A good atheist goes to hell, but a bad Christian goes to heaven?

[Father Heathen]

A bad Christian becomes good again after he repents and asks God to forgive his sins. That's how redemption works.

A good atheist will never repent and consequently will never be redeemed. A good atheist goes to hell. But there are no atheists in the pit.

Do you not find it rather sad that the criteria isn't about the honor, honesty or nobility of ones character, but whether or not they licked god's toes? What a disgusting, cloud-dwelling beast.

 

[Midnight Pete]

Honor ... honesty ... nobility

It is about these things. As well as humility, kindness, abstinence, chastity, patience, liberality, and diligence. (These are the 7 Contrary Virtues which oppose and cancel out the 7 Deadly Sins.)

 

[tomato1236]

A good atheist goes to hell but a really bad christian who says he has repented his sins goes to heaven. Does this seem right to you?

No.

I'm not exactly atheist, but i believe that until god sends me some sort of telepathic message or revelation and tells me that I MUST believe in Christianity, Buddhism, Judaism, Islam, or some other religion.. I will never really know. I don't believe in blind faith. I need proof, and by that I mean a personal experience.

This is precisely what those of my faith incourage others to look for. A personal experience, a revelation from God that's personal, yours. It is possible to have this experience.

I was having this conversation with a Christian friend of mine because there was an article on the internet about the pope forgiving CHILDREN who were molested by priests! As if it was their fault! He said they "tempted so many of the church's servants into lustful violation of their holy vows of celibacy." W. T. F. He's blaming the kids, because of course the church's servants are innocent. (sarcasm). Some of these kids were 5, and they probably didn't even know what sex is. That's innocence.

I want the link to this. Not because I disbelieve it, but it's just so absolutely amazingly unbelievable.

So I asked my friend her opinion. Lets just say... I am an atheist. I'm not exactly, but lets assume I am. And assume I am a good person (you don't know me, so thats why I say assume. Good is an opinion, but I really do believe I am good). I help out in my community, I do my job, I love my family, I get great grades in school, and I care about the world and people. I do my best to be good every day and set appropriate goals for myself.

Way to be. Many Christian folks will also tell you that none of this is necessary, or beneficial to you. Also bunk.

I said to my friend.. "Who goes to heaven and who goes to hell according to your religion?" And she told me that, since I wouldn't have faith, I would go to hell and the people who committed crimes would go to heaven because they believed in Christianity and God. And then she said I should convert as soon as possible so I don't go to hell, and I rolled my eyes at her -_-.

This is dumb. I roll my eyes at that, too. As if accepting Jesus had nothing to do with improving your life and behavior. As if she could judge who was going to heaven or hell.

Does faith really make someone a better person? Because to me, If heaven exists, going to heaven should be for people that are good, not just for people who have faith.

To me, saying you believe is not faith. Faith is the result of acting on belief. If someone professes to have faith, but makes a habit of molesting children, I would not be convinced that their faith is faith at all. Your faith grows when you experiment on a belief and see the positive results. Faith is crippled when you act contrary to your beliefs.

They should be forgiven for being rational skeptics, If that is such a horrible crime. If not, then you'll get people that have faith but aren't necessarily good people in heaven! How fair is that?

It's not. People won't be punished if they didn't know better. That's like putting a cookie in front of a child and then spanking him for eating it, when he'd never been told it was wrong to eat the cookie. It's bad parenting, and would be bad...God...ing.

And what about gay people? If someone is a morally good person, but is gay and Christian and doesn't lie to themselves or repent for the "sin" of being gay, do they go to hell too?

Being gay is fine. There's no fault in being attracted to the same sex. But just like everybody else, gay people have to keep the commandments of God. This creates a problem if gay people can't change, because this means they basically have to live without gay sex, and they don't want heterosex. This is why many gay people struggle with, and in some cases against religion. It's a tough dillema. Honestly I don't really know the answers here.

Is being gay or atheist really that bad?

No, they're not that bad. I've already addressed being gay. Being athiest is fine, but if you decide that's the way to go, my advice is to avoid becoming so trusting of your logic, and of evidence, that you stop paying attention to those "experiences" you sound open to. There are feelings and insights I've received through my spiritual efforts whose source cannot be proven. Insights and feelings I could not have generated using my intellect (even though I'm a fricking genius). And these things mean more to me than all the chemistry and astronomy classes I ever took.

 

[Midnight Pete]

I'm not really sure about about how heaven and hell work, but I think it is one's actions that determine what happens to the soul, not their beliefs.

Faith through works, I'd say. Works are good but worthless w/o faith IMO.

 

[Tristesse]

A bad Christian becomes good again after he repents and asks God to forgive his sins. That's how redemption works.

A good atheist will never repent and consequently will never be redeemed. A good atheist goes to hell. But there are no atheists in the pit.

So, essentially, a "good" christian can rape a 12 year old, repent and ask for forgiveness from god, and he gets a front row seat in heaven. While an atheist who has done charity work etc... and who's only crime is not believing in this "loving" god, who apparently has an inferiority complex, will burn in hell. This system is probably one of the most immoral set of rules I could possibly think of. The only conclusion one could or should draw from this, is that this deity is a malicious dictator.

