Abortion

[McBell]

I would call her none of those things. I'd estimate that over 90% of young women who have abortions are simply scared, afraid to tell their parents about the pregnancy.

Please show your math.

 

[JoStories]

Nothing in your rather verbose posting was really worth note (least of which the personal attack on Jo) save your assertion that humans possess some innate desire to bread. Are you familiar with a rather large movement called Child Free By Choice? Are you aware how the numbers of those choosing not to reproduce are growing? More married women in U.S. aren't having children - latimes There is no innate human need to reproduce. Additionally, there is simply no connection between emotional health and instance of abortion Still True: Abortion Does Not Increase Women’s Risk of Mental Health Problems or of cancer ACOG Committee Opinion No. 434: induced abortion and breast cancer risk. - PubMed - NCBI

Thanks Marisa. I don't get his post at all. Sounded like someone who needed to vent. And you make great points about the over population problem. People like the duggars make,me nauseous. Imagine every family.having that many.

 

[McBell]

2. From a non-religious standpoint especially, there is no higher purpose in life than procreation. I challenge anyone to counter this.

Nothing in your rather verbose posting was really worth note (least of which the personal attack on Jo) save your assertion that humans possess some innate desire to bread. Are you familiar with a rather large movement called Child Free By Choice? Are you aware how the numbers of those choosing not to reproduce are growing? More married women in U.S. aren't having children - latimes There is no innate human need to reproduce. Additionally, there is simply no connection between emotional health and instance of abortion Still True: Abortion Does Not Increase Women’s Risk of Mental Health Problems or of cancer ACOG Committee Opinion No. 434: induced abortion and breast cancer risk. - PubMed - NCBI

Hmmm... don't remember saying we humans had an innate desire to breed. "Bread [sic]" is good though... so not sure on that one....

Who cares if there are people who decide not to reproduce? That has no bearing on my ideas/comments.

:biglaugh:

 

[JoStories]

I really don't care to have a tit for tat with you over misspellings and personal attacks. If that's how you assert your conversational superiority, we won't be getting along.

The subject of abortion is an emotive one. I'm sure you read through my comments and noted that I never suggested it wasn't. I don't personally agree with using words like "parasite" any more than I agree with blowing up poster sized pictures of aborted fetuses and displaying them prominently. Both are attempts to illicit emotional reactions from the "other side". I'm sure you'll agree that acting out of emotionality usually has negative consequences.

It's not my intention to change anyone's opinion on the morality of abortion. I don't possess that much power. I understand that fully. My goal is to get both sides of this conversation to point where we can exhibit mutual respect. No one needs any other person's permission to make their own choices, but it is to our mutual benefit to respect each others right to make choices.

This is what you did say: I'm not sure how vague you think that was, but I got the message crystal clearly, despite my misspelling.

Interesting, I never really thought of the word parasite as being emotive or trying to illicit same. If that is the case, mea culpa and I will stop using it. Mostly it's used from my nursing POV. No malintent was meant by it.

 

[Marisa]

Interesting, I never really thought of the word parasite as being emotive or trying to illicit same. If that is the case, mea culpa and I will stop using it. MosFly it's used from my nursing POV. No malintent was meant by it.

I had this conversation with someone else (pro choice) not too long ago. I imagine that if you're someone that believes that life begins at conception and it's always a baby, that word is probably fairly offensive. I think the description is accurate, but I think there are better ways we can encourage open discussion rather than bristled defensiveness.

 

[JoStories]

I had this conversation with someone else (pro choice) not too long ago. I imagine that if you're someone that believes that life begins at conception and it's always a baby, that word is probably fairly offensive. I think the description is accurate, but I think there are better ways we can encourage open discussion rather than bristled defensiveness.

I agree but as I said, being a nurse, I tend to think of biological concepts in medical terminology. I will, needless to say, be much more mindful. Thanks Marisa. You're awesome.

 

[A Vestigial Mote]

This is what you did say:

And I stand by what I said. My belief is that helping in the production and/or rearing/crafting of the next generation is the single highest purpose one can possess in life. No other animal on Earth pretends differently than this. I believe it is our "precious intellect" that entertains us with delusions that we're "meant for more".

 

[A Vestigial Mote]

Thanks Marisa. I don't get his post at all. Sounded like someone who needed to vent. And you make great points about the over population problem. People like the duggars make,me nauseous. Imagine every family.having that many.

Oh yeah - my post was such a mystery. Having read post after post after post where the destruction of life was defended tooth and nail, with little to no emotion being "allowed" into the conversation - even to the point of near derision being shown when the other half of the argument went anywhere near emotion. So very mysterious...

 

[A Vestigial Mote]

1. I'm legally blind and increasing the font makes it easier for me to make sure there are little to no spelling errors. I need a magnifying glass to read yours, and frankly, I am getting tired of having to explain this..

Thought to let you know - in case you don't know already - that holding the CTRL key on your keyboard while rotating your mouse-wheel forward/upward at the same time increases the font size within most content on just about any website out there in the majority of modern browsers.

 

[Marisa]

I agree but as I said, being a nurse, I tend to think of biological concepts in medical terminology. I will, needless to say, be much more mindful. Thanks Marisa. You're awesome.

My mom was a nurse and she did as well. Thanks for the kudos, they are much appreciated!

