Without Jesus Creation Isn’t Possible IMO

[Muffled]

You believe this, but the Bible doesn't support it.
There's also the issue Jehovah commanded multiple times to be fruitful and multiply. Paul explicitly contradicts that when he says it's best to be unmarried like him.

I believe we don't have to refrain from eating pork as well, so God will change things up if the need arises.

 

[Muffled]

Well, again, that's what you believe.
What do I believe? I don't think that Paul gave a hoot about what Jesus said or did..... He only ever mentioned the communion, execution and resurrection, you know, and nothing about Jesus the man.

I believe with the null hypothesis you have to show that it was necessary for Paul to say things about Jesus other than to preach the Gospel which is a comand for every Christian.

 

[Twilight Hue]

I believe Paul never did that.

Of course he did according to the story. That road to Damascus thing.

 

[oldbadger]

I believe with the null hypothesis you have to show that it was necessary for Paul to say things about Jesus other than to preach the Gospel which is a comand for every Christian.

Really?
So you think that Paul managed to write many letters to congregations, repeating the name and title of Jesus and the resurrection/communion over and over, (which every Christian certainly knew), but without a single mention of anything that Jesus has said or done at all?

 

[oldbadger]

Colossians 1:15-16
15 The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16 For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him.

Whatever did Paul really know about Jesus? !!

 

[Glaurung]

When some people try to use the New Testament to deny the Orthodox faith and argue for some other faith, they fail. They fail because the New Testament was not written by unitarians, modalists, or whatever. The New Testament was written by Orthodox Christians, so it comes from the Orthodox Church and nowhere else.

I have a degree of sympathy for Protestants in that not all Catholic/Orthodox doctrines are explicitly spelled out in Scripture, but I have no patience for Muslims, Baha'is and others who seek to convince Christians that the Church failed to understand the very books it canonized as inspired. It's really silly.

 

[mangalavara]

but I have no patience for Muslims, Baha'is and others who seek to convince Christians that the Church failed to understand the very books it canonized as inspired. It's really silly.

It really is silly, yes.

 

[Jimmy]

Whatever did Paul really know about Jesus? !!

More than you it seems

 

[oldbadger]

More than you it seems

OK.......so apart from his unceasing mentions of the communion-last meal and death-resurrection, please show me anything that he told his readers and what Jesus said or did during any part of his mission. Please quote him, ok?

Waiting..........

 

[Jimmy]

OK.......so apart from his unceasing mentions of the communion-last meal and death-resurrection, please show me anything that he told his readers and what Jesus said or did during any part of his mission. Please quote him, ok?

Waiting..........

“Very truly I tell you,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!”

So…

Colossians 1:15-16
15 The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16 For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him

 

[oldbadger]

“Very truly I tell you,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!”

So…

Colossians 1:15-16
15 The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16 For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him

Come on, Jimmy..... So apart from unceasing repetition about death-resurrection and last meal-communion Paul never did write one single account, story, anecdote about anything that Jesus ever said or did during his mission that Paul ever bothered to write about.

Paul had plenty of opportunities to remind the congregations about his healings, miraculous achievements, meetings, debates, incidents and more....... But nothing!

That's what I wrote in the first place.

 

[Jimmy]

Come on, Jimmy..... So apart from unceasing repetition about death-resurrection and last meal-communion Paul never did write one single account, story, anecdote about anything that Jesus ever said or did during his mission that Paul ever bothered to write about.

Paul had plenty of opportunities to remind the congregations about his healings, miraculous achievements, meetings, debates, incidents and more....... But nothing!

That's what I wrote in the first place.

He offered something new. Something people obviously needed to hear. Why repeat what has already been said? Kudos to him for trying to speak the truth without actually coming out and saying it.

 

[oldbadger]

He offered something new. Something people obviously needed to hear.

That doesn't work.
People obviously needed to hear about the days of Jesus during his mission but they got nothing from Paul.

Why repeat what has already been said?

That doesn't work. Every Christian everywhere had heard countless times about the communion/death/resurrection of Jesus or they would not have been Christians, but Paul mentioned those continuously.

Kudos to him for trying to speak the truth without actually coming out and saying it.

Paul just built his own church, own ideas, guidance, rules, laws and more. The church was Pauline.

 

[Jimmy]

That doesn't work.
People obviously needed to hear about the days of Jesus during his mission but they got nothing from Paul.

That doesn't work. Every Christian everywhere had heard countless times about the communion/death/resurrection of Jesus or they would not have been Christians, but Paul mentioned those continuously.

Paul just built his own church, own ideas, guidance, rules, laws and more. The church was Pauline.

Not everyone grasps the hidden mysteries of life that the Bible alludes to. Maybe science is more suited to your liking.

 

[oldbadger]

Not everyone grasps the hidden mysteries of life that the Bible alludes to. Maybe science is more suited to your liking.

Hidden mysteries indeed?!
But remember that the bible was written by men, not gods or angels.
The OT bible offered a way for an nation to survive and flourish, no mystery there.
But there's no mystery with the NT bible either..... A wonderful account about Jesus the man with mission that turned him in to a Lord, then a God and churches that took the story on from there.

 

[Muffled]

Of course he did according to the story. That road to Damascus thing.

I don't remember Paul ever saying he actually touched the body of Jesus. He saw a vision of Jesus which Jesus gave to him. No body was present.

 

[Muffled]

Really?
So you think that Paul managed to write many letters to congregations, repeating the name and title of Jesus and the resurrection/communion over and over, (which every Christian certainly knew), but without a single mention of anything that Jesus has said or done at all?

I believe that makes sense. Paul is led bythe Holy Spirit to say what needs to be said.

 

[Twilight Hue]

I don't remember Paul ever saying he actually touched the body of Jesus. He saw a vision of Jesus which Jesus gave to him. No body was present.

The apostles would never believe him because of Matthew 24:23 if the story was written properly.

 

[oldbadger]

I believe that makes sense. Paul is led bythe Holy Spirit to say what needs to be said.

So he claimed!

 

[oldbadger]

I don't remember Paul ever saying he actually touched the body of Jesus. He saw a vision of Jesus which Jesus gave to him.

So he claimed.

No body was present.

Now that bit is believable........ Nobody present.