A Universe from Nothing?

[Regolith Based Lifeforms]

No worries RBL, I can understand that you would have a rough ride sharing your experiences with closed minded skeptics. I have had lots of incredible personal psychic experiences and had to learn that unless there is some affinity to the subject being discussed, which usually requires relevant personal experience on the part of others, it will not be an enjoyable discussion. Still, I sometimes enjoy an occasional unjoyable exchange, it can be good mental exercise...

Ah yes, I also have always taken my experiences seriously and tried to understand them based on my technical knowledge and logical understanding. It has sometimes worked out, but somewhere along the way I found out that thought itself can be an obstacle in dealing with psychic phenomena, for I have gotten temporarily lost down so many rabbit holes, wasting much time and effort in the process I now tread carefully.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

"Genesis (same in Spanish, but pronounced as "Henesis)
Vivo
Morpho"
Hmmmm.
So i translate the first two, that's pretty simple, but Morpho doesn't deem to be a word by itself in Spanish ....( ok) ... so i google it direct instead of translate and got those iridescent blue butterflies. I really knew nothing more about them than they exist in the tropics somewhere. important edit, i did not know the name of the butterfly.
Checked the Wiki on it and saw this.
Morpho - Wikipedia

Hope that image comes through...
Darn.... Please do check the link.
Had no idea that they were brownish reddish or beige on the underside at all.
Had no idea they came out of those beautiful green chrysalises.
That bit of deep indigo color is common to see in my set of information, that shade of green is definitely the right shade, The reddish brown and the patterns somewhat reminiscing of eyes, all straight out of the data on all of this. I'm seeing this information on the insect for the first time and i'm guessing this is further coincidental occurrences along the way which ... would you interpret this as a successful 'transformation" as possibly indicated by timing? I dunno myself and i'm not gonna demand in any form whatsoever that this is empirically evident or true by scientific standards. It's just what turns up and it's 'hallmark" is the timing and the fact i know little to nothing about it before i get the thought or whatever it is. Those three words came in my brain in Spanish as a single statement, i checked it out just a few minutes ago and that's what i got.

Yes, the grub - chrysalis - butterfly metamorphosis is a good analogy for the experience a soul must endure in moving into a higher dimension of functioning. The grub is a 2D functioning creature which is first transformed into a chrysalis whereby it is transmuted into a liquid essence and then transformed into a butterfly able to function in 3D space. As to the colors and timing, I usually think of colors in this context as indicative of some stage or other of the awakening, I have generally gone with the 7 color sequence of the visible spectrum, with red being the first stage and purple the final. I know that this is the sequence of the chakras, and chakras represent the seven planes with red being symbolic of the physical. Indigo would be the opening of the 6th chakra, commonly referred to as the third eye, the functioning in the psychic world. When you speak of the colors, do you see simply them in your mind, or do they have some context?

 

[Polymath257]

The issue is that, while you acknowledge consciousness in that which is 'made' (it's not made; it's grown), you do not acknowledge it in that out of which it emerged in one continuous stream. It's not that atoms themselves are conscious; it's that that which is bringing them forth as 'atoms' is conscious, and that is consciousness itself. In your terminology, that would be The Unified Field. IOW, The Universe is consciousness (ie The Unified Field), playing itself as 'The Universe' in all its myriad forms. The scientific evidence for this is the discovery in Quantum Physics that all particles in the universe are actually excitations within their respective fields, hence the new science of 'field theory'. 'Particles' are standing waves, appearing to be particles. All of the mass of the atom is virtual mass. In addition, Quantum Physics does not refer to a Newtonian concept of the world as a 'material' world, but instead as a 'superposition of possibilities'.

And I completely disagree with this.

No, the universe is NOT conscious (except in the limited sense that we are part of the universe and we are conscious).

I strongly suspect you have never actually done any of the math behind quantum filed theories. I have.

No, particles are NOT 'standing waves': instead the wave are probability waves for detection of particles. The wave vector itself (it isn't just a function any more) tells how many particles of each type there are.


But that has *nothing* to do with consciousness at all. Consciousness happens at the level of complex brains.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

So sorry, Ben, my last post, #4991 is for you. I get thus stuff while i'm doing other things or reading the posts here and i just was jotting this one down as it came at that moment just for the fun of it. Funny how i may be telling myself this whole story and this is how "inner transformation" may actually work. All this may be coming from completely in my own brain.
That hypothesis has so far failed inspection because of all the incidences have occurred during daylight or at least awakeness [sic] , there are other witnesses, there is physical evidence at the incident sites. Read my post and ask any questions you can or wish to.

