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Your Religious Attitude Toward Nudity and Sex

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Because the Buddha no longer felt sexual desire after his enlightenment. He'd overcome being enslaved to all the faculties. In the Dharmic religions, there are practices where one can learn to see sexual actions as attachment or craving, and may reach the point of giving them up. Not everyone reaches such a level.
I think I have the wrong religion, I would probably feel more at home as a Buddhist. :rolleyes:

To be honest, once I really got back into focusing on God and the Baha'i Faith, I lost all desire for sex. I thought about it at first but I considered it an attachment and not something I wanted to have anymore. Eventually I stopped thinking about it altogether, except when people talk about it on forums, and then it is all in fun. I can remember how free I felt at first because sex had been like a monkey on my back for many years, almost an obsession.

After I became free of it that just got to be who I was. Some people say I am in denial or repressed but they clearly do not understand. It is as if I cannot even understand how I ever lived the way I did before, almost like an alcoholic feels in retrospect. I have never missed it and I have been much happier ever since, even though I still have problems in life. :eek:

I doubt very many Baha'is are like me, from the way they talk. ;) There are no prohibitions on sex for married couples; it is all a matter of choice, and it is very personal. I would never judge anyone else, I just do not want to be that person anymore, and it was best to make a clean break. But I am that way about everything in the material world; I seek detachment, except from the cats who need me... :D
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Jesus gave the rules of the Christian religion in 40 commandments at the Sermon On The Mount
After Jesus’ death, the Apostle Paul wrote a series of letters to his churches in which he explained Jesus ministry.
Jesus commanded that there be no sex outside of marriage in any form whatsoever
No masturbation. No lustful thoughts. Nothing.
As Jesus is God he knows exactly how impossible that is for you
So IF you live by his 40 commandments to the best of your ability then he will forgive your failures
Intention will carry the day.
It is not impossible to do. People just convince themselves it is impossible. There really is no reason people cannot limit sexual behavior to marriage, except that they do not want to. As for the lustful thoughts, when one is focused on God those just go away.

My religion, the Baha'i Faith, teaches exactly what Jesus taught about sexual behavior. The standards are high, but not too high for those who put God above self.
 

Skwim

Veteran Member
Jesus commanded that there be no sex outside of marriage in any form whatsoever
No masturbation. No lustful thoughts. Nothing.
As Jesus is God he knows exactly how impossible that is for you
Jesus says one shouldn't masturbate? Boy, I don't remember that at all. What do you have for a chapter and verse?

Thinking about it, I don't remember masturbation being condemned anywhere in the Bible.

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Srivijaya

Active Member
For a couple of days now there's been an on going debate about children viewing pornography (See HERE). The issue was raise by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints as a video telling children what to do if they should happen upon pornography, which they described as "bad pictures of people with little or no clothes on."

This brought to mind the following questions: How does your religion handle nudity/partial nudity and sexual subjects, if it handles them at all? And if it doesn't, what have you gained from your religious upbringing to be the proper way to regard them?


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All these posts on sexual topics Skwim... god's gonna make you go blind - you do know that don't ya?
 

sandy whitelinger

Veteran Member
For a couple of days now there's been an on going debate about children viewing pornography (See HERE). The issue was raise by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints as a video telling children what to do if they should happen upon pornography, which they described as "bad pictures of people with little or no clothes on."

This brought to mind the following questions: How does your religion handle nudity/partial nudity and sexual subjects, if it handles them at all? And if it doesn't, what have you gained from your religious upbringing to be the proper way to regard them?


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We require clothing at our church.
 

Tumah

Veteran Member
In Judaism, I think you will find that the more holy or important that a thing is, the more it is hidden or restricted. The Torah scroll is covered by a cloth, then placed in the ark that has at least two coverings (eg. a curtain and a door). In the Temple, the deeper in, the more one was restricted from entering and the more barriers, doors and curtains one must pass. The kabbalistic tradition, is almost completely hidden from the public with only the most topical or cryptic texts available to those not initiated into it.

