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A Bunch of Reasons Why I Question Noah's Flood Story:

TagliatelliMonster

Veteran Member
We don't live by year 2200 values because we don't know what they are and we aren't ready.


We don't know what they are because we can't travel to the future.
But an omnipotent being would know what they are and he could tell us in such a way that we would understand it. And by doing so, he could prevent a lot of immoral behavior and suffering.

If you know about a superior moral framework, then you have a moral duty to communicate it.
Not doing so would be deeply immoral.
 

TagliatelliMonster

Veteran Member
The ten commandments forbid the kind of Biblical immorality that has been described. The Jews do not practice the kind of immorality that has been described. The New Testament also has cancelled that immorality.


NOWHERE in the NT does it say that slavery is not okay.
Au contraire. It says that slaves should obey their masters.
 

TagliatelliMonster

Veteran Member
OK virgins.

In Numbers 31 it does not say they slept with the virgins. Don't blast out at me if I'm wrong, but I think they kept the virgins and children as an act of morality since those people were not guilty like the rest of the people they were fighting.

No. It's just the virgin girls. The rest was to be killed. Including the elderly, the women, the children, the non-virgin girls, the toddlers, the babies.... even the cattle.

Why o why would people kill everyone and keep the virgin girls?
Why virgins? What possible motive could there be?


:rolleyes:
 

TagliatelliMonster

Veteran Member
"It's a bittersweet symphony this life... try to make ends meet, you're a slave to money, than you die" - The Verve.

Continuing to fall back on these "metaphorical" expressions of slavery and pretending that it applies to actual slavery or that it is in any way similar, is a slap in the face of all humans throughout history that have suffered by being slaves.
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
But religion does have that nasty ability of making otherwise good people act badly though...
The book Hitler's Willing Executioners goes into detail about how ordinary Germans were caught up in the fervor of Nazism and worked to imprison and exterminate the Jews of Europe for years. These were people who went home from concentration camps at the end of the day and had dinner with their families. They celebrated Christian holidays. Only after the war was over did they feel and express regret. It's frightening how otherwise good people can follow leadership that is corrupt and criminal without any moral hesitancy.
 
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F1fan

Veteran Member
I have answered about slavery twice but you don't care so I hummed a song about it.
You have answered and I find your pro-slavery attitude disgusting. You are pro-slavery. You are against YOURSELF being enslaved but OK if others are enslaved. That's twisted morality. It throws the "love others as you love thyself" lesson out the window.
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
I meant hopefully Christianity makes them less corrupt.
Christianity hasn't made members of the KKK less racist. It didn't help people of the Confederate States realize that slavery was immoral.

These are your ideas about good and bad not shared by everyone and many accusations you make aren't based on universally acknowledged reasons.
I'm talking about basic human rights, not nebulous and debatable issues. There have been wars sorting out the morality of basic humans rights, like the US Civil war to end slavery. What Nazi Germany did to the Jews of Europe is considered a crime against humanity, not some "idea" that might be good or bad depending on who you are talking to.
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
"So if God is the arbiter of what is moral, and you insist God doesn't change, how did God decide to change it's mind on what is moral? You keep trying to have things both ways."

Not in the least... it is always the time and culture of the people and what they are capable of doing. Humanity grows over time just like life on earth has evolved over billions of years.
This is what humans do, and there is nothing that suggests there's a God involved. But either morals from God are absolute or they are not. If morals aren't absolute then God can do anything, and humans have no authority to answer to as a judge. So we are back to humans doing whatever they want and getting away with it, like Nazi Germany. Like slave owners. Any genocide is justified since there is no absolute morality, and morality changes, and the God is consistently absent.

Do you command a paramecium to colonize the Milky Way? Maybe you do, but you give it time to do it.
Huh?
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
Likewise you have given me your terms, and it is up to me to decide how I want to live my life based on what I have been taught.
How objective are you going to be? Have you been indoctrinated by your religion or are you free?

If you are free from the influence and directives of your religion why are you pro-slavery?

Do you think you have the courage and autonomy to reject your region and think for yourself? Or are you dependent to some degree and can't do it?

I was not claiming any authority... just telling you that I have told you what I think and it is up to you to live your life how you will.
You are being obedient to leadership, so what makes them correct? Why can't you think for yourself via your own executive function and moral sense?
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
To be some sort of Christian and pro-slavery means a person is deferring their moral attitude to what the bible says, and doing it through their OWN or adopted interpretation. So the question is why these fallible sinners think the Bible has moral authority over themselves. The dilemma is that these folks still decide the Bible has ultimate authority, and they then assign the Bible the authority over themselves. So there's this circular moral system where the believer can deny responsibility because it's God's law.

If there was an actual God behind all belief and moral authority by believers why is there so much disagreement among them? Who is morally correct, the anti-slavery Christian or the pro-slavery Christian?
 

robocop (actually)

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Exodus 34. And it is made quite clear that these are the same Ten Commandments that were on the tablets that Moses broke:

Bible Gateway passage: Exodus 34 - New International Version

If you remember the story, after breaking the first set he went back up the mountain and got a second one. Supposedly with the original Commandments on them. Read them and you will see why no one tends to talk about them.
Not sure the broken commandments were different.
 

robocop (actually)

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
He punishes people for not believing, full stop.

And by hiding all the evidence, and even planting false evidence, he makes sure that no person has actual rational reasons to believe any of it.

So yes, very much yes: he rewards gullibility (belief on faith) and punishes rational reasoning (only believe those things that can be properly justified with evidence).
God is not going to punish you for not believing in Noah's Ark.
 
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