Will there ever be a 'Reformation' in Islam?

[Owneh]

Any reformation will just malform as a different branch.

 

[psychoslice]

Lets hope that this will happen to all religions, after all they all need reviewing and some adjustment in one form or another.

 

[firedragon]

Lets hope that this will happen to all religions, after all they all need reviewing and some adjustment in one form or another.

Different religions will never allow it, because reform hurts their ego.

 

[paarsurrey]

Whenever a revealed religion gets corrupted by its own followers, by changing the text of the scriptures or the Word Revealed (as did happen in the case of Judaism and Christianity) or its true meaning (as has happened in the case of Muslims), G-d sends the Reformer. And the reformation of Islam under Mirza Ghulam Ahmad has started, peacefully, despite opposition, persecution and killings done by the fellow-Muslims ( in name not in deeds).
Regards

 

[TashaN]

Names of all the prophets are not mentioned by Quran:

[4:164] Surely, We have sent revelation to thee, as We sent revelation to Noah and the Prophets after him; and We sent revelation to Abraham and Ishmael and Isaac and Jacob and his children and to Jesus and Job and Jonah and Aaron and Solomon, and We gave David a Book.

[4:165]AndWe sent someMessengers whom We have already mentioned to thee and some Messengers whom We have not mentioned to thee — and Allah spoke to Moses particularly —
[4:166]Messengers, bearers of glad tidings and warners, so that people may have no plea against Allah afterthe coming ofthe Messengers. And Allah is Mighty, Wise.
http://www.alislam.org/quran/search2/showChapter.php?ch=4&verse=164​

Regards

This Mirza is either delusional or a deceiver with a wicked plan. It's not about the name per se, the thing is, he is claiming to be Jesus and Mahdi incarnation (Jesus+Mahdi=Mirza)!!! come on!

 

[paarsurrey]

This Mirza is either delusional or a deceiver with a wicked plan. It's not about the name per se, the thing is, he is claiming to be Jesus and Mahdi incarnation (Jesus+Mahdi=Mirza)!!! come on!

Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad- the Promised Messiah+Imam Mahdi (as) had father named Mirza Ghulam Murtaza and mother named Chiragh Bibi .. He never claimed to be incarnation of anybody. Please quote from him if I am wrong.
Regards

 

[paarsurrey]

Lets hope that this will happen to all religions, after all they all need reviewing and some adjustment in one form or another.

This is connected with the advent of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, who is a reformer of all revealed religions.
He is a reformer of Hinduism:
"one such revelation addressing him was:

“ O Krishna slayer of swine, protector of cows, thy praise is recorded in the Gita. ”
— Lecture Sialkot[17]
In a lecture given in Sialkot in 1904 he declared that God had informed him that Krishna who had appeared among the Aryas thousands of years ago was indeed a prophet of God upon whom the Holy Spirit would descend from God but that later his teachings were corrupted and he began to be worshipped.[17] Here he claimed that he was the avatar whom the Hindus were awaiting in the latter days and that he had appeared in the likeness of Krishna invested with the same qualities.[2] and in his capacity as such he set out to explain and correct what he perceived to be the erroneous beliefs of the Hindus of his time such as the worship of many Gods and the transmigration of souls.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Claims_of_Mirza_Ghulam_Ahmad
Regards

 

[TashaN]

Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad- the Promised Messiah+Imam Mahdi (as) had father named Mirza Ghulam Murtaza and mother named Chiragh Bibi .. He never claimed to be incarnation of anybody. Please quote from him if I am wrong.
Regards

Dah! didn't he claim to be Jesus+Mahdi? if he wasn't their incarnation then what is it?

if you said "I'm Abraham Lincoln!!!", people will either think you are mentally ill or that you are joking. So which one is it? was he mentally ill, joking or just wanted to deceive people?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

There are already many reformers within Islam, and many Muslims, even in the Middle East, who are not ultra-Conservative about their beliefs.

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

Dah! didn't he claim to be Jesus+Mahdi? if he wasn't their incarnation then what is it?

If you're looking for an example of this then you might be interested in post #163 of the Muslim Reform movement thread.

 

[paarsurrey]

If you're looking for an example of this then you might be interested in post #163 of the Muslim Reform movement thread.

#163

So, there is no Jizya imposed, in any country of the world, these days. In other words in a sense, I believe, it confirms the truthful prophecy of Muhammad.

