Would you Lie?

[columbus]

What the hell is that supposed to mean in context to this thread???


*

Sorry
RF doesn't work on my phone anymore. It posted I fixed the stupid parts
I will try again later

Tom

 

[Thana]

If it is already a given that you believe in god (or don't or whatever your position may be) and you know someone who is seeking answers and have not yet been convinced to join your side (which to reiterate you believe to be correct), would you lie to them about a situation or event in order to push them in the 'right' direction to believe?

If you were a Christian would you every lie about an experience with god to help someone else get through a troubling time in their faith? If you knew that would assist them in staying in the faith?

Nope, And I'm a Christian (Shock and awe apparently at not wanting to convert everyone I lay eyes on)

Either you're called, and you will be convinced at some point by God, not man, Or you're not and you won't be convinced. Either way, It's not up too me and I certainly wouldn't lie, Which would be risking my relationship with Him and my own spiritual path, Just to try and convert someone. What would be the point? It's a chasing after the wind, Unless God specifically puts in on your heart to do so, You'd be wasting your time.

 

[Monk Of Reason]

Nope, And I'm a Christian (Shock and awe apparently at not wanting to convert everyone I lay eyes on)

Either you're called, and you will be convinced at some point by God, not man, Or you're not and you won't be convinced. Either way, It's not up too me and I certainly wouldn't lie, Which would be risking my relationship with Him and my own spiritual path, Just to try and convert someone. What would be the point? It's a chasing after the wind, Unless God specifically puts in on your heart to do so, You'd be wasting your time.

I was hoping someone would have some kind of internal moral struggle with this question but it seems not. The thread has been unanimous.

Either way I only used the Christian example as an example. I am sure there are people who would lie to get an atheist view across if they felt that religion was harmful to someone. Or that a mother may give a little white lie to her children in order to put the fear of god in them. Ect. I wasn't singling out Christians as liars or anything.

 

[gnostic]

If your wife ask you, if she looks fat in this dress, what would you say?

 

[Monk Of Reason]

If your wife ask you, if she looks fat in this dress, what would you say?

"No more than usual" is my normal response. But my wife weighs like...110 so... she doesn't look fat in anything.

 

[Ingledsva]

If your wife ask you, if she looks fat in this dress, what would you say?

If she actually did look squished into it. I would say something like -

"That dress just doesn't do you justice. You looked great in that A-line little black dress you wore last week."

There is no reason to be mean to people by being blunt. There is always better "wording."

*

 

[Tiapan]

Real Science doesn't need to lie.

 

[Renji]

If it is already a given that you believe in god (or don't or whatever your position may be) and you know someone who is seeking answers and have not yet been convinced to join your side (which to reiterate you believe to be correct), would you lie to them about a situation or event in order to push them in the 'right' direction to believe?

Why should I lie just to convince people? Atheism isn't a 'religion' where one should be pushed to, else something bad will happen to them or stuff like that. It's a choice. Besides, how can I distort the 'reality' of science; of facts without having any 'holes' in it?

 

[George-ananda]

If your wife ask you, if she looks fat in this dress, what would you say?

I hate to say it but 'Yes' you do. I cannot lie.


(I've been divorced twice)

 

[LegionOnomaMoi]

If it is already a given that you believe in god (or don't or whatever your position may be) and you know someone who is seeking answers and have not yet been convinced to join your side (which to reiterate you believe to be correct), would you lie to them about a situation or event in order to push them in the 'right' direction to believe?

If you were a Christian would you every lie about an experience with god to help someone else get through a troubling time in their faith? If you knew that would assist them in staying in the faith?

"I would not snare even an orc with a falsehood"
-Tolkien

 

[chinu]

" fraud master fraud disciple, hell to hellish jostle bustle "

 

[DawudTalut]

If it is already a given that you believe in god (or don't or whatever your position may be) and you know someone who is seeking answers and have not yet been convinced to join your side (which to reiterate you believe to be correct), would you lie to them about a situation or event in order to push them in the 'right' direction to believe?
.......................

No.

Holy Quran
[ch3:v95] Now whoso forges a lie against Allah after this, then it is these that are the wrongdoers.
alislam.org/quran

 

[fantome profane]

If it is already a given that you believe in god (or don't or whatever your position may be) and you know someone who is seeking answers and have not yet been convinced to join your side (which to reiterate you believe to be correct), would you lie to them about a situation or event in order to push them in the 'right' direction to believe?

If you were a Christian would you every lie about an experience with god to help someone else get through a troubling time in their faith? If you knew that would assist them in staying in the faith?

The problem with this kind of question is that you are going to get the same answer from people who would lie, and from people who would not lie.

Those who would not lie will tell you the truth and say "I would never lie".

Those who would lie will lie and tell say "I would never lie".

 

[Smart_Guy]

...would you lie to them about a situation or event in order to push them in the 'right' direction to believe?

I'm Muslim, and my answer is no. I'd never lie to guide to the right. Imagine some time they find out I was lying to them! It could give the exact opposite result.

Besides, lying in Islam is not allowed for such a thing.