Yes, I think the inner transformation does work analogously this way.

What sort of incidences occurred for which there were witnesses and evidence?

Btw, one very important aspect to the inner transformation process is that of Kundalini, has a snake/serpent appeared to you in your dreams or waking mind state?

 

[godnotgod]

No, particles are NOT 'standing waves': instead the wave are probability waves for detection of particles. The wave vector itself (it isn't just a function any more) tells how many particles of each type there are.

From a cursory Google search, it appears that many would disagree with you, and that your position is behind the times, as you still cling to the old materialist paradigm.

"The 'particle' conception of matter (from ancient Greeks) has caused many problems and paradoxes for modern Physics ... Strangely, it is only in the past 20 years that a pure Wave Structure of Matter (WSM) has been properly examined. We then find (by replacing 'particles' with Spherical Standing Waves) that the natural laws originate from the behavior of the waves and the properties of space.

It will also become clear that the classic point-particle model of charge and mass substance cannot satisfy either the logic of science or the many puzzles of physics. The model is only an historical relic and its presence in the 'Standard Model' of physics is an obstacle to progress....

...The 'Particle' is two identical spherical waves traveling radially in opposite directions so that together they form a spherical standing wave. The wave which travels inward towards the center is called an In-Wave, and the wave traveling outward is an Out-Wave. The nominal location of the ‘Particle’ is the Wave-Center, but as must be true for any charged Particle, it has presence everywhere in Space because the charge forces extend throughout the Universe. [ie it is holographic]...

+

=

In-Wave + Out-Wave = Standing Wave

...The solid crystal array is a matrix of atoms held rigidly in space. How are the atoms suspended in space? We must conclude that the crystal’s rigidity derives from fixed standing waves propagating in a rigid wave medium....

...we see 'photons' as discrete Standing Wave interactions. Thus the transitory modulated waves traveling between two resonances create the illusion of the 'photon particle'.

Physics: Simple Solution to Wave Particle Duality Paradox. Spherical Standing Wave Causes Particle Effect at Wave-Center

 

[godnotgod]

No, the universe is NOT conscious (except in the limited sense that we are part of the universe and we are conscious).

But that has *nothing* to do with consciousness at all. Consciousness happens at the level of complex brains.

That is what you have been led to believe, but it is still only a scientific hypothesis called 'Emergent Theory', which is not actually a scientific theory.

Can you tell me at which point your consciousness leaves off and where the outside 'unconscious' world begins?

And can you also tell me: is The Universe a collection of things that are IN The Universe, or it is those very things themselves?

 

[gnostic]

From a cursory Google search, it appears that many would disagree with you, and that your position is behind the times, as you still cling to the old materialist paradigm.

"The 'particle' conception of matter (from ancient Greeks) has caused many problems and paradoxes for modern Physics ... Strangely, it is only in the past 20 years that a pure Wave Structure of Matter (WSM) has been properly examined. We then find (by replacing 'particles' with Spherical Standing Waves) that the natural laws originate from the behavior of the waves and the properties of space.

It will also become clear that the classic point-particle model of charge and mass substance cannot satisfy either the logic of science or the many puzzles of physics. The model is only an historical relic and its presence in the 'Standard Model' of physics is an obstacle to progress....

...The 'Particle' is two identical spherical waves traveling radially in opposite directions so that together they form a spherical standing wave. The wave which travels inward towards the center is called an In-Wave, and the wave traveling outward is an Out-Wave. The nominal location of the ‘Particle’ is the Wave-Center, but as must be true for any charged Particle, it has presence everywhere in Space because the charge forces extend throughout the Universe. [ie it is holographic]...

+

=

In-Wave + Out-Wave = Standing Wave

...The solid crystal array is a matrix of atoms held rigidly in space. How are the atoms suspended in space? We must conclude that the crystal’s rigidity derives from fixed standing waves propagating in a rigid wave medium....

...we see 'photons' as discrete Standing Wave interactions. Thus the transitory modulated waves traveling between two resonances create the illusion of the 'photon particle'.

Physics: Simple Solution to Wave Particle Duality Paradox. Spherical Standing Wave Causes Particle Effect at Wave-Center

None of which, have any thing to do with consciousness.

 

[gnostic]

Can you tell me at which point your consciousness leaves off and where the outside 'unconscious' world begins?

Repeating the same stupid questions again and again, doesn't make your claim any more "scientific".

Consciousness has no function outside of the brain and the related sensory perceptions (eg. sight, hearing, touch, smell).

