You didn't choose what you believe.

[Renji]

You're really saying that you think you could simply choose to believe that it isn't possible to choose what you believe? Just consider that for a moment.

Yes, 200%.

We're not talking decisions or actions, only beliefs.

How can you make such decisions and actions without choosing?

 

[fred williams]

Belief is what your heart believes
There is only one true belief
with eternal rewards
examine all the supposed gods
what did any of them do for man?
Then examine Jesus Christ who claimed he and the Father in heaven are one
He then went to Calvary and died and via his spilt innocent blood paid in full all mankinds sin debt
thus anyone can be saved just by changing their mind and believing in Jesus Christ
That's all he asks, that you just believe in His as your Messiah and He promises to save you.
His plan of salvation is so simple and easy the educated and wise and smart know it all's ,reject this plan outright.
Why? because man have a desire to earn their salvation via there own works as the Catholic religion teaches
But Jesus plan is all one sided ,He did everything for us, the only thing we have to do is believe in Him
Jesus made it so easy to be saved, that most reject it . He even promises if you believe in Him it then becomes His responsibility
from that moment on to safeguard your path to eternity in other words once you believe you can then never be rejected by Him and further
it becomes His duty from then on to keep you saved, and he can never reject you, once you believe sin can never interfere with you anymore.
as He paid the debt of all believers thus they can never be rejected. because they are no longer under the Moses law of the 10 Commandment,
But are removed from the law to Grace and under Grace there is no such thing as sin, as they are now called "evil works" of which there is no penalty
see 1 Cor 3;15.
those false teachers that threaten you with loss of salvation are the wicked just trying to lead you astray. Once saved Always Saved.
When you believe Heb 4;12 says the Holy Spirit examines your belief if true, He then cuts you spiritually into three separate parts, body soul , and spirit
you are then forever united with Jesus you can never be separated from then on by God, as at that moment you believed the Holy Spirit examined you and saw your whole life to your last breath so you can never do anything that would surprise God.

 

[Desert Snake]

I sincerely believe that nobody chooses to believe what they believe regarding religion and gods. How can you choose to believe something that ultimately boils down to what arguments and/or tradition your mind accepts as true?

If free will exists, I certainly believe that is exists much moreso in the ability to choose one's actions, than it does regarding what one considers true. In my opinion the mind is much more shaped by what a person experiences than a conscious choice to map a specific mindset. Nobody chooses what sorts of arguments will be the most persuasive to their mind, and therefore nobody chooses what beliefs they will hold, given that beliefs, especially in the realm of the non universally knowable, are subject to whatever justifying arguments satisfy the gieven mind the most.

Freedom to choose belief is central to many of the major religious stances, as the most popular gods seem to favor beliefs at at least the same level as what a person's deeds are. This is probably the ultimate reason why I dismiss the major theologies. If a person cannot choose what they believe, then it is completely unjust to judge them upon what they do believe.

Somebody put forth the best counter argument. Because I've never heard a good one.

Yep, this is also why people do not choose to be atheists.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

At the Quaker group I used to attend there was a retired vicar who had become an atheist. He was always a little vague about what point in his career this conversion had occurred though.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

People "believe" what seems correct to them. I've always been puzzled how so many people see belief as an action, and not a result, as it actually is.

As an exercise, it becomes clear that we cannot simply choose to believe something when presented with the decision to believe something that we cannot find true. As an example, if I say that there's an invisible dragon on my shoulder who tells me what to do, it is unlikely that I will find anyone who can decide to believe that what I say is true, and then actually, sincerely believe my claim.

Now, I think people can, over time, prime themselves for a belief through a method of cognitive behavioral modification, but it is not an instantaneous decision, and it still comes down to, eventually, the claim of belief resonating as true to them.

 

[A Vestigial Mote]

I have supposed, or thought on in the past that the linearity of time alone nearly negates "free will". There is a choice to be made - and you WILL choose, and from that moment forward there is no going back. Did you really have the "freedom" to make the choice then - truly? In the single line of marching time you chose what you WERE GOING TO CHOOSE - that was the only way it could have been because you only get one shot. Your choice was THE CHOICE that was able to be made - no other is able to be made within that exact same time-frame and under those same conditions. There is nearly no difference between this notion and "destiny". You make a choice and it is done - for all time thereafter that was THE ONLY CHOICE THAT COULD HAVE BEEN MADE.

 

[Thief]

I sincerely believe that nobody chooses to believe what they believe regarding religion and gods. How can you choose to believe something that ultimately boils down to what arguments and/or tradition your mind accepts as true?

If free will exists, I certainly believe that is exists much moreso in the ability to choose one's actions, than it does regarding what one considers true. In my opinion the mind is much more shaped by what a person experiences than a conscious choice to map a specific mindset. Nobody chooses what sorts of arguments will be the most persuasive to their mind, and therefore nobody chooses what beliefs they will hold, given that beliefs, especially in the realm of the non universally knowable, are subject to whatever justifying arguments satisfy the gieven mind the most.

Freedom to choose belief is central to many of the major religious stances, as the most popular gods seem to favor beliefs at at least the same level as what a person's deeds are. This is probably the ultimate reason why I dismiss the major theologies. If a person cannot choose what they believe, then it is completely unjust to judge them upon what they do believe.

Somebody put forth the best counter argument. Because I've never heard a good one.

I am a rogue theologian.
I chose this manner of believing.
I have no religion.
I believe in God.

 

[Politesse]

I think there are choices one can make within the scope of religion. But I also see faith as a conversation; the believer is involved, but so too are their family, their culture, and presumably the gods and spirits themselves. To a large degree we "believe" in the world that is presented to us. Most seldom question their worldview, and those that do have a limited capacity to actually break "free" of their first moorings; every social rule carries an implied opposite, and most oppositional identities - like atheism, Satanism or Paganism in my society- are rife through with elements that are more so reversals of Christianity than independently invented traditions. Have been thinking about this a lot as my circle gears up for Samhain, but also gets its kids ready for "Halloween"... Makes it funny for me, consciously sitting between two traditions, when they are trying to portray themselves somewhat questionably as oppositions.

I have never been convinced of the existence of "free" choices- all human decisions are constrained by history, circumstance, and expectation.

 

[Eliab ben Benjamin]

I chose to follow the one i was born into after a doctorate in Comparative Religions.

I found a clear set of rules and code of conduct preferable to faith and someone else
taking responsibility for my actions