Intercourse is, I would say, the entire basis of Judaism. Practically everything we do can be traced back to the concept of the relationship between masculine and feminine archetypes. That being so, sex as the most physically expressed form of this intercourse is likewise understood to be the holiest and most important of our endeavors. As a physical parallel to all our religious services, it and anything related to it consequently needs to be carried out with a certain degree of restriction or reverence.
Practically, that means we need to dress modestly and perform the act under some restrictions. We don't expose our children to nudity or sexual conduct until they're mentally mature enough to approach the subject with some reverence. Nor do we expose ourselves to nudity or sexual conduct that is not performed with an adequate degree of reverence and holiness, so as not to diminish the sanctity or animalize the act in our minds.
At the same time, so long as the framework is adequate, we are exposed to the subject. There's an entire tractate on the Laws of menstruating women which requires some degree of familiarity or knowledge of the female body. Sexual intimacy is not an uncommon topic in the Talmud. In the most religious of circles, ritual bathing is public - albeit segregated - as we don't believe there us something inherently shameful about the human body. As a more extreme example of exposure to sexual conduct in the correct framework not being prohibited, the Talmud records a student (himself to later become an important rabbi) having hid under his Rabbi's bed in order to learn from him ideal conduct. When his Rabbi caught him, and told him "this is not the [correct] way", the student's reply was that thus conduct is part of Torah and he is obligated to learn this too. The Talmud doesn't record a retort from the Rabbi, indicating the student was in the right.

To quote some book whose name I can't recall, the pleasure of intercourse is like the free cookie the bakery gives the kid to encourage him to get his parents to come to the store. When we conquer our animalistic drive, that's the most ideal time to engage in intercourse, not abstain from it. Only for that person is the most sacred act removed from any of the debasement of the world and able to cause the greatest possible effects. And for the rest of us who have not yet reached that level, we do the best that we can, because ultimately, intercourse is too spiritually important to abstain from.
 
Currently not well at all, influenced by Victorian ideals brought in by the English.

I wonder where the Victorian British attitudes came from seeing as their attitudes became more prudish at a time where religion was supposed to be losing some of it's hold on society.
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
Difference between sex and intimacy. God loves intimacy - communion - covenant.

Porn is unbridaled sex, demeaning, destructive, offensive and wrong. There is no intimacy.

It isn't what one sees as the problem (nudity), it is what is inside the person that can be the problem for it is what comes out of the heart that is the issue.

However, our faith sees the body as a gift that one gives exclusivity to another. So rather that have the whole world look at your nudity, we prefer sharing it with the one we have given it to.

But, if someone wants to have sex with everyone, its your life.
 
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Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
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Jesus gave the rules of the Christian religion in 40 commandments at the Sermon On The Mount
He gave these right at the beginning of his ministry because he didn’t know if he would live to complete his ministry


After Jesus’ death, the Apostle Paul wrote a series of letters to his churches in which he explained Jesus ministry
A person was not accepted into Paul’s church unless he or she was fully complying with Jesus’ 40 commandments or making every effort to do so


Paul’s letters were written by someone who was complying with Jesus’ 40 commandments
and they were written to people who were complying with those commandments


Paul told his church that if they ‘believed’ in Jesus they would be ‘saved’
By this he meant that if they continued to live by Jesus’ 40 commandments to the best of their ability
Jesus would forgive their failures. Intention would carry the day


Christian Pharisees of the modern church remove Jesus’ 40 commandments from the picture
And teach Paul’s words as if they were separate and unrelated to them
This is like people pretending a car does not exist, and then using its workshop manual as a bible
Jesus’ 40 commandments underpinned every word Paul wrote and nothing he wrote can be understood without them


Jesus commanded that there be no sex outside of marriage in any form whatsoever
No masturbation. No lustful thoughts. Nothing.
As Jesus is God he knows exactly how impossible that is for you
So IF you live by his 40 commandments to the best of your ability then he will forgive your failures
Intention will carry the day


Those who choose to live by a Warrior code do not follow Jesus’ 40 commandments
They will go to the Upper Hell where they will pay for their sins physically in an appropriate way
It is expected that Warriors will have the integrity to face the consequences of their actions
If you are lacking in that integrity don’t follow the Warrior path
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I find just two commandments... Love God and love your neighbor.
 