There s no consciousness outside of person.

And for goodness sake, don't repost that pseudoscience YouTube video on nonlocal communication again. It is waste of 10 minutes of my life that I won't get back.

 

[Regolith Based Lifeforms]

Yes, the grub - chrysalis - butterfly metamorphosis is a good analogy for the experience a soul must endure in moving into a higher dimension of functioning. The grub is a 2D functioning creature which is first transformed into a chrysalis whereby it is transmuted into a liquid essence and then transformed into a butterfly able to function in 3D space. As to the colors and timing, I usually think of colors in this context as indicative of some stage or other of the awakening, I have generally gone with the 7 color sequence of the visible spectrum, with red being the first stage and purple the final. I know that this is the sequence of the chakras, and chakras represent the seven planes with red being symbolic of the physical. Indigo would be the opening of the 6th chakra, commonly referred to as the third eye, the functioning in the psychic world. When you speak of the colors, do you see simply them in your mind, or do they have some context?

I have seen the solar spectrum of visible light used to represent the chakras and i find no fault at all with using that measuring system for chakras, but this bandwidth of information has it's own spectrum, i would say a very earthy version of a spectrum not unlike the most vivid colors in the butterfly and its chrysalis, maybe a little more saturated. All of the colors have meanings based upon the information in the occurrences and from people in the set of information.
Ramiro was represented by a sapphire blue, Ermasinda was represented by the chartreuse green. The deep indigo represents what happened to my 'brother' and some of the other children in Colorado when the sky was that color, both morning and evening, very unfortunate and illegal these days. It also represents the capacity for compassion in the face of fear and real physical danger. Physical danger and the emotions that give rise to it as well as some forms of sexual desire are represented by the reddish brown. The darker the color the more dangerous the situation is, Back away from dark reddish brown to nearly black and get gone. There is a pure hot orange that represents the constructive expression of anger and a pale yellow which represents the contentment we all once felt when we grew our own food and the crops and fruits came in the late summer free of grocery stores.
There is the chartreuse green of Ermasinda which also represents diplomacy and being well thought of and respected by ones peers for one's ideas and ability to express them.
The indigo has a pastel version at the very same wavelength which often appears with the green when things are at high potential for success or calamity, but they always through it all representing stability through healthy sustainable living. There is also a purplish pink which represents the royalty and i guess a general sense of "enchantment" from the beautiful environment around the Pyrenees and the fact that many of the folks from this region and in the family lineage from Denver are either descended from the local royalty or from the many assistants and administrators to the royal families over a long period of time there in Spain. The light indigo is a most interesting case because so many people of the one family name will keep something prominent or a favored garment in that very color even many generations later and not even be aware that it's from that area. It's in the limestone rocks around the region and there are quite a few dwellings where window frames are painted in various saturations of the color. The color traveled to wherever the family name went and shows up to this day with the family name. I actually do not know if folks of other last names also carried that blue with them when they left that region of Spain and migrated across the world.
There was an experiment i was running to see if i would see some of these folks at the grocery store next door by emitting that color with a crude device that used sunlight to reflect and emit the color and sure enough, there was someone coming up behind me that was very similar to my 'brother', which is extremely rare. I wondered why the phenomenon was occurring behind me, but i pressed on figuring i would eventually get the hang of it. As i was leaving i stopped to talk to a friend and was telling them of this experiment and my result coming in. Just then another fellow with two girls came toward the door and us and the guy was a true to form and frequency as any character out of my information or from Aragon.
He was a PRINCE... or something that looked like one anyway and i pointed my finger right at him and said to my friend "OOOOOOOooooooooo! LOOK LOOK there's one of them right there! That's exactly what they look like and look at his shirt - it's this very same blue and it's from where he's from - and it goes with this green (shirt) i'm wearing, there it is!" The guy stopped and asked what i was doing and i pulled my finger back and apologized for pointing at him, then said it was too complicated to even begin to tell him about. He was in a hurry to get where he was off to and i did not delay him.
I'll tell you more about coincidences tomorrow, getting time for bed now.

 

[gnostic]

That is what you have been led to believe, but it is still only a scientific hypothesis called 'Emergent Theory', which is not actually a scientific theory.

Now you are saying something that I can agree upon.

So any hypothesis isn't true, until they have been rigorously tested, verified by empirical evidences.

And only after more independent testings (eg by peer review) that it might graduate the hypothesis to "scientific theory" status.

A status not achieved by this this nonlocal communication or nonlocal consciousness, or whatever you want to call this.

