Answered Prayers

[Stevicus]

Why do we presume that God is supposed to be our servant?

Not servant, but parent. A lot of people view God as being in a parental role. That's often because of how religion presents God, as a parent who loves us all.

Add to that the hucksterism which exists among different religions competing for parishioners, then all kinds of wild promises can be made. Like Robert Tilton claiming people will get paid back many more times the amount they donate to his ministry. A lot of people might see that as sending their money to God, so if God doesn't fulfill their prayer request, they might feel cheated. This is America, where we expect to get something for our money.

 

[Trailblazer]

A choice in altered by becoming aware of information or circumstances of which one is previously unaware.

I don't know what you mean.

 

[Trailblazer]

Not servant, but parent. A lot of people view God as being in a parental role. That's often because of how religion presents God, as a parent who loves us all.

I don't think all religions view God as a parent. That belief comes from Christianity, since Christians believe we are God's children.
The Baha'i Faith does not teach that.

 

[Trailblazer]

Why do we presume that God is supposed to be our servant?

I do not presume that. I presume that I am a servant of God.
I think that people who presume that God is our servant have it backwards.

 

[danieldemol]

I don't think all religions view God as a parent. That belief comes from Christianity, since Christians believe we are God's children.
The Baha'i Faith does not teach that.

'Blessed be the Lord Who is the Father! He, verily, is come unto the nations in His most great majesty. Turn your faces towards Him, O concourse of the righteous… This is the day whereon the Rock (Peter) crieth out and shouteth, and celebrateth the praise of its Lord, the All-Possessing, the Most High, saying: ‘Lo! The Father is come, and that which ye were promised in the Kingdom is 85 fulfilled!…’ '
Source: Bahá'í Reference Library - Proclamation of Bahá’u’lláh, Pages 83-86

 

[Trailblazer]

'Blessed be the Lord Who is the Father! He, verily, is come unto the nations in His most great majesty. Turn your faces towards Him, O concourse of the righteous… This is the day whereon the Rock (Peter) crieth out and shouteth, and celebrateth the praise of its Lord, the All-Possessing, the Most High, saying: ‘Lo! The Father is come, and that which ye were promised in the Kingdom is 85 fulfilled!…’ '
Source: Bahá'í Reference Library - Proclamation of Bahá’u’lláh, Pages 83-86

That the Lord is referred to as 'the Father' does not mean that the Baha'i Faith teaches that we are God's children.
That is a Christian teaching. The Baha'i Faith does not teach that.

 

[danieldemol]

That the Lord is referred to as 'the Father' does not mean that the Baha'i Faith teaches that we are God's children.
That is a Christian teaching. The Baha'i Faith does not teach that.

I have this problem with Muslims all the time. These one man sects want to speak for all Muslims in telling what "Islam" teaches and i say to them, "identify your sect" so as to avoid confusion in all the contradictory things that Islam allegedly teaches.

The same should apply for the Baha'i faith in my view. If you are not talking about what the majority Baha'i sect teaches then identify your sect.

Otherwise the true spokespeople for the (majority) Baha'i faith have been quite clear as I see it.

For example;
'The earth is one native land, one home; and all mankind are the children of one Father. God has created them, and they are the recipients of His compassion. Therefore, if anyone offends another, he offends God. It is the wish of our heavenly Father that every heart should rejoice and be filled with happiness'
Source: Bahá'í Reference Library - The Promulgation of Universal Peace, Pages 468-470

 

[Left Coast]

#notalltheists

Don't generalize LC

A generality is not an absolute. You're a different sort of theist than most. My comments weren't meant to be personal.

 

[The Hammer]

A generality is not an absolute. You're a different sort of theist than most. My comments weren't meant to be personal.

I caught that a post or two later, where I rated you friendly

Edit: Although, you may be surprised to hear that many people seem to equate generalizations with absolutes. *Eye roll*

 

[Trailblazer]

For example;
'The earth is one native land, one home; and all mankind are the children of one Father. God has created them, and they are the recipients of His compassion. Therefore, if anyone offends another, he offends God. It is the wish of our heavenly Father that every heart should rejoice and be filled with happiness'
Source: Bahá'í Reference Library - The Promulgation of Universal Peace, Pages 468-470

Show me where Baha'u'llah said that and I will believe it. I have issues with Abdu'l-Baha, much to the chagrin of other Baha'is.
Abdu'l-Baha was supposed to be appointed as the interpreter of Baha'u'llah's Writings, but I think he added onto them. That bothers me, especially when it is not something Baha'u'llah ever wrote.

 

[danieldemol]

Show me where Baha'u'llah said that and I will believe it. I have issues with Abdu'l-Baha, much to the chagrin of other Baha'is.
Abdu'l-Baha was supposed to be appointed as the interpreter of Baha'u'llah's Writings, but I think he added onto them. That bothers me, especially when it is not something Baha'u'llah ever wrote.

Well first of all, when you say 'the Baha'i Faith teaches' you should know that the people you are talking to will think you are talking about the teachings of the majority Baha'i sect, and most Baha'i would see Abdul-Baha as the legitimate spokesperson for the Baha'i teachings, so in my view there is already enormous potential to mislead or confuse people if you are going to identify your own personal teachings as that of the Baha'i faith particularly where they clearly contradict the teachings of Abdul-Baha who is it's spokesman.