Srivijaya

Active Member
Yeah, what is it with his hangup with sex anyway?

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I figure he doesn't have any hangups with sex, it's just people that do. But then again, I'm not a Christian because I take a more apophatic approach to mystical matters, so what do I know?

Tantric Buddhism has depictions of yidams in coitus but, heck, that's a whole different ball game.
 

pearl

Well-Known Member
It is an interesting question, especially considering all the historical examples one might find of paintings and statues depicting humans in various states of undress. It might be okay to some degree, although I think many people react against pornography because of its graphic nature, while nudity done more tastefully or artistically might not be considered so bad.

In art the human body is appreciated for its beauty and mystery. In porn the beauty is reduced to exploitation.
 

BilliardsBall

Veteran Member
For a couple of days now there's been an on going debate about children viewing pornography (See HERE). The issue was raise by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints as a video telling children what to do if they should happen upon pornography, which they described as "bad pictures of people with little or no clothes on."

This brought to mind the following questions: How does your religion handle nudity/partial nudity and sexual subjects, if it handles them at all? And if it doesn't, what have you gained from your religious upbringing to be the proper way to regard them?


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I taught my children to leave a website with porn if they happen to stumble on it. Is their anyone who is not religious who would disagree?!
 

pearl

Well-Known Member
Difference between sex and intimacy. God loves intimacy - communion - covenant.

The Song of Songs (or Canticle of Canticles) is an exquisite collection of love lyrics, arranged to tell a dramatic tale of mutual desire and courtship. It presents an inspired portrayal of ideal human love, a resounding affirmation of the goodness of human sexuality that is applicable to the sacredness and the depth of married union. In both form and content, sections of the Song bear great similarity to the secular love songs of ancient Egypt and the "Sacred Marriage" cult songs of Mesopotamia which celebrate the union between divine partners.

The Song offers a welcome corrective to negative applications of the theological metaphor of the marriage/covenant in some prophetic texts. It frequently proclaims a joyous reciprocity between the lovers and highlights the active role of the female partner, now a pure figure to be cherished rather than an adulterous woman to be punished and abused.
 

Mock Turtle

Oh my, did I say that!
Premium Member
I sometimes revere the female body and I would be a true sinner if I had my way with such a one (consensually). :oops:

In fact I plead guilty to plenty of sins in this regard. :( :rolleyes: :oops:
 
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Vouthon

Dominus Deus tuus ignis consumens est
Premium Member
@Skwim while you wouldn't know it judging from some puritanical conservative Catholics in the U.S., my faith has traditionally (particularly during the Renaissance period) been comfortable with artistic nudity in sacred spaces.

Countless artists over the centuries have used nude men and women in their artwork, and these pieces of art are featured in Catholic churches around the world.

Anyone who has visited the Vatican and viewed Michelangelo's "Last Judgement" in the Sistine Chapel, where papal conclaves are held, will surely be aware that the elaborate frescoes show over 300 figures, with nearly all the males and angels originally shown as nudes i.e.

Michelangelo-Sistine-Chapel-Adam-.jpg


In 1981, Pope Saint John Paul II expressed the Catholic Church's attitude to the exposure of the human body in Love and Responsibility: "The human body can remain nude and uncovered and preserve intact its splendour and its beauty... Nakedness as such is not to be equated with physical shamelessness... Immodesty is present only when nakedness plays a negative role with regard to the value of the person... The human body is not in itself shameful... Shamelessness (just like shame and modesty) is a function of the interior of a person."

