world wide flood?

[Bunyip]

I wasn't talking about a biblical flood, But if you want to get in on that sure.

Obviously you must be referring to Genesis 7:19 - "And the waters prevailed exceedingly upon the earth; and all the high hills, that were under the whole heaven, were covered."

Okay so first we have to figure out how tall mountains/hills were back when Noah was alive, And then we have to figure out how much water was around back then. Obviously, they were different to what they are now.

And if the most likely is true, And mountains weren't as high back then and that there was more water then it's plausible for a biblical flood to have occurred. If not, Please provide evidence with links to sources. Otherwise, Anything you say is just opinion/belief and not fact.

Well obviously the mountains were about the same as they are now, mountain,ranges do not change much in a few thousand years.

 

[Desert Snake]

Yes that is correct, and that is exactly what we find. As you say, those top layers are not intact, there are just fragments.

False. I've personally seen whole shells, intact.

In fact, I was quite surprised, because I wasn't aware of this fact beforehand.

 

[Thana]

Otherwise, Anything you say is just opinion/belief and not fact.

Well obviously the mountains were about the same as they are now, mountain,ranges do not change much in a few thousand years.

Guess you decided to go with opinion/belief. Good choice.

 

[Bunyip]

False. I've personally seen whole shells, intact.

In fact, I was quite surprised, because I wasn't aware of this fact beforehand.

Layers mate, not shells.

I said that the sea bottom LAYER is not intact, not that the individual shells are all broken.

 

[Bunyip]

Guess you decided to go with opinion/belief. Good choice.

No, we can observe the rate of mountain growth, it does not change much over a few thousand years.

 

[Thana]

No, we can observe the rate of mountain growth, it does not change much over a few thousand years.

Mountains grow at a relatively fast rate (a few mm/year) until the forces that formed them are no longer active.
Even while they are growing, they are being cut down by the processes of erosion.

The Himalayas are still growing today after starting to grow about ten million years ago when India crashed into Asia

Dr. Fred Duennebier, Professor
Department of Geology and Geophysics

So apparently the mountains could have very plausibly been extremely different back in Noahs time.

Like I said, Either present some evidence that agrees with you and link sources, Otherwise anything you say is just your own opinion and has nothing to do with facts.

 

[kashmir]

I wasn't talking about a biblical flood, But if you want to get in on that sure.

Obviously you must be referring to Genesis 7:19 - "And the waters prevailed exceedingly upon the earth; and all the high hills, that were under the whole heaven, were covered."

Okay so first we have to figure out how tall mountains/hills were back when Noah was alive, And then we have to figure out how much water was around back then. Obviously, they were different to what they are now.

And if the most likely is true, And mountains weren't as high back then and that there was more water then it's plausible for a biblical flood to have occurred. If not, Please provide evidence with links to sources. Otherwise, Anything you say is just opinion/belief and not fact.

The way I see it, how can it even be disputable?
We have to assume God is real, to then assume the flood of Noah happened, so how could making extra water even be an issue for a deity who created the earth to begin with?

I am not saying it is all true, but never the less, if God is real, then the flood isn't nothing for him so there really is no debate on was there enough water or not.

To me that is like asking a pregnant woman if its hers or not.
Well she is preggy, it has to be hers.

 

[Desert Snake]

The way I see it, how can it even be disputable?
We have to assume God is real, to then assume the flood of Noah happened, so how could making extra water even be an issue for a deity who created the earth to begin with?

I am not saying it is all true, but never the less, if God is real, then the flood isn't nothing for him so there really is no debate on was there enough water or not.

The "faith" is on both sides. That's all. it's a religious argument.

 

[Bunyip]

So apparently the mountains could have very plausibly been extremely different back in Noahs time.

Like I said, Either present some evidence that agrees with you and link sources, Otherwise anything you say is just your own opinion and has nothing to do with facts.

He is talking about fast in geological terms, the change over just a few thousand years would still be insignificant. Read your citation - he is talking about a period of 10 million years, the change over a few thousad of those 10 million years it took the Himalayas to form would be tiny.

If you believe that mountains can grow infinitely faster than geologists think - you need to supply the evidence.

 

[Thana]

He is talking about fast in geological terms, the change over just a few thousand years would still be insignificant. Read your citation - he is talking about a period of 10 million years, the change over a few thousad of those 10 million years it took the Himalayas to form would be tiny.

If you believe that mountains can grow infinitely faster than geologists think - you need to supply the evidence.

You can not accurately and honestly say it's only been a few thousand years since Noah. Not even biblical scholars agree on that, But for some reason you think you know. Pfft.

