A proposed solution for Young Earth Creationism

[Wildswanderer]

No they weren’t

Yes, see the police secretly hired people to riot, so they could get some overtime!

 

[Valjean]

Maybe read the last post, using current technology we have, nothing can detect spiritual things. Then you say they don’t exist. Arrogant in my opinion.

Is your lack of belief in færies, leprechauns or the Flying Spaghetti Monster arrogant?

 

[Valjean]

???? -- What reason does the Bible describe?

I see no reasoning there. It's an unsupported proclamation

 

[Valjean]

I have yet to see a convincing reason for morality in a godless universe. You can have some sort of subjective rules about behavior but not objective morality.

You have yet to understand natural selection.

Because I can literally decide it's moral to kill and eat you. What principles are you talking about and where do they come from?

Empathy, solidarity, consistency.
We've told you where they came from. Empathy was useful. It was selected for.

 

[Wildswanderer]

You have yet to understand natural selection.

Which has nothing to do with morality.

 

[Valjean]

No they weren’t

They were. Everything's peaceful, though disorderly, till the police decide order must be imposed. It's this heavy-handed need to control things and impose order that instigates most of these "riots."
I first saw this in Chicago in '68, and I've seen it play out many times since then. It's usually the police that stir things up and start the violence.
Police Prove Point of Protests by Instigating Violence Across the Country
Why So Many Police Are Handling the Protests Wrong

Turns out, we do know some of these answers. Researchers have spent 50 years studying the way crowds of protesters and crowds of police behave—and what happens when the two interact. One thing they will tell you is that when the police respond by escalating force—wearing riot gear from the start, or using tear gas on protesters—it doesn’t work. In fact, disproportionate police force is one of the things that can make a peaceful protest not so peaceful. But if we know that (and have known that for decades), why are police still doing it?

‘They set us up’: US police arrested over 10,000 protesters, many non-violent

 

[Wildswanderer]

Empathy, solidarity, consistency.
We've told you where they came from. Empathy was useful. It was selected for.

That doesn't make any sense. Empathy isn't a physical trait. How can it be selected for when it's a decision?

 

[Wildswanderer]

They were. Everything's peaceful, though disorderly, till the police decide order must be imposed.

So obeying the law is subjective after all? You can interrupt traffic and break rules if you feel it's ok?

 

[Valjean]

No that's a so called scientific theory called. abiogenesis, "or informally the origin of life (OoL) the natural process by which life has supposedly arisen from non-living matter, such as simple organic compounds.

Exactly!
Religion asserts something came from nothing. Science explores the observable chemistry that led to the development of life. Life from natural chemical interactions.

Wildswanderer said: ↑
That doesn't make any sense. Empathy isn't a physical trait. How can it be selected for when it's a decision?

You think only physical traits can be selected for? You think empathy's a decision?

 

[Wildswanderer]

Exactly!
Religion asserts something came from nothing. Science explores the observable chemistry that led to the development of life. Life from natural chemical interactions.

Which is not actually science at all. It's proposing something that has never been observed. If it can't be repeated, it's not science.

 

[Valjean]

It means take funds away from the police department and use it somewhere else. Translation- not enough law enforcement to catch the bad guys and results in more crime.

It means assisting police in their role as law enforcers by assigning some of their other duties -- duties they're not trained for and don't like -- like mental health or medical intervention, to other departments, making their jobs easier and allowing them to focus on what they were trained to do.

 

[Valjean]

Which is not actually science at all. It's proposing something that has never been observed. If it can't be repeated, it's not science.

It's proposing something that's observed and reproduced in high school and college classrooms every day, and taught in Chemistry 101. There are observable steps, using known chemistry, creating the components of life, watching the components self-combine and reproduce themselves.

The entire process from isolated molecules to free living, self sustaining and reproducing life has not yet been observed. It likely took a million years in nature, but the mechanisms involved are known and understood.

Magic poofing, or anything like it, on the other hand, has never been observed and no process to account for it is known.
Religion's claim of something from nothing remains unevidenced.

 

[Valjean]

Yes, see the police secretly hired people to riot, so they could get some overtime!

Why hire other people when you can do the job yourself?
Agent provocateurs: Police at protests all over the country caught destroying property | MR Online

 

[Valjean]

Where does he lack a moral compass? 2020 with the riots showed this to be true, defund police and no punishment for crime and look what happens.

He said himself he had no moral compass, besides a threat/promise from religion.
Had the police sat down on the curb and just enjoyed the parade marching by, nothing but a short obstruction of traffic would have happened.

 

[Valjean]

When did religion get out of the way? Did people suddenly stop being religious? Many of the people who made major scientific finds were religious people.

And it was scientific methodology, not religion, that led to the finds.
Religion got out of the way when it and its doctrines ceased being consulted on scientific questions.

 

[Wildswanderer]

It's proposing something that's observed and reproduced in high school and college classrooms every day, and taught in Chemistry 101. There are observable steps, using known chemistry, creating the components of life, watching the

So you are claiming they are creating life? They are creating synthetic cells, copying creation. First it's questionable ethically. Second it's not life springing from non life. It's manipulation by humans, which is evidence a creator has to be involved.

 

[Wildswanderer]

He said himself he had no moral compass, besides a threat/promise from religion.
Had the police sat down on the curb and just enjoyed the parade marching by, nothing but a short obstruction of traffic would have happened.

Lol, so you are now abandoning your claims about people having some kind of inherent moral compass and acknowledging that people are basically sinful?
Because your idea that people are justified in rioting if the police do something wrong is a great argument for morality being totally subjective minus some objective standard from a higher source.

 

[Valjean]

So you are claiming they are creating life? They are creating synthetic cells, copying creation. First it's questionable ethically. Second it's not life springing from non life. It's manipulation by humans, which is evidence a creator has to be involved.

They're creating the components of life: membranes, amino acids, nucleic acids, vacuoles, &c, or, rather, they create themseves if the right chemicals come together under the right conditions. They also interact, combine to form structures, and reproduce. The only manipulation involves the right chemicals and right conditions.

Lol, so you are now abandoning your claims about people having some kind of inherent moral compass and acknowledging that people are basically sinful?
Because your idea that people are justified in rioting if the police do something wrong is a great argument for morality being totally subjective minus some objective standard from a higher source.

I'm saying human empathy and compassion vary in both quality and extent. Some people are selfish, some think only of their immediate families, some extend this to larger cultural, ethnic linguistic or political communities, some to the whole species, others to mutiple species. But most people do have enough inborn compassion to function pro-socially within their communities without coercion.

 

[Tiberius]

No, because liking star trek isn't a belief system. I like lots of fictional stories. I don't believe they are true.

Well now, I'm getting confused.

Because back in post 259 you agreed that being a Star Trek fan could count as a religion for some people.

So Star Trek can be a religion, but not a belief system?

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Which in this country were based on the ten commandments.

No.

Let's review:

The only points here that are enforced by law is 6 and 8.

And I can guarantee you that they are not law "because they are part of the 10 commandments".

As for 7, in essence, there certainly is no law against cheating. You're not going to get jailed for it.
But it might work in your disadvantage during divorce. You breached the contract, after all.

So really, it's 2 (and a half - let's throw you a bone) out of 10.
And 2 of them aren't laws merely because of them being part of the 10 commandments.
No society allows murder and thievery. Abrahamic culture or not.


So in short: you could not be more wrong.