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Your least favorite Scripture
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dfnj
Well-Known Member
There are so many:
No. 1:St Paul’s advice about whether women are allowed to teach men in church:
“I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent.” (1 Timothy 2:12)
No. 2: In this verse, Samuel, one of the early leaders of Israel, orders genocide against a neighbouring people:
“This is what the Lord Almighty says... ‘Now go and strike Amalek and devote to destruction all that they have. Do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.’” (1 Samuel 15:3)
No. 3: A command of Moses:
“Do not allow a sorceress to live.” (Exodus 22:18)
No. 4: The ending of Psalm 137, a psalm which was made into a disco calypso hit by Boney M, is often omitted from readings in church:
“Happy is he who repays you for what you have done to us – he who seizes your infants and dashes them against the rocks.” (Psalm 137:9)
No. 5: Another blood-curdling tale from the Book of Judges, where an Israelite man is trapped in a house by a hostile crowd, and sends out his concubine to placate them:
“So the man took his concubine and sent her outside to them, and they raped her and abused her throughout the night, and at dawn they let her go. At daybreak the woman went back to the house where her master was staying, fell down at the door and lay there until daylight. When her master got up in the morning and opened the door of the house and stepped out to continue on his way, there lay his concubine, fallen in the doorway of the house, with her hands on the threshold. He said to her, ‘Get up; let’s go.’ But there was no answer. Then the man put her on his donkey and set out for home.” (Judges 19:25-28)
No. 6: St Paul condemns homosexuality in the opening chapter of the Book of Romans:
“In the same way also the men, giving up natural intercourse with women, were consumed with passion for one another. Men committed shameless acts with men and received in their own persons the due penalty for their error.” (Romans 1:27)
No. 7: In this story from the Book of Judges, an Israelite leader, Jephthah, makes a rash vow to God, which has to be carried out:
“And Jephthah made a vow to the Lord, and said, ‘If you will give the Ammonites into my hand, then whoever comes out of the doors of my house to meet me, when I return victorious from the Ammonites, shall be the Lord’s, to be offered up by me as a burnt-offering.’ Then Jephthah came to his home at Mizpah; and there was his daughter coming out to meet him with timbrels and with dancing. She was his only child; he had no son or daughter except her. When he saw her, he tore his clothes, and said, ‘Alas, my daughter! You have brought me very low; you have become the cause of great trouble to me. For I have opened my mouth to the Lord, and I cannot take back my vow.’” (Judges 11:30-1, 34-5)
No. 8: The Lord is speaking to Abraham in this story where God commands him to sacrifice his son:
‘Take your son, your only son Isaac, whom you love, and go to the land of Moriah, and offer him there as a burnt-offering on one of the mountains that I shall show you.’ (Genesis 22:2)
No. 9: “Wives, submit to your husbands as to the Lord.” (Ephesians 5:22)
No. 10: “Slaves, submit yourselves to your masters with all respect, not only to the good and gentle but also to the cruel.” (1 Peter 2:18)
No. 1:St Paul’s advice about whether women are allowed to teach men in church:
“I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent.” (1 Timothy 2:12)
No. 2: In this verse, Samuel, one of the early leaders of Israel, orders genocide against a neighbouring people:
“This is what the Lord Almighty says... ‘Now go and strike Amalek and devote to destruction all that they have. Do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.’” (1 Samuel 15:3)
No. 3: A command of Moses:
“Do not allow a sorceress to live.” (Exodus 22:18)
No. 4: The ending of Psalm 137, a psalm which was made into a disco calypso hit by Boney M, is often omitted from readings in church:
“Happy is he who repays you for what you have done to us – he who seizes your infants and dashes them against the rocks.” (Psalm 137:9)
No. 5: Another blood-curdling tale from the Book of Judges, where an Israelite man is trapped in a house by a hostile crowd, and sends out his concubine to placate them:
“So the man took his concubine and sent her outside to them, and they raped her and abused her throughout the night, and at dawn they let her go. At daybreak the woman went back to the house where her master was staying, fell down at the door and lay there until daylight. When her master got up in the morning and opened the door of the house and stepped out to continue on his way, there lay his concubine, fallen in the doorway of the house, with her hands on the threshold. He said to her, ‘Get up; let’s go.’ But there was no answer. Then the man put her on his donkey and set out for home.” (Judges 19:25-28)
No. 6: St Paul condemns homosexuality in the opening chapter of the Book of Romans:
“In the same way also the men, giving up natural intercourse with women, were consumed with passion for one another. Men committed shameless acts with men and received in their own persons the due penalty for their error.” (Romans 1:27)
No. 7: In this story from the Book of Judges, an Israelite leader, Jephthah, makes a rash vow to God, which has to be carried out:
“And Jephthah made a vow to the Lord, and said, ‘If you will give the Ammonites into my hand, then whoever comes out of the doors of my house to meet me, when I return victorious from the Ammonites, shall be the Lord’s, to be offered up by me as a burnt-offering.’ Then Jephthah came to his home at Mizpah; and there was his daughter coming out to meet him with timbrels and with dancing. She was his only child; he had no son or daughter except her. When he saw her, he tore his clothes, and said, ‘Alas, my daughter! You have brought me very low; you have become the cause of great trouble to me. For I have opened my mouth to the Lord, and I cannot take back my vow.’” (Judges 11:30-1, 34-5)
No. 8: The Lord is speaking to Abraham in this story where God commands him to sacrifice his son:
‘Take your son, your only son Isaac, whom you love, and go to the land of Moriah, and offer him there as a burnt-offering on one of the mountains that I shall show you.’ (Genesis 22:2)
No. 9: “Wives, submit to your husbands as to the Lord.” (Ephesians 5:22)
No. 10: “Slaves, submit yourselves to your masters with all respect, not only to the good and gentle but also to the cruel.” (1 Peter 2:18)
dfnj
Well-Known Member
I think the Bible should be read as a metaphor for religion not to be taken out of the historical context in which is was written by men. The essential message is morality is important.