So we don't, per se, have any problems with nudity.

Porn, yes, but nudity itself no.

During the Counter-Reformation, after the Catholic Church had received significant opprobrium from Protestants disgusted by the "lascivious" and "lustful" depiction of naked human bodies in our churches, there was an infamous "fig-leaf" campaign in which some of the paintings and statues had their genitalia covered up. But this was an extreme, atypical reaction to criticism.

On this front, there was a really funny news story about the Vatican's official nativity scene for Christmas 2017:


Vatican’s Christmas Nativity scene causes controversy because naked man is ‘too sexy’

The seven corporeal works include ‘clothing the naked’ – and boy does the statue deliver on the ‘naked’ front.

It features a very athletic-looking man who is entirely naked in a suggestive pose, while a brightly-dressed man reluctantly hands him a cloth.

The religious statue found an unlikely fanbase on gay Twitter – a surprising platform for the Catholic church.

One admirer said: “The “corporal works of mercy, huh? Looks to me like an excuse to openly flaunt homoerotica!”

Others praised the naked man’s toned physique and gym bod.

The Pope explained of the artwork: “This year’s Nativity scene, executed in the typical style of Neapolitan art, is inspired by the works of mercy.


sexy-vatican.jpg
 
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Vouthon

Dominus Deus tuus ignis consumens est
Premium Member
Then there's all the nude female statues in churches, such as this Mary Magdalene one:

louvre-sainte-marie-madeleine_0.jpg



Saint Mary Magdalene | Louvre Museum | Paris

The saint was originally held up by carved angels. Encased in an oval metal structure, the wooden statue was suspended from the vault of a church, perhaps the church of saint Mary Magdalene in the Dominican convent of Augsburg, which was rebuilt in 1513-15. It must have been seen in the round, since the back is as carefully carved and colored as the front. The statue was later taken down and the angels were removed.

The carnal presence of this life-sized statue must have been very imposing in the church. But the sensual, almost profane image that it offers today, bereft of its carved angels, should be tempered. The languid pose and the meditative expression are intended to convey the penitent's mystic ecstasy, while her marvelous beauty and glossy golden locks are meant to evoke her holy radiance. The conception of this female nude is thus in phase with the spiritual content of the religious image, idealized in the medieval tradition. Gregor Erhart here produced his masterpiece, a brilliant creation of Nordic humanism in the late Middle Ages, on the threshold of the Renaissance.
 

Quintessence

Consults with Trees
Staff member
Premium Member
How does your religion handle nudity/partial nudity and sexual subjects, if it handles them at all?

In most respects, it doesn't. That said, an important context for contemporary Paganism is that the movement was very countercultural. It arose in the mid-20th century at around the same time as environmentalism and feminism were roaring up and those movements left their marks. Liberated sexuality was one of the outcomes of that, and contemporary Paganism took that to extremes beyond what you would see in the countercultural movements it developed alongside with. I'm talking things like nudity during religious rituals and ritualizing heterosexual sex. On a more mild level, the sacred year in some tradition reflects fertility cycles and may be understood in a specifically human sexual context.


By the time I learned contemporary Paganism was a thing, the extreme sexual elements were downplayed. Today, they still are, in my experiences. Generally speaking, you could say liberated sexuality is still very much present within the movement. Depending on your own opinions, this either means a more progressive and healthy approach to sex and sexuality... or a more depraved and sinful approach to it.


And if it doesn't, what have you gained from your religious upbringing to be the proper way to regard them?

I think it's interesting that upbringing is mentioned here but not in the prior question, because my religious upbringing and my current path are two very different things. I didn't really have a strong upbringing on this topic, which means I obeyed the prevailing cultural norms of my region. It should go without saying that these norms were considerably more restrained than those espoused by contemporary Paganism as a whole. :D
 
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