And get an honest answer?
Hah! Dream on!
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Trump is losing the debate acting like a raving lunatic
- Thread starter F1fan
- Start date
Hah! Dream on!
Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
Well, you won't get any sort of answer from me because I don't know and you don't either.
Then why do you have an opinion? And why did you post it? Do you not understand that if you make controversial claims that you will be asked to explain? And now you admit you have no clue why you have the opinion you stated.
Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
What opinion did I state, without a source?
Copernicus
Industrial Strength Linguist
No, we aren't just talking about his Hitler remark made in private, but all of those other remarks that he also made in public all the way into 2022, after Trump had left office. It is obvious why Vance now says he changed his mind and thoughts about Donald Trump. He had to, if he was to audition for the VP slot. Billionaire Peter Thiel's sponsorship was a powerful incentive for Trump to swallow the Vance pill, but abject sycophancy from Vance was an absolute requirement for him to get the spot.
ETA: Corrected mistyped year. It was 2022, not 2023.
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Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
Please give your sources for things said by Vance against Trump in 2023. Thanks. Fact-checking JD Vance's past statements and relationship with Trump
Clizby Wampuscat
Well-Known Member
Well, I'll start with this. I grew up a middle-class kid, my mother and father raised my sister and me. They worked very hard. They were able to finally save up enough money to buy our first house when my sister was 2. I grew up in a community of hard-working people, you know, construction workers and nurses and teachers. And I try to explain to some people who may not have had the same experience. You know, a lot of people will relate to this. You know, I grew up in a neighborhood of folks who were very proud of their lawn, and I was raised to believe and to know that all people deserve dignity, and that we as Americans have a beautiful character.
Pogo
Well-Known Member
Well yeah, been there, done that, I have the biggest lawn in my family , even used weed and feed on it, but years of living in different places with different people I have come to realize that that nice little cape cod with the gas light in the front yard was not even in the 60s representative of America and sending daughters away for a year for ? reason or disowning the cousin who liked boys was not an ultimately sustainable attitude for living in the world. I learned to appreciate people for who they are not what they are and lo and behold, all those other people just want to work hard and support their families just like yours and mine.
We have a different environment now, thanks to tax cuts that benefit primarily the wealthy that my son at 30 has yet to buy a house because those entry level neighborhoods just don't exist any more, but lots of rental property being built by those who already have the money.
Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
LOL my parents didn't buy a cape cod with a gas light out in front. They bought a very small home with three small bedrooms (and I am pretty sure one bathroom) the first time around, and the second and third times now that I think of it. Were we better off than most of the world though? Yes, sure, but we were not rich at all by American standards.
I also wasn't raised to be racist in any way shape or form, or be sexist for that matter. In fact, when I started my first period, my mom had the most gorgeous African American woman over and I remember having a little celebration and drinking tea with her. Mainly I remember her big gold hoop earrings and her natural hair, and being in awe of her beauty.
I also wasn't raised to be racist in any way shape or form, or be sexist for that matter. In fact, when I started my first period, my mom had the most gorgeous African American woman over and I remember having a little celebration and drinking tea with her. Mainly I remember her big gold hoop earrings and her natural hair, and being in awe of her beauty.
You had asked me, "You think Trump is a Nazi and like Hitler?" and I answered "[Trump is] authoritarian and a stochastic terrorist with no respect for the Constitution or the rule of law and has a desire to exact revenge on detractors. You can choose the word or short phrase that you think describes that." Then I asked you, "Why is that OK with you?"
I don't see an answer in your reply, unless you're saying that you find all of that OK because Trump should be treated with dignity. If so, that's irrelevant to why you find his myriad character flaws acceptable.
I question whether your final words still apply today. I'd say that about half of America now suffers from a cultural infection of sorts which leaves it morally challenged. We in the other culture are dumbfounded as to how that can be. I understand that it is the result of unfettered, continuous right-wing indoctrination media for about a third of a century now, but who could have predicted that there were so many defenseless people or that the propaganda would work so well on them?
I haven't a single positive thing to say about such people, and they've changed my opinion of America and the American people, which is pretty low and has been since the middle of the Bush II years. It's absurd to me that a people can look at Harris and Trump and prefer Trump in such large numbers. In any other modern democracy, Trump wouldn't have a chance and wouldn't get 10% of the vote, but then again, they didn't have the "benefit" of the likes of Limbaugh, Carlson, and Hannity conditioning them for decades.
One can make a strong case that the worst thing that ever happened to America - worse than the Civil War or 9/11 - was the repealing of the Fairness Doctrine, which paved the way for the conservatives to turn half on the nation into failed citizens who would welcome a miscreant like Trump to lead the country, and help those conservatives to harm the nation including those who voted for them, making it not just moral dereliction, but intellectual collapse as well when you can't tell friends from enemies.
Clizby Wampuscat
Well-Known Member
Then why do you accept that answer when Harris gives it to the question:
When we talk about bringing down prices and making life more affordable for people, what are one or two specific things you have in mind for that?
You completely avoided the question.
I watched the 60 Minutes episode from September 15, 2024 about the January 6 prosecutions. One of the Jan 6 defendants who was arrested and charged and did time was interviewed. He said he traveled 2000 miles to go to the Capitol because he was fed up. He is a working class guy with a disabled wife and kids. He stated that he’s spent tens of thousands of dollars on his wife’s medical care and he was pissed off that the election was stolen from Trump.
I wondered why he thought Trump was going to offer him anything at all. His main complaint was medical bills. As we know republicans don’t care. The only party that has tried to help citizens and medical access is democrats.
Given your non-answer I wonder if you are in the same boat as this guy. You aren’t happy with your life and you think Trump has something to offer you. Yet you can’t even state what that is.
