There is no evidence for God, so why do you believe?

[InChrist]

Really? And what evidence would this be? I truly have not seen any.



I would not have thrown away such letters. I don't think that very many atheists would. They would still have been letters from my mother. My mother was a Christian. When I took care of her for her last year of her life I had no problem going to church with her. I did it for her. My beliefs were not threatened. I could accept the fact that the people in that church believed differently from me. Since I was there for her I kept my beliefs to myself. I think that they knew, I would not take communion for example, but that was because I respected their beliefs, but they did not make a big deal of it either. Your young man had all of the hallmarks of a Christian that was mad at God. In other words, he probably still believed.

And once again, the Genesis story can also be taken as allegory. People that study evolution know that man is a product of evolution, not of special creation. I can link you to a Christian based evolution site. You may force yourself to believe the creation myth , but it is clear that most Christians do not sure that belief.

Everyone is different and responds differently, right? I am aware of and have looked at Christian based evolution sites before, but send the link if you like.

I think you deserve much credit for the honorable way you treated your mom in her final years, taking care of her and even attending church with her. A loving son is a gift.
No doubt your mom wants to see you in heaven, though.

 

[InChrist]

Not your version. They understand the Bible differently.

That’s not very informative, but thanks for trying to clarify.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

That’s not very informative, but thanks for trying to clarify.

In general they try to love other humans and not just their neighbor and they believe that if you are good in that sense. you will go to Heaven. That is all. They are on the left, believe in modern rights including LGBTQ+ and limited abortion. You can find those kinds of Christians and to you they are properly not Christians.

 

[Polymath257]

Then they aren't science.

You seem to not understand what it means to be science.

Those ideas that are testable, but have not yet been tested *are* science. They are scientific hypotheses.

So, when the top quark was first proposed, it was a scientific hypothesis even though it wasn't verified for decades. When black holes were first proposed, they were a scientific hypotheses even though they were not verified for decades.

Abiogenesis is a scientific *proposal*. It is not known to be true, but it is still a workable hypothesis that actually has a fair amount of *evidence* supporting it and no viable alternatives. Is not scientific *consensus*. But there is no counter-evidence that has stood up to scrutiny.

 

[InChrist]

In general they try to love other humans and not just their neighbor and they believe that if you are good in that sense. you will go to Heaven. That is all. They are on the left, believe in modern rights including LGBTQ+ and limited abortion. You can find those kinds of Christians and to you they are properly not Christians.

Thank you for further insight. Certainly, Jesus said to love others, even enemies. I cannot say who is or isn’t a Christian, since only God knows that. Do your Christian friends acknowledge there are any behaviors that are considered sin or wrong? Do they think it is necessary to have faith or trust Jesus as Savior?

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

Thank you for further insight. Certainly, Jesus said to love others, even enemies. I cannot say who is or isn’t a Christian, since only God knows that. Do your Christian friends acknowledge there are any behaviors that are considered sin or wrong? Do they think it is necessary to have faith or trust Jesus as Savior?

Yes, but not all other Christians would agree on what actually is sin and wrong.

 

[Polymath257]

Science has to be testable or it's just opinion.

Not quite true. if it is based on other known laws of science, it can be a good scientific hypothesis that inspires a high degree of confidence.

So, the Higg's boson was not verified until fairly recently even though it was widely believed to exist because it fit into an overarching, tested theory.

I'd also point out that the 'opinion' of someone who has studied the subject and has verified that their opinion is consistent with everything that is known, carries far more weight than that of someone off the street that doesn't know the basics.

 

[Subduction Zone]

The scriptures reveal that Jesus came to the nation of Israel and the gospel was revealed to them first. All His first followers were Jews. But when the Jews rejected Jesus ( on a national level ) the gospel went to the Gentiles ( non-Jews). Paul did not change any teachings of Jesus and all the Apostles and Paul were in agreement concerning the Gospel.

Those are only your beliefs based upon your personal beliefs, but not based upon what is in the Bible.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Everyone is different and responds differently, right? I am aware of and have looked at Christian based evolution sites before, but send the link if you like.

I think you deserve much credit for the honorable way you treated your mom in her final years, taking care of her and even attending church with her. A loving son is a gift.
No doubt your mom wants to see you in heaven, though.

You claimed that you had plenty of evidence. Can't you post any?

But here is the website I mentioned:

BioLogos - God's Word. God's World.

 

[It Aint Necessarily So]

You must have had some need that only the right flavor of Christianity satisfied. Did you ask yourself why a deity that is said to love you and who wants you to know it if you'll just try didn't appear in the first two tries? Why didn't Jesus save you in those other churches?

Why would you call God “it”? If you were truly seeking God for answers or more revelation, back when you say you were a Protestant, why wouldn’t you at least start by addressing this Being as He has revealed Himself in the scriptures?