 

[McBell]

Oh yeah - my post was such a mystery. Having read post after post after post where the destruction of life was defended tooth and nail, with little to no emotion being "allowed" into the conversation - even to the point of near derision being shown when the other half of the argument went anywhere near emotion. So very mysterious...

as if you weren't posting like an emotionally lost prom queen the morning after....

 

[JoStories]

as if you weren't posting like an emotionally lost prom queen the morning after....

It's an emotional topic. I try to remain unemotional but with this,topic, because I was raped and got pregnant, necessitating an abortion in the 60's, I can't always remain so. But I think that most get heated with this one, understandably.

 

[JoStories]

Thought to let you know - in case you don't know already - that holding the CTRL key on your keyboard while rotating your mouse-wheel forward/upward at the same time increases the font size within most content on just about any website out there in the majority of modern browsers.

Thanks but I use an iPad to come here and that option is not available. I appreciate the info however.

 

[Bunyip]

It's an emotional topic. I try to remain unemotional but with this,topic, because I was raped and got pregnant, necessitating an abortion in the 60's, I can't always remain so. But I think that most get heated with this one, understandably.

Brave. Kudos.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

I would call her none of those things. I'd estimate that over 90% of young women who have abortions are simply scared, afraid to tell their parents about the pregnancy. The last thing either of us would do a frightened person is traumatize them physically and emotionally.

People are traumatized when they are told they must sacrifice their bodies against their consent, fyi.

Here are some findings of who chooses induced abortions.

• Eighteen percent of U.S. women obtaining abortions are teenagers; those aged 15–17 obtain 6% of all abortions, 18–19-year-olds obtain 11%, and teens younger than 15 obtain 0.4%.

• Women in their 20s account for more than half of all abortions: Women aged 20–24 obtain 33% of all abortions, and women aged 25–29 obtain 24%.

• Non-Hispanic white women account for 36% of abortions, non-Hispanic black women for 30%, Hispanic women for 25% and women of other races for 9%.

• Thirty-seven percent of women obtaining abortions identify as Protestant and 28% identify as Catholic.

• Women who have never married and are not cohabiting account for 45% of all abortions.

• About 61% of abortions are obtained by women who have one or more children.

• Forty-two percent of women obtaining abortions have incomes below 100% of the federal poverty level ($10,830 for a single woman with no children).

• Twenty-seven percent of women obtaining abortions have incomes between 100–199% of the federal poverty level. *

And why induced abortion is chosen...

• The reasons women give for having an abortion underscore their understanding of the responsibilities of parenthood and family life. Three-fourths of women cite concern for or responsibility to other individuals; three-fourths say they cannot afford a child; three-fourths say that having a baby would interfere with work, school or the ability to care for dependents; and half say they do not want to be a single parent or are having problems with their husband or partner.

• Fifty-one percent of women who have abortions had used a contraceptive method in the month they got pregnant, most commonly condoms (27%) or a hormonal method (17%).

Source: Induced Abortion in the United States

Basically, it generally comes down to severe lack of resources/income, or existing obligations to family, partner, or children. Suggesting a moralizing argument of selfishness or calling pregnancies "inconveniences" is unhelpful and further traumatizes women who do not want to be pregnant discover that they are.

 

[BilliardsBall]

Please show your math.

I was the assistant director of a women's clinic for several years. Almost invariably, when a mom discovered her daughter was pregnant, she said "This isn't the timing I had for you at this age, unwed, but I love my daughter and will love my grandchild."

Black or white, wealthy or poor, about 90%-plus of the young people coming to us pregnant were wanting to not tell their parents, period. There was little need to preach at anyone. Simply ask them if they'd be willing to sit down with their parents in a safe environment with a counselor present and poof-no more abortion-and they wanted to either become parents or give their child to adoptive parents.

 

[McBell]

I was the assistant director of a women's clinic for several years. Almost invariably, when a mom discovered her daughter was pregnant, she said "This isn't the timing I had for you at this age, unwed, but I love my daughter and will love my grandchild."

Black or white, wealthy or poor, about 90%-plus of the young people coming to us pregnant were wanting to not tell their parents, period. There was little need to preach at anyone. Simply ask them if they'd be willing to sit down with their parents in a safe environment with a counselor present and poof-no more abortion-and they wanted to either become parents or give their child to adoptive parents.

So nothing but your personal experiences?

 

[MysticSang'ha]

I was the assistant director of a women's clinic for several years. Almost invariably, when a mom discovered her daughter was pregnant, she said "This isn't the timing I had for you at this age, unwed, but I love my daughter and will love my grandchild."

Black or white, wealthy or poor, about 90%-plus of the young people coming to us pregnant were wanting to not tell their parents, period. There was little need to preach at anyone. Simply ask them if they'd be willing to sit down with their parents in a safe environment with a counselor present and poof-no more abortion-and they wanted to either become parents or give their child to adoptive parents.

What kind of women's clinic was this?

 

[columbus]

I was the assistant director of a women's clinic for several years. Almost invariably, when...

You're beating your head against the walls of a pro-abortion echo chamber.
If you bring up real life events the response will begin with "Anecdotes don't prove that...."
If you bring up statistics the response will begin with "Well I remember once when..."

Tom

 

[Cephus]

What kind of women's clinic was this?

Crisis Pregnancy Center I'm sure.