It is unfortunate that some Muslims lie thinking they are doing Islam good. Lies like that Makkah is the center of the world are lowly tricks. I honestly cannot tell if that was an honest lie from a real Muslims or it was by a hater trying to give the impression they were Muslims so one day the trick get exposed and they have their laugh.

Lying sucks

 

[Sabour]

I hate to say it but 'Yes' you do. I cannot lie.


(I've been divorced twice)

It is good that you know the reason, lol.

 

[Sabour]

If it is already a given that you believe in god (or don't or whatever your position may be) and you know someone who is seeking answers and have not yet been convinced to join your side (which to reiterate you believe to be correct), would you lie to them about a situation or event in order to push them in the 'right' direction to believe?

If you were a Christian would you every lie about an experience with god to help someone else get through a troubling time in their faith? If you knew that would assist them in staying in the faith?

Do you think that those who lie about it would come and say yes we do ? I would be surprised if someone did.

 

[Monk Of Reason]

Do you think that those who lie about it would come and say yes we do ? I would be surprised if someone did.

It really wouldn't be helpful to the debate. I don't think anyone would lie here and if they did then it wouldn't really matter. The whole point of the debate was something like the blindfold experiment. If you saw someone walking towards a cliff blindfolded and you told them they were about to walk off a cliff and they didn't believe you, would you tell a lie to advert them from the path to their death?

It would be a similar situation for a religious individual who has an atheist or alternative theistic loved one whom they feel is on the path to hell. Eternal suffering and damnation would be a terrible thing to suffer through and if it saves them that suffering wouldn't it be worth it just to tell them a little white lie? The most common construct would be a parent to a child or some such thing.

Then I was hoping that the debate would evolve, at least partially, into how "ominous" hell really is in people's beliefs. I have no problem saying I would lie to my wife if she was walking towards a cliff but I would not lie to get her to convert to any religion. But I don't believe that my wife will be damned for all eternity if she is not converted. If I did then that might be a concern for me. And if it isn't a concern for religious people isn't that concerning in and of itself?

 

[Sabour]

It really wouldn't be helpful to the debate. I don't think anyone would lie here and if they did then it wouldn't really matter. The whole point of the debate was something like the blindfold experiment. If you saw someone walking towards a cliff blindfolded and you told them they were about to walk off a cliff and they didn't believe you, would you tell a lie to advert them from the path to their death?

It would be a similar situation for a religious individual who has an atheist or alternative theistic loved one whom they feel is on the path to hell. Eternal suffering and damnation would be a terrible thing to suffer through and if it saves them that suffering wouldn't it be worth it just to tell them a little white lie? The most common construct would be a parent to a child or some such thing.

Then I was hoping that the debate would evolve, at least partially, into how "ominous" hell really is in people's beliefs. I have no problem saying I would lie to my wife if she was walking towards a cliff but I would not lie to get her to convert to any religion. But I don't believe that my wife will be damned for all eternity if she is not converted. If I did then that might be a concern for me. And if it isn't a concern for religious people isn't that concerning in and of itself?

I am sure that if you included your first paragraph in the OP than many people would have said Yes instead of saying NO. Many times people take things at face value and don't take time to think deeply about it. Same applies for your last sentence.

As I understood from your last sentence is that if you are not prepared to lie a white lie for your beliefs, than why would you think that your beliefs are important. Is that what you tried to say?

Well as a muslim, Islam is the most important thing in my life and I see Islam as the true path that every one should follow. However part of the meaning of Islam is being sincere. So not only on that embraces Islam should be sincere, but all muslims should be. The reason I don't lie about Islam is because Islam is from Allah and Allah is perfect therefore it is perfect. If I am to lie and change something about the facts than it won't be perfect and errors in Islam would start to appear because I added or changed something and I am human. My point is even if someone viewed something about Islam as not making sense, I believe that there will come a day when he will find that this thing actually makes sense. However if I were to lie to please someone and say that what he thinks is already part of Islam, than the result would be pleasing at the moment I lied only because either he will find that I was lying or he would change his position about that after having deep thoughts.

If I were asked by my wife if she looks fight I would lie. It is a white lie.

If my children were in danger, I would lie because I know better and I know what is good for my kids and what is not.

If we were in a war I would lie to the enemy.

However I won't ever lie about Islam. Sincerity is integral part of Islam.

 

[sojourner]

If it is already a given that you believe in god (or don't or whatever your position may be) and you know someone who is seeking answers and have not yet been convinced to join your side (which to reiterate you believe to be correct), would you lie to them about a situation or event in order to push them in the 'right' direction to believe?

If you were a Christian would you every lie about an experience with god to help someone else get through a troubling time in their faith? If you knew that would assist them in staying in the faith?

I've been dealing professionally with people in spiritual and emotional crisis for 14 years. I've never, ever had a situation arise in which I felt that lying to them would help/be advisable.

 

[Monk Of Reason]

I've been dealing professionally with people in spiritual and emotional crisis for 14 years. I've never, ever had a situation arise in which I felt that lying to them would help/be advisable.

Which is why its a hypothetical. If you felt it would be advisable would you do it?