A Universe from Nothing?

[gnostic]

As someone involved with IT, you must be familiar with Boolean Algebra, computer hardware and software are based on logic circuitry and logic based computations. A or Not A, etc..

In the real world, is not just based on 0 and 1.

The universe is far more complex than Boolean Algebra.

Your inference is based on deductive reasoning, which assume the premise to be true, but that's not necessarily so, because it is still speculation.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

How do we know that existence does not have a beginning? Everything in existence appears to indicate that it does. And yet, how can that be? How can existence come to exist if nothing existed before it, to cause it? It is the great mystery.

We are not talking about the infinite forms that exist, of course they have beginnings, we are talking about sum total of existence itself, which continues regardless of form dissolution, be it a microbe or a galaxy. The mystery disappears when your mind apprehends reality without anthropomorphic projections.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

In the real world, is not just based on 0 and 1.

The universe is far more complex than Boolean Algebra.

Your inference is based on deductive reasoning, which make assume the premise to be true, but it is still speculation.

It is hard to understand what you are saying, so I will have to ask for clarification, please just answer the following questions with a simple yes or no.

Do you believe that nothing has never existed?

Do you believe that something has always existed?

Thank you.

 

[Corvus]

It seems Corvus you are referring to 'nothing' in the relative sense, not in the absolute sense of there being nothing in existence?

Indeed, nothing in the absolute sense, no spatial dimensions, no energy or force fields, no time, no mass, no energy. I am not sure can logically exist, outside of concept.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Indeed, nothing in the absolute sense, no spatial dimensions, no energy or force fields, no time, no mass, no energy. I am not sure can logically exist, outside of concept.

Well said...

 

[Regolith Based Lifeforms]

There is no such thing as evidence.
(drool)

 

[gnostic]

Logic can be evidence, because it's foundation is truthfulness. I am talking about formal logic, not about human rationality, or any particular philosophical theory, or anyone's personal set of philosophical beliefs. Just logic--plain, simple logic.

Logic is "set in its ways," because it has strict rules that, if properly followed, lead to truthfulness. This is universal, the same for everyone, because it was formulated from a study of (literally) how people think. All people, in common. Its rules apply to everyone, objectively.

I don't give a fig about truth. I preferred fact derived from evidences.

Truth don't mean fact, because truth is as subjective as any opinion.

The only real formal logic that I find acceptable is mathematics, not deductive reasoning which you and Ben have been using.

 

[Thief]

I said you can "measure" time - the time to get from one point to the next point, is measurable.

Why would you be stupid enough to want to weigh "time", ben?

Time has no mass.

And only idiot would think to take photo of time or to touch it. Time is not substance or matter.

And you are a hypocrite.

You say time is not real, but a mental construct. Well, you think eternity is real.

So let me ask you the same stupid questions that you had asked me, but substitute "time" for "eternity"?

I ask what is this 'eternity', can you take a picture of it? Can you weigh it? Can you touch it? What substance is it made of? Does it exist outside of the mind?​

Eternity is even more of a mental construct than time, but at least with time, you can measure it, and there are many applications for time.

That's what make "time" real, and your "eternity" not.

saw a scientist interviewed....believing time is a photo.....one after another
movement is an illusion

 

[Thief]

I am not asking to explain "time". And I have no problem with "time", in fact I have been stating that time is real.

.

and that would be the problem

it's not a force or substance

just a measure

and it's all in your head

can't be found anywhere else

 

[Thief]

I don't give a fig about truth. I preferred fact derived from evidences.

Truth don't mean fact, because truth is as subjective as any opinion.

The only real formal logic that I find acceptable is mathematics, not deductive reasoning which you and Ben have been using.

and the rest of the problem is as you have stated

the rest of us don't seem to share your problem

 

[Regolith Based Lifeforms]

There is no such thing as truth
There is no such thing as facts
There is no such thing as time

 

[Regolith Based Lifeforms]

It's time to let RF go down with the trolls.
It's time to give up and let America go to the Russians, Chinese, organized crime and terrorists.
It's time for North Korea to strike.
It's time for man to say goodbye.

 

[Regolith Based Lifeforms]

and the rest of the problem is as you have stated

the rest of us don't seem to share your problem

Yep.
You and Ben are the WINNERS.

 

[gnostic]

There is no such thing as truth
There is no such thing as facts
There is no such thing as time

I would add:

There is no such thing as spirit.
No such thing as god.
No such thing as creator or designer.
No such thing as Cosmic Consciousness.
No such thing as absolute truth, ultimate truth.

 

[Thief]

I would add:

There is no such thing as spirit.
No such thing as god.
No such thing as creator or designer.
No such thing as Cosmic Consciousness.
No such thing as absolute truth, ultimate truth.

that list renders you as a complete mystery
no source of life.....just chemistry
which will fail

and no purpose
no cause for you to be here.....at all

and the end is nothing but a grave

back to the nothing you came from

 

[Regolith Based Lifeforms]

You think?

Or put another way

You think!

I think these pseudo intellectual trolls are not the poor welfare trash on topix. I can tell these folks have some education as well as decent employment, and they're STILL complete MORONS! We are vastly outnumbered, i feel this now and sense there is no recourse. This is a one way ride to wherever it's going.
You should see Ben and Thief. They OWN this thread now. I can't begin to tell you how many of my bosses have been just like them and how many business owners, hiring and floor managers there are that are JUST the SAME way. Complete moron-thugs who are ALWAYS RIGHT.
Great Britain AND America have fallen.
Theology is now law by the majority.

 

[Willamena]

I don't give a fig about truth. I preferred fact derived from evidences.

Truth don't mean fact, because truth is as subjective as any opinion.

The only real formal logic that I find acceptable is mathematics, not deductive reasoning which you and Ben have been using.

Fact is nothing more than truthfulness.

PS: Truth is neither subjective nor objective. If it's true that there is subjectivity and objectivity, then truth is something greater than either.

 

[Willamena]

It is hard to understand what you are saying, so I will have to ask for clarification, please just answer the following questions with a simple yes or no.

Do you believe that nothing has never existed?

Do you believe that something has always existed?

Thank you.

Those are not simple questions, grammar makes them complex.

 

[Regolith Based Lifeforms]

So facts are truth, but truth is...Ah yes, there it is, Truth is subjective. This is the kind of MORON pretzel logic I've come to expect of the American public AND the American worker.
How are any of you gonna hold down a job like that?
By force? Intimidation? Or just fitting in? (by committee)
I never mean anyone harm and i'm really concerned for most of you here. I never thought the public's confusion of terminology was so prevalent as it really is, so now WE ALL have a huge problem.
I'm not going to even try to define truth, fact or subjectivity for any of you, not even by reputable sources with historical precedents.

Let nature run its course is all i can do now.

 

[ChristineM]

It is not a guess, it is the only logical conclusion, unless you have evidence that something can come from nothing. However I understand that if you believe that something from nothing is a possibility, despite there being no evidence, then it is appropriate to say you don't know.

You do not understand entropy Christine, maximum entropy does not mean that everything becomes nothing. As there is no proof that something can come from nothing, there is likewise no proof that something can turn into nothing. If you think otherwise, provide your evidence.

Nonsense. It is the only conclusion you are willing to accept because any of the alternatives kibosh your opinion.

As a great man (Michio Kaku) once said, "it depends on your interpretation of nothing.

Anyway why are you demanding proof from me when all you have is smoke and mirrors reflecting delusion?

You prove time existed before the bb, that is after all what your claim is.