In what way does Trump offer anything to you that is practical?
U.S. attorney explains Jan. 6 Capitol riot prosecutions
The Justice Department has convicted more than 1,000 Jan. 6 rioters. U.S. Attorney Matthew Graves says the crimes that occurred that day are likely some of the most recorded in history.
www.cbsnews.com
She’s already explained this in other comments. First she and Biden have already helped slow inflation. Second she was to penalize corporations that set higher prices on products than what reflects the rate of inflation. It is similar to antitrust legislation.
Some of my friends & family are immigrants. They too
work hard, & have great lawns in homes they own.
Trump & Vance publicly loathe & threaten them.
Not the kind of Ameristanian values we should see.
Trump & Vance seem more Russian than American.
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Pogo
Well-Known Member
likewise, it was actually maybe 1100 sq. feet. three bedrooms, 2 with slanted ceilings, 1 bath, but still a step up from the 60s vintage ranchburger on a slab you are no doubt familiar with from texas.
Main point, a family of 5 could still buy one on a single salary. Next move was same size and we ate government peanut butter for a while until my mother's high school educated immigrant salary became sufficient for any other lifestyle. I know the lower end of middle class and economic scholarship education etc. Heck, I know Kamala's neighborhood and she was lucky to live in that part of the Oakland/Berkeley flats, 3-5 blocks away was a very different situation when I lived there a few years later. gentrification of the Bay Area and renovation has probably brought those houses into the upper 6 figure range, but such is progress since they might well have been 20-50k then.
If I am not mistaken, you said your husband was military, that is a whole different situation relevant to economic security if not that different in gross income.
Pogo
Well-Known Member
niggle, My cousins grew up behind the Iron curtain, when released from Soviet repression, they expressed themselves even better than we have in "liberal" actions, even volunteering for duty in Kosovo.
T+V don't even represent the average Russian, only the elite power structure that has held the economy down.
Pogo
Well-Known Member
The answer is to simple to make it a newsbreak, NOT do the Things Trump is proposing.
Yes we have suffered inflation, less than most countries due to that interruption called Covid, The stock market is doing well for those who already have money, Wages are rising at least as fast as inflation for the majority, unemployment is low by any 20th century standard.
Changing horses to go back to the philosophies that brought us the dichotomy between the average and the rich is not going to work any better than it has the last several times Republican tax cuts were tried. Yes there was more money, but we never saw it, only the increase in house values that prevent our children from buying.
Sometimes change is not good. Though more attention to those hurting from past policies should improve the situation for all of us in that they will not feel the desperation that leads to crime and violence.
Copernicus
Industrial Strength Linguist
Thanks for pointing that typo out, and I'll go back an correct the original post. Actually, he changed his tune in 2022 while running for the Senate, after Trump met him and endorsed his candidacy. The audition for the VP slot began at that point. Vance was being groomed by Peter Thiel and is largely regarded as his protege. I already posted a source going back to 2021 tweets by Vance in a previous post.
Ponder This
Well-Known Member
Bizarre obsession? You mean watching and listening to the news where a citizen of Springfield spoke about the immigration problem in Springfield?
Nah, that's called paying attention to events.
Kamala's laughter is called, denial, or maybe she didn't even bother paying attention to events.
They only "fact-checked" Trump and didn't fact check Kamala's false statements. This is an example of bias.
There are cons to international attention. But the national attention is good for Springfield. Before this attention, Springfield residents were already talking about how they should leave Springfield because of the threat to their well-being.
Kamala's response to Springfield is "It's a crying shame," as she descends hook, line, and sinker down a racist rabbit hole with no concerns expressed on her part for the problems her and Biden's administration caused.
You should stop using the word disinformation to describe others remarks while simultaneously disseminating debunked theories.
Harris made claims that were known absolutely known to be false, but they didn't fact-check her. It wasn't simply irresponsible; it was bias.
Plenty of residents in Springfield have come forward with similar stories, add them your blame list if you like. No way it helps Kamala win Ohio for her not to address those concerns. The bomb threats, according to the police, are from another country, which also doesn't help Kamala when you stop to think about it for an iota of a second.
You need to reconsider your use of the word disinformation rather than pretending that everything you don't like to hear is disinformation. I'll try not to regard what you say as "garbage".
Not a bad take. Or she is out of touch with what the nation is experiencing as a result of the immigration crisis.
I wouldn't know, but it hardly matters if it is.
I watched the debate. And the most obvious claim she wasn't fact-checked on was the Charlottesville fine nazi hoax. Did you see that?
Crime rates are a close second on the fake-checks from the moderators.
Meanwhile, more reports of cats being eaten, car crashs, residents harrassed, and the overloaded health care system in Springfield.
The benefit of attention is that it places governments under pressure to attend to the needs of their residents. Tangible benefits currently include the $2.5 million dollars in healthcare resources that Springfield is receiving to help deal with their overloaded healthcare system.
Trump and Vance didn't have to invent anything. It was reported in the news. The news continues to report on it.
_______
The point here is that Trump, when he made his statement during the debate demonstrated that he's paying attention to the news and the needs of citizens. That's true even if you think the cats of Springfield are perfectly safe. But Kamala in her scoffing laughter demonstrated that she isn't attentive to the needs of citizens; she prepared to dismiss concerns as outlandish delusion. In the long run, this helps Trump and hurts Kamala. And because Springfield does have an immigration problem, this ages well for Trump and not so well for Kamala. The fact check from ABC also doesn't age well for ABC, because, in the long run, it will stand as an unforgettable example of their bias for Kamala and against Trump in a Presidential debate.