Thief
Rogue Theologian
time is not a force...or substance
it is a cognitive device (measurement) created by man to serve Man
time does not exist...other than a quotient on a chalkboard
and God created natural law
-
Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:- Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
- Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
- Access to private conversations with other members.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!
A Universe from Nothing?
- Thread starter Tomorrows_Child
- Start date
it is a cognitive device (measurement) created by man to serve Man
time does not exist...other than a quotient on a chalkboard
and God created natural law
Simply wrong. Time is an aspect of the universe around us. It is crucial for the notion of causality. There is simply no causality without time.
Thief
Rogue Theologian
time is a measure of movement
one measure noted against another
time is not a force
I didn't claim time is a force. I claimed that time is an aspect of our universe and that causality asssumes the existence of time.
Correct. It's a dimension.
Yes. And when there is/was time, these things existed also.
The same thing could be said about distance. But distance is an aspect of our universe. Just like time is.
Causality makes no sense outside the existence of time. So, when you say that in the beginning there was no time, there was also no causality. The existence of the universe *has* to be uncaused since causality is part of the universe.
...or consciousness.
Causality needs a conscious mind to put *this* before or after *that.*
Ben Dhyan
Veteran Member
So how do you know that humans in the generic sense are not eternal?
They are less than 1 million years old according to the fossil record. That is sufficient for me.
Ben Dhyan
Veteran Member
You really have a limited mind, this in a temporary existing planet of an infinite number that are born, live, and die in the eternal nature of existence.
You will have to establish such an 'eternity' with some facts. The current evidence shows the universe to be about 13.7 billion years old, the Earth to be about 4.5 billion years old, and the human species about 1-200,000 years old. if you have any evidence otherwise (as opposed to simple beliefs), please provide it.
Ben Dhyan
Veteran Member
No, if you do not accept an eternal universe as it is, you will have to prove to me how it came from nothing.
Nothing doesn't exist. That's why we call it nothing. There was nothing for the universe to emerge from. Hence there was nothing but the universe.
Time is part of the universe. Causality is dependent on time. So, to ask for a cause for the universe is nonsense. There is no 'coming from' when there is no time. There is no time when there is no universe.
Excellent! That's just what Lawrence Krauss says. I'm kind of fond of framing it as "nothing is impossible," meaning that it is impossible that there should be nothing, for that would deny the very idea of existence itself.
Thief
Rogue Theologian
and in the beginning....there is no dimensions at all
nothing to measure
time does not exist
Thief
Rogue Theologian
for every effect there is a cause
for every cause there is an effect
you can't do any science experiment if you disjoint that relationship
the universe (one word) is the effect
God is the Cause
Thief
Rogue Theologian
note my signature