Yes, there have some testings done, but none of them were really conclusive, especially with some people trying to mix quantum physics with this transcendent consciousness that both you and Ben have been trying to promote.

You can call this nonlocal communication, remote viewing or esp, but they all have the same things in common, they are not scientific theory, but wishful thinking pseudoscience.

That for you to say what you posted above, then nothing you have stated or claim on the subject about nonlocal consciousness is true.

 

[Regolith Based Lifeforms]

Yes, I think the inner transformation does work analogously this way.

What sort of incidences occurred for which there were witnesses and evidence?

Btw, one very important aspect to the inner transformation process is that of Kundalini, has a snake/serpent appeared to you in your dreams or waking mind state?

 

[Regolith Based Lifeforms]

Snake is ever present in the background of life and i'm a snake in the Chinese astrology system. Dragons have appeared with this set of information if only symbolically. There is a google search criteria that places dragons with Aragon simply because of the matching sequence of letters after 'A' or 'Dr', r - a - g - o - n.
Funny thing is, many representations of them when they've come up in the general field of all information coming in have been purple and pink, especially in Aragonite stone carvings of dragons and even one of sorts in a dream i had before i went to Colorado.

 

[godnotgod]

Repeating the same stupid questions again and again, doesn't make your claim any more "scientific".

Consciousness has no function outside of the brain and the related sensory perceptions (eg. sight, hearing, touch, smell).

There s no consciousness outside of person.

And for goodness sake, don't repost that pseudoscience YouTube video on nonlocal communication again. It is waste of 10 minutes of my life that I won't get back.

ha ha...lucky you! Consider it as an irritating grain of sand in the oyster that someday will become a pearl.

If the question is so stupid, why has no one been able to answer it yet? It is a simple question. Why can't you answer it?

"Where does your consciousness leave off and the external world begin?"

C'mon. Prove me wrong.

 

[godnotgod]

Now you are saying something that I can agree upon.

So any hypothesis isn't true, until they have been rigorously tested, verified by empirical evidences.

And only after more independent testings (eg by peer review) that it might graduate the hypothesis to "scientific theory" status.

A status not achieved by this this nonlocal communication or nonlocal consciousness, or whatever you want to call this.

Yes, there have some testings done, but none of them were really conclusive, especially with some people trying to mix quantum physics with this transcendent consciousness that both you and Ben have been trying to promote.

You can call this nonlocal communication, remote viewing or esp, but they all have the same things in common, they are not scientific theory, but wishful thinking pseudoscience.

That for you to say what you posted above, then nothing you have stated or claim on the subject about nonlocal consciousness is true.

Both the video and paper I posted SCIENTIFICALLY prove nonlocal communication between brains. Nonlocal signal-less and instantaneous communication between brains is a SCIENTIFIC FACT, even though no one has been able to explain it, in exactly the same manner that Alain Aspect's experiment with entangled photons proves that two entangled photons have established nonlocal instantaneous communication between one another. This is neither a hypothesis nor a theory, nor pseudoscience, but SCIENTIFIC FACT. But just because this scientific fact does not agree with your indoctrination, you throw down red flags in protest. Are facts a problem for you?

 

[godnotgod]

None of which, have any thing to do with consciousness.

It absolutely does. The particles that are in reality, standing waves, are information, and information is handled by consciousness. Information makes no sense without consciousness and intelligence. We live in an information universe; an intelligent universe of Pure Abstract Intelligence. Science calls this fundamental reality of the universe The Unified Field. Hindus call it Brahman. Buddhists call it The Void, or Sunyata. Christians, Jews, and Muslims call it God. Taoists call it Tao.

 

[gnostic]

ha ha...lucky you! Consider it as an irritating grain of sand in the oyster that someday will become a pearl.

If the question is so stupid, why has no one been able to answer it yet? It is a simple question. Why can't you answer it?

"Where does your consciousness leave off and the external world begin?"

C'mon. Prove me wrong.

But I have answered them, you just don't accept my answer. You are just full of BS.

I have stated repeatedly that consciousness related to the mind, and they are both (mind and consciousness) are tied to the physical brain.

And I have repeatedly stated that consciousness don't exist outside of the brain. There are no evidences to support your claim; yours are just wishful thinking.

These are my answers.

Do I have to agree with you or for me to believe your claim, to have a valid answer?

You keep posting up the same crap YouTube video, which prove nothing, that's not worth the 10 minutes. You gave me linked paper, peer reviewed by the so-called "renowned" quantum physicist, who wrote several pseudoscience books on consciousness and quantum mechanics. And you gave me faulty analogy on TV signals as nonlocal communication between TV sets, as it it is the same remote viewing between brains.

