ethnically. Note that Israel thinks that black Jews need to "go back to Africa."
It wasn't historic until some anti-Semitic countries decided that maybe gas chambers were a bit much, but they could still get rid of their local Jews by convincing them to move somewhere else.
PruePhillip
Well-Known Member
This doesn't make sense to me.
The exile and dispersal of the Jews after 70AD IS historic.
Jesus warned his followers to flee when they saw this about
to happen.
As an aside - more Jews were driven out of their ancient Arab and Persian
homes after 1948 than Palestinians who chose not to live under Israeli
occupation, despite pleas for them to stay in their villages by Israel's govt..
ProtonLander
New Member
Have you read Revelation?!? That hasn't even happened yet and the God of the Bible seems the angriest he has ever been there. Simillarly there are loving verses in the OT and the NT, Here are some pretty angry verses in the NT.
"9 Let love be without dissimulation. Abhor that which is evil; cleave to that which is good."
-Romans 12;9
"
3 And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth: and unto them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power.
4 And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads.
5 And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man.
6 And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them."-Revelation 9;6
"
12 But these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;
13 And shall receive the reward of unrighteousness, as they that count it pleasure to riot in the day time. Spots they are and blemishes, sporting themselves with their own deceivings while they feast with you;
14 Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:"
2 Peter 2;12-14
Love your neighbor was actually quoted from leviticus!:
"18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the Lord"-
Leviticus 19;18
"
16 But they and our fathers dealt proudly, and hardened their necks, and hearkened not to thy commandments,
17 And refused to obey, neither were mindful of thy wonders that thou didst among them; but hardened their necks, and in their rebellion appointed a captain to return to their bondage: but thou art a God ready to pardon, gracious and merciful, slow to anger, and of great kindness, and forsookest them not"
-Nehemiah 9;16-17
"
43 But now thus saith the Lord that created thee, O Jacob, and he that formed thee, O Israel, Fear not: for I have redeemed thee, I have called thee by thy name; thou art mine.
2 When thou passest through the waters, I will be with thee; and through the rivers, they shall not overflow thee: when thou walkest through the fire, thou shalt not be burned; neither shall the flame kindle upon thee.
3 For I am the Lord thy God, the Holy One of Israel, thy Saviour: I gave Egypt for thy ransom, Ethiopia and Seba for thee."
-Isaiah 43;1-3
"9 Let love be without dissimulation. Abhor that which is evil; cleave to that which is good."
-Romans 12;9
"
3 And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth: and unto them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power.
4 And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads.
5 And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man.
6 And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them."-Revelation 9;6
"
12 But these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;
13 And shall receive the reward of unrighteousness, as they that count it pleasure to riot in the day time. Spots they are and blemishes, sporting themselves with their own deceivings while they feast with you;
14 Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:"
2 Peter 2;12-14
Love your neighbor was actually quoted from leviticus!:
"18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the Lord"-
Leviticus 19;18
"
16 But they and our fathers dealt proudly, and hardened their necks, and hearkened not to thy commandments,
17 And refused to obey, neither were mindful of thy wonders that thou didst among them; but hardened their necks, and in their rebellion appointed a captain to return to their bondage: but thou art a God ready to pardon, gracious and merciful, slow to anger, and of great kindness, and forsookest them not"
-Nehemiah 9;16-17
"
43 But now thus saith the Lord that created thee, O Jacob, and he that formed thee, O Israel, Fear not: for I have redeemed thee, I have called thee by thy name; thou art mine.
2 When thou passest through the waters, I will be with thee; and through the rivers, they shall not overflow thee: when thou walkest through the fire, thou shalt not be burned; neither shall the flame kindle upon thee.
3 For I am the Lord thy God, the Holy One of Israel, thy Saviour: I gave Egypt for thy ransom, Ethiopia and Seba for thee."
