"48% of White Evangelicals Would Support Kavanaugh Even If He Assaulted Dr. Ford"

[Niblo]

What about any of this is "OK?"
From where I sit, the 'anti-K" group is doing it's level best to MAKE Kavenaugh 'unfit to sit,' by deliberately hurting him...and for what?


And whether Kavenaugh turns out to be a mature, reasonable and honorable judge who won't let this process sour him or not, if it HAS done so....

The dems have done it to themselves.

And they deserve to harvest what they have sown.

I have no sympathy whatsoever for people who play this level of political nastiness. None.

No sweat. I was just wondering why you would think it 'OK' for a Supreme Court Judge to behave like a jerk.

 

[dianaiad]

No sweat. I was just wondering why you would think it 'OK' for a Supreme Court Judge to behave like a jerk.

"OK?"

What about ANY of this is "OK?"

What I know is this: Supreme Court justices are human. They are not gods. They are not saints.

And Kavenaugh has been put through hell, because of political infighting that has absolutely nothing at all to do with his personal fitness to serve.

I believe that, had he been fairly treated and confirmed, that Roe v Wade would still be the law of the land. There is absolutely no reason for anybody to assume that he would overturn it, except for the sturm und drung of the dems whose only objection to him is that Trump chose him.

They have attacked and attempted to destroy him...not because of any failing in HIM, but because Trump picked him.

If he becomes a Supreme Court Justice in spite of them, they may well have created their own self fulfilling prophecy. I would not blame Kavenaugh a bit for allowing his own anger and bitterness to color his decisions. I hope he won't, but I certainly wouldn't blame him if he does.

....and if they (the dems) actually want fair and honest opinions from the bench, they really need to grow up.

 

[metis]

"OK?"

What about ANY of this is "OK?"

What I know is this: Supreme Court justices are human. They are not gods. They are not saints.

And Kavenaugh has been put through hell, because of political infighting that has absolutely nothing at all to do with his personal fitness to serve.

I believe that, had he been fairly treated and confirmed, that Roe v Wade would still be the law of the land. There is absolutely no reason for anybody to assume that he would overturn it, except for the sturm und drung of the dems whose only objection to him is that Trump chose him.

They have attacked and attempted to destroy him...not because of any failing in HIM, but because Trump picked him.

If he becomes a Supreme Court Justice in spite of them, they may well have created their own self fulfilling prophecy. I would not blame Kavenaugh a bit for allowing his own anger and bitterness to color his decisions. I hope he won't, but I certainly wouldn't blame him if he does.

....and if they (the dems) actually want fair and honest opinions from the bench, they really need to grow up.

I notice there's nothing said about what Ford may have went through in the above.

Just more partisan politics, and it's being done by all too many on both sides of the aisle and their followers who elevate party over fairness and the country. .

 

[dianaiad]

I notice there's nothing said about what Ford may have went through in the above.

Just more partisan politics, and it's being done by all too many on both sides of the aisle and their followers who elevate party over fairness and the country. .

Dr. Ford has all my sympathy. I believe that something did happen to her...and if it didn't, that she remembers that something happened to her is enough to do the same damage.

However, I am very familiar with 'manufactured' and 'false' memories. Intimately familiar, since that has caused immense damage to my own family. There is NO evidence that Kavenaugh did whatever it is Ford claims he did. None. She can't remember the event, the time...nothing, and her memories were solidified through therapy, later. This therapy happened at a time when it was not realized that memories CAN be manufactured and can be false. It happened a lot.

It happened in my family. My cousin remained convinced that her father abused her for decades, even though her memories of that are absolutely false and we can prove that. At the time, her father wasn't even on the same continent as my cousin. She still "remembers" him doing this, even though she now knows how impossible it was that he had done so. Shoot, she remembers one occasion quite clearly: a party where she remembers her father coming up to her bedroom, catching her alone during a 'sleepover' and molesting her.

The problem was....there were five girls sleeping in her bedroom during that sleepover, her father was in Sydney and the sleepover was in a small Utah town, and every single person at that sleepover remembers it and does NOT support her memory.

That doesn't alter her memory. She still has it, and only the piled on facts of the truth tell her that her memory is flawed.