Narrated Abu Huraira(RA) that the Prophet of Allah(SAW) said:
By Him in Whose Hands my soul is, Son of Mary (Jesus) will shortly descend amongst you people (Muslims) as a just ruler and will break the Cross and kill the pig and abolish the Jizyah . Then there will be abundance of money and no one will accept charitable gifts.(Sahih Bukhari, Vol. 3, Book 34, No. 425)​

This also in a sense confirms, I believe, the claim of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad to be Messiah or Jesus son of Mary. Right?
Regards

 

[paarsurrey]

Dah! didn't he claim to be Jesus+Mahdi? if he wasn't their incarnation then what is it?
if you said "I'm Abraham Lincoln!!!", people will either think you are mentally ill or that you are joking. So which one is it? was he mentally ill, joking or just wanted to deceive people?

I said nothing like that. It was G-d saying and Muhammad prophesying about him (Mirza Ghulam Ahmad):

The Holy Quran : Chapter 24: Al-Nur
[24:56]Allah has promised to those among you who believe and do good works that He will surely make them Successors in the earth, as He made Successors from among those who were before them; and that He will surely establish for them their religion which He has chosen for them; and that He will surely give them in exchange security and peace after their fear: They will worship Me,and they will not associate anything with Me. Then whoso is ungrateful after that, they will be the rebellious.
http://www.alislam.org/quran/search2/showChapter.php?submitCh=Read+from+verse%3A&ch=24&verse=56​

Right? Please
Regards

 

[The_Fisher_King]

if you said "I'm Abraham Lincoln!!!", people will either think you are mentally ill or that you are joking. So which one is it? was he mentally ill, joking or just wanted to deceive people?

Salaam,
If I say 'I'm Abraham Lincoln', it's also possible that I am, and indeed that people might think that I am. Similarly, there's a fourth possibility in Mirza Ghulam Ahmad's case, that he was indeed 'Iesa/the Mahdi, or that he fulfilled the prophecies regarding the coming of 'Iesa and the Mahdi without actually being 'Iesa/the Mahdi (i.e. fulfilled them in a metaphorical sense, performed a similar role). There are parallels here with how Yahya (John the Baptist) is considered to have fulfilled the prophecies regarding the coming of Iliyaas (Elijah) in the biblical Book of Malachi. (I should say that I don't personally think that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad fulfilled the prophecies, but in principle he could have fulfilled them in this way)
Wassalaam

 

[paarsurrey]

TashaN said: ↑
if you said "I'm Abraham Lincoln!!!", people will either think you are mentally ill or that you are joking. So which one is it? was he mentally ill, joking or just wanted to deceive people?

Salaam,
If I say 'I'm Abraham Lincoln', it's also possible that I am, and indeed that people might think that I am. Similarly, there's a fourth possibility in Mirza Ghulam Ahmad's case, that he was indeed 'Iesa/the Mahdi, or that he fulfilled the prophecies regarding the coming of 'Iesa and the Mahdi without actually being 'Iesa/the Mahdi (i.e. fulfilled them in a metaphorical sense, performed a similar role). There are parallels here with how Yahya (John the Baptist) is considered to have fulfilled the prophecies regarding the coming of Iliyaas (Elijah) in the biblical Book of Malachi. (I should say that I don't personally think that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad fulfilled the prophecies, but in principle he could have fulfilled them in this way)
Wassalaam

Your argument is fantastic, I must say.
Thanks and regards

 

[The_Fisher_King]

TashaN said: ↑
if you said "I'm Abraham Lincoln!!!", people will either think you are mentally ill or that you are joking. So which one is it? was he mentally ill, joking or just wanted to deceive people?

Your argument is fantastic, I must say.
Thanks and regards

Thanks!

 

[paarsurrey]

#163
So, there is no Jizya imposed, in any country of the world, these days. In other words in a sense, I believe, it confirms the truthful prophecy of Muhammad.

Narrated Abu Huraira(RA) that the Prophet of Allah(SAW) said:
By Him in Whose Hands my soul is, Son of Mary (Jesus) will shortly descend amongst you people (Muslims) as a just ruler and will break the Cross and kill the pig and abolish the Jizyah . Then there will be abundance of money and no one will accept charitable gifts.(Sahih Bukhari, Vol. 3, Book 34, No. 425)​

This also in a sense confirms, I believe, the claim of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad to be Messiah or Jesus son of Mary. Right?
Regards

By giving many reasonable arguments from Bible, Quran, ancients books of medicine, ancient history, Buddhist sources that Jesus did not die on the Cross, Mirza Ghulam Ahmad brook the Cross- its myth.
This aspect of the above Sahih Hadith has also been fulfilled overwhelmingly.
Regards

 

[Tomorrows_Child]

There are always slight reformations in Islam, which benefit muslims and non muslims, it happens every few generations.