 

[Midnight Pete]

So, essentially, a "good" christian can rape a 12 year old, repent and ask for forgiveness from god, and he gets a front row seat in heaven.

That's what forgiveness means! :yes:

But a person who has done bad things still can't escape any earthly consequences of what they've done. Earthly justice can't be denied.

 

[JustAsking]

That's what forgiveness means! :yes:

But a person who has done bad things still can't escape any earthly consequences of what they've done. Earthly justice can't be denied.

Curious, obviously you believe in a life after this one. So what is your opinion on what the "point" is in this, earthly, life? What are we supposed to be doing?

 

[tomato1236]

Curious, obviously you believe in a life after this one. So what is your opinion on what the "point" is in this, earthly, life? What are we supposed to be doing?

I think we're supposed to be breakdancing, mostly.

 

[Midnight Pete]

Curious, obviously you believe in a life after this one. So what is your opinion on what the "point" is in this, earthly, life? What are we supposed to be doing?

 

[Wotan]

Strange, is it not? that of the myriads who
Before us pass'd the door of Darkness through,
Not one returns to tell us of the Road,
Which to discover we must travel too.

I sent my Soul through the Invisible,
Some letter of that After-life to spell:
And by and by my Soul return'd to me,
And answer'd "I Myself am Heav'n and Hell:"

Heav'n but the Vision of fulfill'd Desire,
And Hell the Shadow from a Soul on fire,
Cast on the Darkness into which Ourselves,
So late emerged from, shall so soon expire.

 

[Tarheeler]

Faith through works, I'd say. Works are good but worthless w/o faith IMO.

And that's why we have different religions.

 

[ButTheCatCameBack]

I've never needed to believe in the supernatural to do good for people.

Funny that.

 

[Midnight Pete]

And that's why we have different religions.

That's not the only reason.

 

[Caladan]

For the atheist, heaven is hell. for the working and warrior ants utopia means death. let the good believers have the utopia, I'll have the intellectual challenges.

 

[arun]

Every action has an equal and opposite reaction.We will get the results of our good and bad deeds in this life or some other reincarnations.Don't think we can fool God .
we would be judged on the basis of spiritual progress we have achieved.The world is like a school and we would have to reincarnate again and again until we learn the lessons of Life.we gain this spiritual progress through work, prayer ,and knowledge.So we should help the poor in whatever way we can,be unselfish,don't injure others etc.. and the God will reward us when we die.

Buddha said love for the sake of love.It's not necessary to believe in God in-order to do good things.belief is a small part.And anyone can have the doubt that I have not seen God,So why should I believe ?.I agree with that.God won't show up before us easily.But I don't agree with those who say we can never see God in this life or there is no God at all.I also have not seen God,But I believe the words of the Gurus who say you can see God,and I follow their path.

So God would say, It's okay that you didn't believe in my existence.But you did good things,you have a good character and that's what I expect from a believer or non-believer.

Some quotes by Swami Vivekananda:
* Each soul is potentially divine.
* The goal is to manifest this Divinity within by controlling nature, external and internal.
* Do this either by work, or worship, or psychic control, or philosophy—by one, or more, or all of these—and be free.
* This is the whole of religion. Doctrines, or dogmas, or rituals, or books, or temples, or forms, are but secondary details.
* So long as even a single dog in my country is without food my whole religion is to feed it and serve it, anything excluding that is unreligious.
* Arise, awake and stop not till the goal is reached.
* Serving man is serving God.
* We are responsible for what we are, and whatever we wish ourselves to be, we have the power to make ourselves. If what we are now has been the result of our own past actions, it certainly follows that whatever we wish to be in future can be produced by our present actions; so we have to know how to act.
* You have to grow from the inside out. None can teach you, none can make you spiritual. There is no other teacher but your own soul.
* IT is good to love God for hope of reward, but it is better to love God for love’s sake; and the prayer goes: O Lord, I do not want wealth nor children nor learning. If it be Thy will, I shall go from birth to birth. But grant me this, that I may love thee without the hope of reward - ’love’ unselfishly for love’s sake.
* If money help a man to do good to others, it is of some value; but if not, it is simply a mass of evil, and the sooner it is got rid of, the better.

 

[Midnight Pete]

I've never needed to believe in the supernatural to do good for people.

Funny that.

No, the Golden Rule does not require belief in the supernatural. That's the beauty of it.

 

[ninerbuff]

I just don't agree on the idea that a "bad christian" would go in heaven. Being a christian doesn't make someone excused of his immoral or sinful acts then, when he dies, God will forget everything wrong that he have done and allow that person to be in heaven. Surely, I will not allow a criminal, who pretends to be a long lost relative or friend to enter my house.

ah but the bad christian asked for forgiveness and mercy.......what that doesn't work?

 

[ButTheCatCameBack]

No, the Golden Rule does not require belief in the supernatural. That's the beauty of it.

Nor is it unique to Christianity. But I figure you already know that.

 

[Mister Emu]

A good atheist goes to hell but a really bad christian who says he has repented his sins goes to heaven. Does this seem right to you?

There is no such thing as the former.

 

[Midnight Pete]

Nor is it unique to Christianity. But I figure you already know that.

The Golden Rule is universal. :namaste