Second of all, being a "father" inherently implies having children. One is not a father and also childless at the same time as I see it. So I have already quoted Baha'u'llah reffering to the Father God. Who did you imagine God to be the Father of? Why do you think Baha'u'llah quotes a Christian scripture (thereby legitimising it) if the concept of God as the Father is anathema to his teachings?

 

[ppp]

I don't know what you mean.

No doubt.

 

[Trailblazer]

Well first of all, when you say 'the Baha'i Faith teaches' you should know that the people you are talking to will think you are talking about the teachings of the majority Baha'i sect, and most Baha'i would see Abdul-Baha as the legitimate spokesperson for the Baha'i teachings, so in my view there is already enormous potential to mislead or confuse people if you are going to identify your own personal teachings as that of the Baha'i faith particularly where they clearly contradict the teachings of Abdul-Baha who is it's spokesman.

There are no Baha'i sects, there is only the Baha'i Faith. My feelings about Abdu'l-Baha are my problem, they don't represent the Baha'i Faith.
I did not know what Abdu'l-Baha said about being children of God until you pointed it out, my mistake. So I guess you can say that the Baha'i Faith teaches that.

Second of all, being a "father" inherently implies having children. One is not a father and also childless at the same time as I see it. So I have already quoted Baha'u'llah reffering to the Father God. Who did you imagine God to be the Father of? Why do you think Baha'u'llah quotes a Christian scripture (thereby legitimising it) if the concept of God as the Father is anathema to his teachings?

Being a "father" inherently implies having children if you are a human being, but God is not a human being, which is why I think it is really dumb to say we are children of God. Just my opinion.

Abdu'l-Baha said "all mankind are the children of one Father." I don't have a problem with that.
God is the Father of humanity is not the same as saying we are children of God.

 

[Trailblazer]

No doubt.

I doubt anyone else would know either....
Anyone who things they know what you meant is free to chime in. I am all ears.

TB said: No, not exactly, because God can alter an impending fate if He chooses to do so.
ppp said: A choice in altered by becoming aware of information or circumstances of which one is previously unaware.

Does anyone understand what ppp meant?

 

[ppp]

I doubt anyone else would know either....

No doubt.

 

[danieldemol]

There are no Baha'i sects, there is only the Baha'i Faith.

To the contrary in addition to the majority sect which people would generally mean when they are talking about the Baha'i faith there are the Orthodox Baha'i, the Unitarian Baha'i, the Free Baha'i to name a few.

According to Wikipedia;

'Most Baháʼís are unaware of the small Baháʼí divisions that exist.[8]'
Source: Covenant-breaker - Wikipedia

God is the Father of humanity is not the same as saying we are children of God.

I'm not even going to bother asking what the difference is due to my dislike of what I see as misleading semantics

 

[ppp]

There are no Baha'i sects, there is only the Baha'i Faith

There are at least four. Just none that your sect recognizes.

 

[ppp]

There are no Baha'i sects, there is only the Baha'i Faith

There are at least four. Just none that your sect recognizes.

 

[Trailblazer]

There are at least four. Just none that your sect recognizes.

Are there any sects in the Baha'i faith?

No there are not. Let’s explore why.

There are many writers/authors who for some reason have strong polemical views towards this Faith and would unhesitatingly answer “YES!” to this question. They will then provide you with a link to the websites of some sects founded by various individuals who have claimed to succeed the Founder, Baha’u’llah, and who managed to attract a following.

What these writers fail to mention is that all of these individuals/”sects” have fallen apart in a short span of time, usually within the lifetime of the individual who started them. The other fact that these individuals fail to mention is that all of these sects combined may comprise between 0–1% of the actual, legitimate Faith lead by the Universal House of Justice in Haifa today. That 0–1% isn’t one of these sects, it’s all of them combined. And the reason I mention the Faith lead by the Universal House of Justice as the “legitimate” Faith is because…it is the legitimate Baha’i Faith. Baha’u’llah explicitly “said so” Himself. More on this below.

The last neglected fact is that the founder of the Baha’i Faith established a Covenant with His Followers that *Very* *clearly* *delineated* the succession and structure of His Faith in a Will and Testament called the “Book of the Covenant” which you’re free to read if you’d like.

Tablets of Bahá’u’lláh Revealed After the Kitáb-i-Aqdas

These provisions have been faithfully followed by conservatively 99% of the following throughout the last two centuries, showing the unique power of Baha’u’llah’s Covenant. There’s not another independent Faith that’s been founded since Baha’u’llah’s time that’s remained so unified.

So the answer to your question, if we’re fair and honest and willing to admit something which we may not like for whatever reasons, is “NO”. There are no sects in the Baha’i Faith.

Are there any sects in the Baha'i faith?

Answer (1 of 23): After the death of Bahá'u'lláh, divisions emerged in Bahá'íism, which reached their peak during Shoghi Effendi's time. [98] Some of the divisions of this sect are as follows: Monotheistic Bahá'ís: Bahá'ís who believe that after Bahá'u'lláh, his son Mirza Muhammad Ali (Ghosn Akb...

www.quora.com

 

[Trailblazer]

I (don't) wonder why this thread, which was supposed to be about Answered Prayers has now degenerated into another thread to bash the Baha'i Faith.

Carry on.