If it's so "obvious", then perhaps you can lay out in detail the logic whereby you have reached such an "obvious" conclusion. Or are you just talking to be talking?
why atheists attack on the idea of an intelligent creator? isn't it possible that an intelligent creator might exist? most atheists act like this is absurd.
why atheists attack on the idea of an intelligent creator? isn't it possible that an intelligent creator might exist? most atheists act like this is absurd.
What makes you believe that?
I wouldn't feel any particular reason to change my conduct. Unless such a Being described something better. But that isn't the same thing.
My conduct isn't especially different from the religious people around me. It never has been.
Tom
Most of us atheist can care less, really. I mean, the word god does not mean anything to me. My conduct has changed because I believe in spirits of our loved ones and the spirit of life in general. This creative spirit of life IS everything and everyone.
Unfortunately, not many people choose to live by this spirit. They have a need to be told their purpose instead of finding it in the spirit of themselves. It makes arahamic believers and those of like minds territorial in their beliefs that other theists such as Hindu, Pagan, do not share. Its an ugly nature of character.
If you felt a twinge or uneasy feeling just then from above, that is how many atheist feel when believers speak of us as if we are ignorant to Their truth. Its an inapropriate assumption regardless of fact or opinion.
I read this beautitful quote, "the way you communicate reveals everything about you. Words are the clothes your thoughts wear" ~Amanda Patterson
A lot of us atheist know there is no god. We know this so there is nothing we are in denial of. Those atheist who have found their passion, their conduct is changed by it.
I dont understand, why do we need an intelligent creator to live life. We arent against the creator, just for me personally, it is absurd to entertain the idea there is one only to talk against it as if it exists without saying it does not. Leaving a "just in case." But this isnt most atheist. Just probably a lot of online ones. Most people probably dont care.
why atheists attack on the idea of an intelligent creator? isn't it possible that an intelligent creator might exist? most atheists act like this is absurd.
Why do you think this?
Spirals didn't need to exist before there were spiral galaxies. Carbon didn't need to exist before a star collapsed under its own weight and created some.
I see no obvious reason for intelligence to be other than an emergent property of certain, rather limited, lifeforms either.
Carbon forms when gravity crunches some lighter elements so hard the atoms break and reform into heavier ones. Do you think gravity intends to produce carbon? Or does it just happen?
Tom
I see that there are different forms of logic for everybody; what they consider valid.
you are either on one side of the fence or the other, very little crossing over.
to me a valid and worthwhile assertion is that intelligence is fundamental to existence and life forms are created or spawned from intelligence.
it seems to me absurd that lifeless, mindless matter can produce sentient life. I don't consider that plausible.
to each his own. there are competing forces in nature, and intelligence is one of them, and it has probably always been around.
..... and to me where there is intelligence there is a mind, where there is a mind there is a person, where there is a person there is a personality. According to Psalms 90:2 that person has always been around.
Interesting to me that you think ' creative force ' because Scripture agrees with that according to Psalms 104:30 that when the Creator God sends forth His spirit ( His energizing force ) things are created.
..... and to me where there is intelligence there is a mind, where there is a mind there is a person, where there is a person there is a personality. According to Psalms 90:2 that person has always been around.
But this still logically contradicts the premise of ID. It just pushes the question back a stage and calls it a mystery.
"Where did God's intelligence come from? ".
Tom
why atheists attack on the idea of an intelligent creator? isn't it possible that an intelligent creator might exist? most atheists act like this is absurd.
It is only a general thought and not universally true, and of course there are exceptions. Many Non-Christians try to live a moral life. Over the years I have noticed that many Non-Christians are very hostile to Christianity. I understand some don't believe it, been there, done that, but I don't understand the hostility to it.
I wouldn't feel any particular reason to change my conduct. Unless such a Being described something better. But that isn't the same thing.
My conduct isn't especially different from the religious people around me. It never has been.
Tom
Conduct is not the main difference. The main difference is what we accept as true. I doubt if you have the same beliefs about what is sin as conservative Christians do. For example is fornication a sin in your moral standard? How about same sex marriage?
Most of us atheist can care less, really. I mean, the word god does not mean anything to me. My conduct has changed because I believe in spirits of our loved ones and the spirit of life in general. This creative spirit of life IS everything and everyone.
Your theology is formed from your personal opinions. It can't be substantiated.
There is a way that seems right to a man, but its end is the way of death(Prov 14:12).
Unfortunately, not many people choose to live by this spirit. They have a need to be told their purpose instead of finding it in the spirit of themselves. It makes arahamic believers and those of like minds territorial in their beliefs that other theists such as Hindu, Pagan, do not share. Its an ugly nature of character.
If you felt a twinge or uneasy feeling just then from above, that is how many atheist feel when believers speak of us as if we are ignorant to Their truth. Its an inapropriate assumption regardless of fact or opinion.
A lot of us atheist know there is no god. We know this so there is nothing we are in denial of. Those atheist who have found their passion, their conduct is changed by it.
You don't know there is no God. The existence of God can' be proved or disproved.
I dont understand, why do we need an intelligent creator to live life. We arent against the creator, just for me personally, it is absurd to entertain the idea there is one only to talk against it as if it exists without saying it does not. Leaving a "just in case." But this isnt most atheist. Just probably a lot of online ones. Most people probably dont care.
As a recovering atheist , I think deep down I just liked atheism better than theism- it offered (I thought) a simpler and more comfortable model of reality for me. I was taught that atheism was more 'intellectually sophisticated' and I was guilty of believing this
It seems to me that it's theism that offers the simplistic picture of reality. Theists need offer no explanation nor posit any mechanism. "Goddidit" explains everything. It substitutes for critical analysis, it's an appeal to magic. How could you get more simplistic than that?
Most of all, by definition, a-theism teaches you to scrutinize every belief other than your own, to even refuse to acknowledge your own belief as such- and that makes it particularly difficult to escape
First of all, atheism has no beliefs to scrutinize. Why can't you get this through your head?
It's theism that's faith-based. It's theism that accepts an unsupported premise. Atheists generally adopt a rational or scientific approach -- a critical analysis of every proposal. Isn't one of the steps in the scientific method the attempt to disprove one's own hypothesis, and to invite criticism from others?
No, GT. You've got it completely backwards. You're projecting.
From Wiki:
Psychological projection is a theory in psychology in which humans defend themselves against their own unconscious impulses or qualities (both positive and negative) by denying their existence in themselves while attributing them to others.
This is interesting, because perspectives like this strike me as a consequence of not having an animistic worldview. For the animist, there is no "mindless matter," the word "person" does not necessarily mean "human," and "intelligence/sentience" (if one uses those terms) is an attribute granted to a much wider variety of things in our world. Maybe that's why I reject the idea of some intelligent creator deity. For an animist it becomes redundant, as the universe is already seen as populated by millions of persons that co-create the world.