She has sued the therapist who did this to her, by the way, but that doesn't heal the incredible breach between her and her father/family.

Does nobody consider that this is what happened to Dr. Ford?

There is no, and I repeat, NO, evidence that Kavenaugh did what Ford claimed he did. Lots of evidence and testimony that he did NOT do so, in fact. Does that help Dr. Ford? No. Her memories are what they are, and just as damaging to her if they are false as if they were true.

However, how is it justice to punish Kavenaugh, if her memories are false?

............and it looks very much as if they are. The only advantage here is to political game players who don't give a good hoot about Dr. Ford. She is being used even more cruelly than is Kavenaugh.

I blame Feinstien and crew. They don't care one whit about Ford, or women, or justice. That's obvious.

 

[Niblo]

"OK?"

What about ANY of this is "OK?"

What I know is this: Supreme Court justices are human. They are not gods. They are not saints.

And Kavenaugh has been put through hell, because of political infighting that has absolutely nothing at all to do with his personal fitness to serve.

I believe that, had he been fairly treated and confirmed, that Roe v Wade would still be the law of the land. There is absolutely no reason for anybody to assume that he would overturn it, except for the sturm und drung of the dems whose only objection to him is that Trump chose him.

They have attacked and attempted to destroy him...not because of any failing in HIM, but because Trump picked him.

If he becomes a Supreme Court Justice in spite of them, they may well have created their own self fulfilling prophecy. I would not blame Kavenaugh a bit for allowing his own anger and bitterness to color his decisions. I hope he won't, but I certainly wouldn't blame him if he does.

....and if they (the dems) actually want fair and honest opinions from the bench, they really need to grow up.

I was referring to these words of yours (shown in bold):

'But after what the Democrats have done to him? Watch out. He might well decide to 'get even,' and I wouldn't blame him one iota. The Democrats may have made the enemy they claim he was to begin with, and they will only have themselves to blame.'

As far as I'm concerned the guy is innocent until convicted by a jury.

 

[dianaiad]

I was referring to these words of yours (shown in bold):

'But after what the Democrats have done to him? Watch out. He might well decide to 'get even,' and I wouldn't blame him one iota. The Democrats may have made the enemy they claim he was to begin with, and they will only have themselves to blame.'

As far as I'm concerned the guy is innocent until convicted by a jury.

Well, I think this too.
The problem is, the dems don't care. It's a mob mentality and they couldn't give a rats' patootie about 'innocent' or 'guilty' here.

they are using Kavenaugh and more disgustingly, they are using Ford in service to their own political quest for power.

.....................................and if they end up shooting themselves in the foot by pushing Kavenaugh away from their ideals and agenda, well......

I would not blame him if that colors his opinions in the future.

 

[Revoltingest]

Does nobody consider that this is what happened to Dr. Ford?

I've brought this up before, ie, memories change & can be created.
It's a major problem that this memory isn't corroborated by any written
record or witnesses. In contrast, Kavanaugh offers his calendar, which
appears to indicate that he didn't even attend any such party.
Of course, none of this tells us which if any version of the even happened.
It appears unknowable.
Of course, that won't stop people from being certain of either's veracity.

I don't know whether Kavanaugh is the best candidate for the job.
If I had any authority to vote upon it, I'd have to do some research
on his prior decisions.

 

[Shad]

I don't know whether Kavanaugh is the best candidate for the job.
If I had any authority to vote upon it, I'd have to do some research
on his prior decisions.

Dems coudn't find a single objection on Kavs judicial record to use to undermine him.

 

[Shad]

. This therapy happened at a time when it was not realized that memories CAN be manufactured and can be false. It happened a lot.

Knowledge of false memories, the brain filling in memory gaps and general unreliability of memories has been known and studied since at least the 80s. Her therapist and Ford both should know better unless they are both incompetent in their profession.

Does nobody consider that this is what happened to Dr. Ford?

I have. Few want to question Ford's memories, her errors and the reliability of memory. For the most part I get "trauma" rhetoric as a response.

 

[Revoltingest]

Dems coudn't find a single objection on Kavs judicial record to use to undermine him.

That means changing the criteria & strategy.
Borking is no single method.
And of course, Republicans have their preferred
tactics. Everyone's methods are ad hoc.