 

[Bunyip]

You can not accurately and honestly say it's only been a few thousand years since Noah. Not even biblical scholars agree on that, But for some reason you think you know. Pfft.

Would you agree that it was some time over the last quarter of a million years?

Well you could place the story of Noah back to the very beginning of human occupation in that region, in fact you could take Noah back as far as the emergence of homo sapiens, it is still not enough to change the height of the Himalayas by very much.

 

[Thana]

Well you could place the story of Noah back to the very beginning of human occupation in that region, in fact you could take Noah back as far as the emergence of homo sapiens, it is still not enough to change the height of the Himalayas by very much.

Again you've proven how reluctant you are to give me any evidence or sources.

Your opinion means absolutely nothing. Thanks for playing though.

 

[Bunyip]

Again you've proven how reluctant you are to give me any evidence or sources.

Your opinion means absolutely nothing. Thanks for playing though.

All you have given are opinions, you gave a citation to a man that said the Himalayas took 10 million years to form - where in that last 10 million years do you place Noah?

Lets use YOUR source, the guy who said it took 10 million years - where do you place Noah?

 

[Thana]

All you have given are opinions, you gave a citation to a man that said the Himalayas took 10 million years to form - where in that last 10 million years do you place Noah?

Lets use YOUR source, the guy who said it took 10 million years - where do you place Noah?

Nope.

I've asked you three times, Give me some evidence.
I'm interested in facts, Not opinions.
And it seems that all you have is opinions, But no facts.

Talk to me when you have some evidence

 

[Bunyip]

Nope.

I've asked you three times, Give me some evidence.
I'm interested in facts, Not opinions.
And it seems that all you have is opinions, But no facts.

Talk to me when you have some evidence

Where is yours? You are the one blindly flying in the face of science, and the only citation you have given said that the himalayas took 10 MILLION YEARS TO FORM, and yet you use it to argue that the mountains were lower in Noah's time.

You disproved your own claim with a citation you clearly did not understand.

 

[Thana]

Where is yours? You are the one blindly flying in the face of science, and the only citation you have given said that the himalayas took 10 MILLION YEARS TO FORM, and yet you use it to argue that the mountains were lower in Noah's time.

You disproved your own claim with a citation you clearly did not understand.

Nope. Still not rising to your obvious distraction bait.

Bring some evidence to the table, Because I'm not saying anything more on the subject until you do.

 

[Bunyip]

Nope. Still not rising to your obvious distraction bait.

Bring some evidence to the table, Because I'm not saying anything more on the subject until you do.

YOUR CITATION shows that mountains do not grow fast enough. So to defeat your position that the mountains were not as high back in Noah's day, I refer you to your own citation.

I am unsurprised that you are unwilling to say more on the subject, given that you defeated your own position - and supplied a citation to prove it.


10 million years huh?

 

[kashmir]

The "faith" is on both sides. That's all. it's a religious argument.

I just cant see an argument in "if there was enough water or not"
If a deity is capable of creating everything, how would making extra water be even a debate?
The debate would be does God exist?
After that, everything else falls into place.
If a person doesn't believe a deity created everything, then nothing else is even debatable for them and cant be.
Its like I said before, it becomes like debating cartoons...
"why does the Coyote keep falling off cliffs and living?

But if a person believes in God, then its not even a debate if there was enough water or not to flood the earth.
Then its like, well he had the power to make the earth, but does he have the power to make water?

In both arguments its redundant.

Debating the flood is almost redundant too, because perhaps he flooded the earth, drained it back to normal or its more of a parable.

My opinion on that is that there was a global flood, simply because of the ice age, its without question, that is scientific fact.
So at this point, the flood of noah isnt important enough to know if its true or not.
I deem it as important as knowing the color of Jesus's eyes.

 

[Pegg]

Do you have any examples of evidence for the flood of Noah...?

one particular line of evidence that i think is intriguing is the fact that in all cultures there is a very similar flood legend. The characters change somewhat, but the circumstances are almost always the same.

What could have motivated so many diverse and geographically alienated people from telling the same story?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I was not trying to come off as knowing everything, was just trying to spark debate, so we can learn from each other.

Whatever. Just realize that you've been making statements that, AFAICT, you have no rational basis for.

As for the ice age, it could very well account for the global flood.
If the world was covered in ice, and it all melted, the world would be covered in water until it drained off and precipitated, right?

Wrong.

The world we're living in now is the world where the ice from the Ice Age melted. During the Ice Age, sea levels were lower than they were now. This caused things like the Alaskan land bridge (the thing that allowed the ancestors of today's Native Americans to migrate to the Americas from Asia). The ice eventually melted and the sea levels rose.... to where they are today.

There is not enough water in all the ice on Earth to cover the entire surface.