-Isaiah 43;1-3
I don’t think there is commandment to slaughter everything that moves. But I think the God is same in New and Old Testament. In both God doesn’t allow evil to continue forever and righteousness is what God desires.
amorphous_constellation
Well-Known Member
I used to see it that way, but now the castigating material in the new testament really kinda sticks out to me. Jesus said if you're nice to your enemies, then you heap coals on their head. He comes back in revelation with a sword for a tongue. How about this, how about we strive to be nicer than Jesus. Rather than wishing my 'enemies' will end up with all that bad karma, why not really forgive them in a way that isn't superficial. It wouldn't satisfy me to see a hot coal dropped on anyone's head - but apparently Jesus would like to see it, and after being crucified it seems that he hopes for revenge. In giving out 'love' in way that opens himself to persecution, is he not fishing for subjects of wrath... Perhaps other traditions have an approach to love which is less laced with traps?
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
It's because Christians hijacked Judaism.
It's borrowed theology made into a hybrid.
rational experiences
Veteran Member
When you decide to compile a book of Revelations after you realized why humans became so hateful....by being irradiated mutated and brain chemical changes by UFO attack of extra radiation masses on the God Earth.
Seeing the history Sun attack on Earth was a UFO radiating mass on stone converting....as the theme, what humans in science copied.
How to convert the body of stone mass to release energy/power for sciences.
Did it a very long time ago. Mutated life on Earth into blasted out cells, the dinosaur history.
Seeing in human history it stated Nature Garden, and human male brotherhood first scientists.
Then mutated life on Earth Nature Garden, dinosaurs and then ICE AGE.
Holy Ice, ice accrual every December, newly born/replaced allowed returned/reincarnated human genetics. Life given back to holiness.
Life then chose science again and irradiated life, Old Testimonials. The Testimony, science and machine first activation is always quantified as an experiment.
Therefore when you apply what was revealed in science attacking natural life, then you also quote what God caused in radiation ground attack, to the human life/mind and body. To be irrational, mutated and sick and sacrificed and hateful.
Truthful human reasoning in scientific attack on self life mind and body.
Seeing the history Sun attack on Earth was a UFO radiating mass on stone converting....as the theme, what humans in science copied.
How to convert the body of stone mass to release energy/power for sciences.
Did it a very long time ago. Mutated life on Earth into blasted out cells, the dinosaur history.
Seeing in human history it stated Nature Garden, and human male brotherhood first scientists.
Then mutated life on Earth Nature Garden, dinosaurs and then ICE AGE.
Holy Ice, ice accrual every December, newly born/replaced allowed returned/reincarnated human genetics. Life given back to holiness.
Life then chose science again and irradiated life, Old Testimonials. The Testimony, science and machine first activation is always quantified as an experiment.
Therefore when you apply what was revealed in science attacking natural life, then you also quote what God caused in radiation ground attack, to the human life/mind and body. To be irrational, mutated and sick and sacrificed and hateful.
Truthful human reasoning in scientific attack on self life mind and body.
Thief
Rogue Theologian
exactly correct
it happened at the Last Supper Table
I think there is really no difference. In both OT and NT person should be righteous and the wage of sin is death.
God in the New Testament does not love everyone. There is much weeping and gnashing of teeth. What you're hearing is modern Christians repeating stuff which is not giving the full and true picture and meaning held in the New Testament. Its meant to be the same God, even if Marcion didn't think so!
74x12
Well-Known Member
God never hated anyone. God wants to give everyone a second chance. That's why He came as Jesus Christ. The wounds Jesus endured no one did to him but us. We wounded God with our sins all during the old Testament days and we haven't stopped since then and those sins were manifest on the body of Jesus Christ for all to see. Every wound and drop of blood we did to him. And we didn't know what we were doing which is why Jesus said "Father forgive them for they know not what they do" but now God has revealed it to us. In Jesus Christ God was saying "this is what you've been doing to me" but I can forgive. So that's the love of God. The shining light of his love for a broken generation.
(Zechariah 13:6, Zechariah 11:13)
I suggest you have never read Hebrew Scripture for its own legitimacy, or maybe not at all to come to your conclusion.