 

[paarsurrey]

There are always slight reformations in Islam, which benefit muslims and non muslims, it happens every few generations.

I agree with you. And it is very much in agreement with the Quran. One aspect of truth about is Islam is:

[14:25]Dost thou not see how Allah sets forth the similitude of a good word?It is like a good tree, whose root is firm and whose branches reach into heaven.
[14:26]It brings forth its fruit at all times by the command of its Lord. And Allah sets forth similitudes for men that they may reflect.
http://www.alislam.org/quran/search2/showChapter.php?ch=14&verse=25

With this peculiarity Quran becomes secure in its meaning also as it always has got a pristine and secure original text in Arabic languages, never got changed due to vagaries of time.
Regards

 

[paarsurrey]

There are always slight reformations in Islam, which benefit muslims and non muslims, it happens every few generations.

Further to post #158 where Quran mentions of reform, it is also mentioned in Hadith:
كتاب الملاحم39
Battles (Kitab Al-Malahim)(1587)Chapter: Description Of Happenings In Every Century
(1)
باب مَا يُذْكَرُ فِي قَرْنِ الْمِائَةِ

حَدَّثَنَا سُلَيْمَانُ بْنُ دَاوُدَ الْمَهْرِيُّ، أَخْبَرَنَا ابْنُ وَهْبٍ، أَخْبَرَنِي سَعِيدُ بْنُ أَبِي أَيُّوبَ، عَنْ شَرَاحِيلَ بْنِ يَزِيدَ الْمَعَافِرِيِّ، عَنْ أَبِي عَلْقَمَةَ، عَنْ أَبِي هُرَيْرَةَ، فِيمَا أَعْلَمُ عَنْ رَسُولِ اللَّهِ صلى الله عليه وسلم قَالَ ‏ "‏ إِنَّ اللَّهَ يَبْعَثُ لِهَذِهِ الأُمَّةِ عَلَى رَأْسِ كُلِّ مِائَةِ سَنَةٍ مَنْ يُجَدِّدُ لَهَا دِينَهَا ‏"‏ ‏.‏ قَالَ أَبُو دَاوُدَ رَوَاهُ عَبْدُ الرَّحْمَنِ بْنُ شُرَيْحٍ الإِسْكَنْدَرَانِيُّ لَمْ يَجُزْ بِهِ شَرَاحِيلَ ‏.‏
Narrated Abu Hurayrah:
The Prophet (ﷺ) said: Allah will raise for this community at the end of every hundred years the one who will renovate its religion for it.
Abu Dawud said: 'Abd al-Rahman bin Shuriah al-Iskandarani has also transmitted this tradition, but he did not exceed Shrahil.
http://sunnah.com/abudawud/39
So, there is a system of reformation in Islam autuorised from G-d and His truthful prophet Muhammad to bring Muslims on to the right path. Other religions don't have such a system.
Regards

 

[TashaN]

I said nothing like that. It was G-d saying and Muhammad prophesying about him (Mirza Ghulam Ahmad):

The Holy Quran : Chapter 24: Al-Nur
[24:56]Allah has promised to those among you who believe and do good works that He will surely make them Successors in the earth, as He made Successors from among those who were before them; and that He will surely establish for them their religion which He has chosen for them; and that He will surely give them in exchange security and peace after their fear: They will worship Me,and they will not associate anything with Me. Then whoso is ungrateful after that, they will be the rebellious.
http://www.alislam.org/quran/search2/showChapter.php?submitCh=Read+from+verse%3A&ch=24&verse=56​

Right? Please
Regards

lol, so this is your ultimate proof? successors? i think you can do much better than that. I thought you were going to bring a verse in the Quran which says and a Prophet after me whom his name would be Mirza Ghulam!!! or and we shall send them another prophet after you and his name is Mirza Ghulam who is going to be Jesus+mahdi miraculously.

Don't be upset, on the bright side, Mirza is not the only one who claimed to be a prophet nor the only one who claimed to be the mahdi.