Why do I keep running into people who think that only their questions and comments deserve an answer? You're the third in a week. I made one point and asked two questions in that comment, which was part of a larger post, all ignored by you. Instead, you asked a question of interest to you, but of no interest to me - why I used the word "it" to refer to the Christian deity.

But let me address what interests you anyway. I used to refer to the Christian deity as He when I thought it was a real thing (there's that word that concerns you again), but this is now, not then. As an atheist, it seems awkward to me to write that sentence with a He. Consider: "I used to refer to the Christian deity as He when I thought He was a real thing, but this is now, not then." It doesn't work for me. I like how I wrote it the first time better, but If you prefer, substitute He for "it" in my posting.

There was no intent to be disrespectful. It's natural for me, as with ghosts, the Loch Ness Monster, and Bigfoot, which I also do not believe exist and would also refer to as "it" even if others used gender pronouns.

Look at the effort I made to address what was of concern to you. Wouldn't you call that an expression of respect, that I thought that what was on your mind deserved my attention and sincere effort to give you a good answer? To give you an equivalent answer, I'd have to have written something that blew off your comment like, "Why are you asking me about pronouns"

Now how about going back to that post and try give me what I have given you in every response to you I've made including this one: There is no evidence for God, so why do you believe? Also, please address the new comments and questions in this post as well.

the evidence overwhelmingly points to the existence and necessity of an Intelligence/Creator God.

Not if you know how to properly interpret evidence and can form a valid argument (no logical fallacies) leading to a sound conclusion from it. There is no other rational conclusion possible but agnostic atheism. Reality is not evidence of god. It is evidence that there is something rather than nothing, but not why.

Here's a nice illustration of the idea that the proper evaluation of evidence requires some skill. This is a diagram of all the places where bullet holes were found in WWII bombers returning from battle. It was decided by military commanders that these areas should be reinforced. A statistician named Wald corrected their error. Can you find it?

Spoiler: answer

These are the places where a bomber can be hit and return to base. It's the white areas that might benefit from reinforcement, the places where no airplane that had been hit there returned home.

 

[InChrist]

Yes, but not all other Christians would agree on what actually is sin and wrong.

Does is really matter what other Christians or any Christians think or agree upon? For a Christian, isn’t the important thing what the Creator thinks and what the Bible says? Aren’t Christians supposed to submit their thoughts to Christ and be transformed, conforming their lives to His? In the eternal scheme of things isn’t that what matters?

 

[InChrist]

Those are only your beliefs based upon your personal beliefs, but not based upon what is in the Bible.

They are not just my beliefs. It is what the scriptures say.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

Does is really matter what other Christians or any Christians think or agree upon? For a Christian, isn’t the important thing what the Creator thinks and what the Bible says? Aren’t Christians supposed to submit their thoughts to Christ and be transformed, conforming their lives to His? In the eternal scheme of things isn’t that what matters?

Well, not to them as I assume you do it.

 

[InChrist]

You claimed that you had plenty of evidence. Can't you post any?

But here is the website I mentioned:

BioLogos - God's Word. God's World.

Thank you. I am familiar with Biologos. I’ll get back to responding later. Out again this afternoon.

 

[Sheldon]

Yes, it is time for the literalists to take off their horse blinders. You seem to forget that many atheists, and most of them in the US, used to be Christians. They became atheists not by closing their eyes, but by opening them.

Many theists are trapped by their beliefs as well, since religions don't exactly make it easy for adherents to change their minds, but there are still courageous people who do.

The clergy project...

Council of Ex-Muslims of Britain - CEMB

 

[Sheldon]

Do you realize your driving on the wrong road, eating from the wrong tree?

Do you realise that your is a possessive pronoun?

You also used sophistry to ignore the context of my post, so I shan't address that sophistry.

 

[Sheldon]

I don't even know that there was a Big Bang.

"Three key pieces of observational evidence lend support to the Big Bang theory: the measured abundances of elements, the observed expansion of space, and the discovery of the cosmic microwave background (CMB). The CMB refers to the uniform distribution of radiation that pervades the entire universe."

Take it up with science...

 

[ppp]

Here is one of many:
“That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, concerning the Word of life— the life was manifested, and we have seen, and bear witness, and declare to you that eternal life which was with the Father and was manifested to us— that which we have seen and heard we declare to you, that you also may have fellowship with us; and truly our fellowship is with the Father and with His Son Jesus Christ. And these things we write to you that your joy may be full. This is the message which we have heard from Him and declare to you, that God is light and in Him is no darkness at all.”
‭‭I John‬ ‭1:1-5‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

Why on earth do you think first John is a gospel? Do you know nothing of your own beliefs?

 

[Sheldon]

makes me wonder how ANYONE would know what the first element in the universe was.
Except God and Jesus, of course.

 

[ppp]

You're aware that you're on a debate forum, right?

Sir, this is a Wendy's.