What really disturbs me about the Bible is all the authoritarianism and obeying of authority. It just seems to me an omnipotent God would not require us to lick his feet as we grovel on our hands and knees. No parent treats their children like slaves. And the ones that do are usually murdered by their children.
I just think God needs nothing from us. Where as King James wants people to worship the King as if he is God on Earth which is what the Bible is really all about. It's propaganda for monarchy as form of government pretending monarchy is somehow a divine construct. It's just insanity.
Yeah, I used to feel that way, too. I mean, how can you tie that in with ,"God is love", right?
What I didn't understand was, death is only RIPing, likened to sleep (John 11:11-14), and these ones will be resurrected!! They will be given life again!
John 5:28-29; Acts of the Apostles 24:15.
And I bet when they come back, they'll remember how important obedience is!
Just my thoughts. Take care.
dfnj
Well-Known Member
Do not dismiss modern psychology. Modern psychology metaphorically can put a man on the moon nowadays. People and their motivations are very well understood. The government's propaganda machine knows exactly how to play the American people to a T:
The American people are a bunch of tools.
dfnj
Well-Known Member
RE: "Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, 29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation."
Everyone does evil. Just existing is evil. It's impossible to go through life without committing sins. This is why I have faith in an omnipotent God of unconditional love who lets everything through the gates of heaven to experience eternally heavenly bliss regardless of our earthly sins. This way I do not have to pay money to the church for my absolution. I just don't accept salvation comes from people who are pretending to speak for God. Nobody knows the mind of God. So I choose to have faith in the best possible God I can imagine. And that God is one of unconditional love. Sin and considering someone to be "evil" are conditions based on human perspective judgments.
Grandliseur
Well-Known Member
I thought I might have about two or three, but can only think of one right now. The one which early Christians found helpful is for modern times less than useless. It is the one about things will happen in this generation.
Matthew 23:36:
Truly, I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation.
Scripture defines one generation as 40 years in one place. Thus for people living now, there is no way of determining who and when.Truly, I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation.
dfnj
Well-Known Member
Maybe the word "generation" needs to be read like "man" meaning every man. In other words every generation all things will come upon.
dfnj
Well-Known Member
This is just wrong:
"And the king said unto her, What aileth thee? And she answered, This woman said unto me, Give thy son, that we may eat him to day, and we will eat my son to morrow. So we boiled my son, and did eat him: and I said unto her on the next day, Give thy son, that we may eat him: and she hath hid her son...." (II Kings 6:28-29)
"And the king said unto her, What aileth thee? And she answered, This woman said unto me, Give thy son, that we may eat him to day, and we will eat my son to morrow. So we boiled my son, and did eat him: and I said unto her on the next day, Give thy son, that we may eat him: and she hath hid her son...." (II Kings 6:28-29)
Grandliseur
Well-Known Member
I think the problem also is connected to the way prophesies are working in the Bible. It is common to have a primary and a secondary fulfillment, but that gives problems down the road for the conditions that appear in the first may not be found in the second round. The reader must then discern what can and cannot be expected, which is hard for us to do in this case since every Christian has wanted Christ's second coming since 2000 or so years ago.
There are other areas where I would like things to be more specific, but what is - is, what isn't - is not. We have to work with what was given and avoid complaining about things. After all, we were told that Christ wouldn't return until long time after his resurrection.
What God did in Job.
dfnj
Well-Known Member
As soon as Christians stop wanting the second coming and live their lives according to his teachings the spirit of Christ will show up again. But people love war too much to accept Christ's teachings into their hearts.
siti
Well-Known Member
Would you recommend this procedure for child training? Deuteronomy 21:18-21.
Grandliseur
Well-Known Member
Ain't that the truth !
I have even come to a point where in some areas I no longer know exactly what his teachings are, but I won't tell you where and what !
Ancient Literature - Gilgamesh.
Bible - Psalms
Baha'i writings - 'Seven Valleys and Four valleys,' and the 'Hidden Words.'
Bible - Psalms
Baha'i writings - 'Seven Valleys and Four valleys,' and the 'Hidden Words.'
Grandliseur
Well-Known Member
Actually, in some cases, I might.
There surely are cases where young ones have committed crimes where if they had been put out of their misery by those who knew about their evil tendencies, society might have been spared a lot of grief. But, in modern society the subject is complex since some of these also were bullied to an extend that caused their 'insanity.' In such cases, it would be nice to have the 'finger of God,' so to say, pointing out to us the ones who needed to be culled, but we don't have that.
dfnj
Well-Known Member
Gilgamesh! Gilgamesh was a man's man:
"GILGAMESH went abroad in the world, but he met with none who could withstand his arms till be came to Uruk. But the men of Uruk muttered in their houses, ‘Gilgamesh sounds the tocsin for his amusement, his arrogance has no bounds by day or night. No son is left with his father, for Gilgamesh takes them all, even the children; yet the king should be a shepherd to his people. His lust leaves no virgin to her lover, neither the warrior's daughter nor the wife of the noble; yet this is the shepherd of the city, wise, comely, and resolute.'"
His lust leaves no virgin to her lover!
Grandliseur
Well-Known Member
You never got an explanation for why this was permitted?! If you did get an explanation, what was its main points?
No. Neither did I.