 

[Niblo]

Well, I think this too.
The problem is, the dems don't care. It's a mob mentality and they couldn't give a rats' patootie about 'innocent' or 'guilty' here.

they are using Kavenaugh and more disgustingly, they are using Ford in service to their own political quest for power.

.....................................and if they end up shooting themselves in the foot by pushing Kavenaugh away from their ideals and agenda, well......

I would not blame him if that colors his opinions in the future.

An opportunity has presented itself, and his opponents are going for it. I've no doubt that Republicans would do the same. This does not make wrongs right, of course. I find trial by media distasteful in the extreme.

 

[metis]

There is no, and I repeat, NO, evidence that Kavenaugh did what Ford claimed he did. Lots of evidence and testimony that he did NOT do so, in fact.

And exactly what evidence is there that he didn't do it?

I'll cut it short-- there ain't, especially because it's almost impossible to prove these allegations didn't happen since no time slots were ever established nor any witnesses whom have come forth. You're simply jumping into an assumption.

I blame Feinstien and crew. They don't care one whit about Ford, or women, or justice. That's obvious.

Another assumption that is virtually impossible to establish. Are you some sort of mind-reader that knows exactly what goes on in Feinstein's brain? And who's the "they"? Are you saying that all or even most Democrats could care less about a woman possibly being assaulted?

I don't make such assumptions and let me recommend you do the same. Let's see what the investigation concludes, if anything.

 

[metis]

For the most part I get "trauma" rhetoric as a response.

Maybe look up "suppression" in some psychology website.

 

[metis]

Dems coudn't find a single objection on Kavs judicial record to use to undermine him.

That has literally nothing to do with what's going on now and the basis of this latter investigation.

 

[Revoltingest]

And exactly what evidence is there that he didn't do it?

There's no evidence that you didn't do it.
So that's not a useful perspective.

 

[metis]

The problem is, the dems don't care. It's a mob mentality and they couldn't give a rats' patootie about 'innocent' or 'guilty' here.

they are using Kavenaugh and more disgustingly, they are using Ford in service to their own political quest for power.

The above is a "fine" example of partisan politics at its worse, and it is simply hypocritical for you to use such a stereotype on others being prejudice when you've made it abundantly clear this is what you're doing yourself with the above.

Again, let me recommend that you wait until the results come in.

 

[Shad]

Maybe look up "suppression" in some psychology website.

Now go look up Elizabeth Loftus' studies of memory. Also Deryn Strange's paper. Some of which include actual rape cases overturned due to evidence contradicting memory based identification. Memory errors are well known, observed and even studies as to why have been done for decades. All I need to do is establish memory is not perfect nor reliable due to trauma to shut your argument down.

 

[Shad]

That has literally nothing to do with what's going on now and the basis of this latter investigation.

Read the reply the post was made to. Revolt lacked information about Kav's judicial record. I pointed out the Dems had nothing to attack him based on those records.

 

[metis]

All I need to do is establish memory is not perfect nor reliable due to trauma to shut your argument down.

Not only did I not claim it was "perfect nor reliable", but you inadvertently confirm the point I was making with the above, namely that it is not unusual at all for a person who's been traumatized to not remember everything and sometimes even be confused.

This does not mean what the person's testimony is to be discounted however, which is why investigations like we're seeing are necessary to try and establish what may or may not have occurred. She has admitted there are things she cannot remember, which can be viewed as being more a positive than a negative in terms of whether she's being dishonest or not.

Again, I'm willing to wait and not draw judgments, but there are some here who are too willing to jump the shark, imo.

 

[dianaiad]

I've brought this up before, ie, memories change & can be created.
It's a major problem that this memory isn't corroborated by any written
record or witnesses. In contrast, Kavanaugh offers his calendar, which
appears to indicate that he didn't even attend any such party.
Of course, none of this tells us which if any version of the even happened.
It appears unknowable.
Of course, that won't stop people from being certain of either's veracity.

I don't know whether Kavanaugh is the best candidate for the job.
If I had any authority to vote upon it, I'd have to do some research
on his prior decisions.

AND THAT is a reasonable response.


In my humble and completely irrelevant opinion, that is.