Sorry, godnotgod, but I have answered you; your problem is that you just won't accept my answer.

You are the one who is making claims of the supernatural, so it is up to you show that what you claim to be true. You cannot make claims as you have been, and then shifts the burden of proof to someone else.

 

[godnotgod]

But I have answered them, you just don't accept my answer. You are just full of BS.

I have stated repeatedly that consciousness related to the mind, and they are both (mind and consciousness) are tied to the physical brain.

And I have repeatedly stated that consciousness don't exist outside of the brain. There are no evidences to support your claim; yours are just wishful thinking.

These are my answers.

Do I have to agree with you or for me to believe your claim, to have a valid answer?

You keep posting up the same crap YouTube video, which prove nothing, that's not worth the 10 minutes. You gave me linked paper, peer reviewed by the so-called "renowned" quantum physicist, who wrote several pseudoscience books on consciousness and quantum mechanics. And you gave me faulty analogy on TV signals as nonlocal communication between TV sets, as it it is the same remote viewing between brains.

Sorry, godnotgod, but I have answered you; your problem is that you just won't accept my answer.

You are the one who is making claims of the supernatural, so it is up to you show that what you claim to be true. You cannot make claims as you have been, and then shifts the burden of proof to someone else.

I am afraid you are out of kilter.

Just because you have 'stated repeatedly' that consciousness originates from within the brain does not make it so. That is just dogma, and you have no basis for making such a statement.

If consciousness does not exist outside the brain, then tell me where your consciousness leaves off and the external unconscious world begins. Simple question you have failed to answer, probably because YOU are the one full of BS.

The science applied to the quoted experiment is standard science, and does not have it's source in anything beyond that.

The video simply describes that experiment, which proves that there exists nonlocal signal-less and instantaneous communication between two entangled brains.

You are in denial, gnostic, of FACTS.

You don't even know what you're saying, gnostic. I have never, ever made any claims of the supernatural. That refers to a power above nature. All the while, gnostic, I have only ever referred to a power WITHIN nature. You are quite deluded. Now start paying attention to what is ACTUALLY being said to you, instead of making things up in your own mind. I am getting quite fed up with correcting you and your erroneous logic. Now get your head straight before posting your distorted crap.

Now answer my question: where does your consciousness end and the external world begin?

 

[godnotgod]

Theorist Sean Carroll thinks it’s time you learned the truth: All of the particles you know—including the Higgs—are actually fields.

Carroll’s stunner, at least to many non-scientists, is this: Every particle is actually a field. The universe is full of fields, and what we think of as particles are just excitations of those fields, like waves in an ocean. An electron, for example, is just an excitation of an electron field.

Real talk: Everything is made of fields

 

[ChristineM]

You're the one entranced by masturbation, along with that Polymath guy. All I said was that the universe is prolific. That's not masturbation. Masturbation is only something you and he are attached to in your mind. Otherwise, he would have never mentioned it, and you would'nt have latched onto it the way you did, spinning embarrassment into the mix. I never gave it a thought.

So masturbation is an important part of your everyday life, is it? How quaint.

You are the one pointing fingers and trying (and failing) to make fun of an perfectly natural practice.

So lets get this straight before you w@nk yourself silloy

Polymath said
"I always loved the masturbatory universe model!"

To which you replied
"What's that you say? You can relate to such an idea on a personal basis?" Trying to use masturbatory universe model as ad hominem.

I intervened with
"Whatever turns you on"

Since then you have relished (positively danced a schoolyard jig) object Mocker's and finger pointing. Typical signs of sexual repression's reinforced with religious dogma.

Childishly pathetic

 

[ChristineM]

The metaphor refers to the fact that both exhibit external sources. The difference is that TV signals are in space and time, while the entanglement of both brains is not. This is instantaneous, signal-less communication between them, in the same manner as Alain Aspect's entangled photons. We are talking hologram here.

How do you explain the fact that both EEG's exhibit almost identical patterns when superimposed one over the other? That cannot be due to 'random chance'.

"The difference is that" they are completely different, and any presumed comparator shows either straw man or deliberate ignorance.

Why should i explain? I was not there,but there are several possible reasons. Both subjects were able to see or hear the same thing is just 2. Expectation is another. Also yes, random chance is a possibility considering in similar (esp) experiments random chance can account for up to 37% success rate.

However i am not saying such entanglement cannot exist, there certainly is not enough on evidence to make such a claim. What i am saying is that your analogy between tv and brain is faulty.