Nanda
Polyanna
Unless I've missed something, that's just a book with illustrations. Not the same thing at all.
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Are Comic Books Literature?
- Thread starter Trey of Diamonds
- Start date
Unless I've missed something, that's just a book with illustrations. Not the same thing at all.
d.
_______
literature is writing. fantasy literature is literature.
cardero
Citizen Mod
What about those comics that don't include words? Once and awhile a comic issue will come out with no words. Marvel experimented with this technique throughout all their monthly titles. It was a promotional entitled "Nuff said". Could or should we still consider this as literature?
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painted wolf
Grey Muzzle
I always thought literature was printed story telling.
wa:do
wa:do
ayani
member
i agree with tomspug. yes, it's literature, but the style and quality of that literature can be poor or high. which is also, of course, largely a matter of opinion.
but graphic novels like Marjane's Persepolis and Chicken With Plums certainly do have a complex literary quality to them. they record public history, personal narrative, varied political ideologies, and private joys and sufferings, often with beautiful or striking artwork. they often depict human characters with amazing and touching grace, subtlety, and humor.
they can be considered important contributions to public social, political, and cultural dialog, and do much to encourage others to freely express their ideas, feelings, and stories, in writing or in pictures.
but graphic novels like Marjane's Persepolis and Chicken With Plums certainly do have a complex literary quality to them. they record public history, personal narrative, varied political ideologies, and private joys and sufferings, often with beautiful or striking artwork. they often depict human characters with amazing and touching grace, subtlety, and humor.
they can be considered important contributions to public social, political, and cultural dialog, and do much to encourage others to freely express their ideas, feelings, and stories, in writing or in pictures.
painted wolf
Grey Muzzle
Not to mention there are things/ideas that can be best expressed with pictures rather than words. The use of color (or tone) to highlight mood and drama for example.
Mixing art and words can have a much more profound effect than just words alone.
wa:do
Mixing art and words can have a much more profound effect than just words alone.
wa:do
d.
_______
they're texts. comics aren't.
ok, that's a nice definition, and perfectly valid i guess. but what i get from the whole 'comics is literature' discussion (not just here) is that people are trying to 'elevate' comics by saying it's literature. i say comics is a perfectly valid art form in its own right - there's obviously nothing in the medium that makes it less capable of carrying whatever constitutes 'great art'.
i just find the usage of "literature" as a qualitative term confusing and ultimately alienating(i feel the same about the word 'art'). 'literature' to me is a word relating to a medium.
btw, i say this as someone who deeply appreciates comics and also has some experience in working with both mediums.
rojse
RF Addict
I suppose if you want something that sounds as pretentious as "literature" that applies to graphic novels/comic books...
Trey of Diamonds
Well-Known Member
I disagree. People don't want to elevate comics, they just want the recognition they deserve. Comics are a hybrid, a combination of Art and Literature. You say that they are not literature but are an art form. Well plenty of artists would scoff and say drawing funny pictures is not art. They are wrong just as its wrong to say that comics are not literature. Comics are both, art and literature.
Nanda
Polyanna
Sometimes it's more fun to say "I'm a Sequential Art major," than, "I draw cartoons."
d.
_______
which is a good thing, but i feel that questioning the idea that ''literature' is much better than 'comics' is a lot better than saying that comics=literature.
it's like saying a three-minute pop song is a symphony, because a lot of people believe that 'classical music' is better, 'more elevated', than pop songs.
not exactly, though i understand my choice of words was confusing. what i mean by 'art form' here is 'form of expression', not 'visual art'.
Trey of Diamonds
Well-Known Member
Your analogy is very bad. Try this one. A pop song is music, but it is not a symphony. A comic book is literature, but it is not a sonnet. Saying a comic is not literature because a pop song is a symphony is like saying only a symphony is music. It just doesn't work as an analogy.
So Art comes is different forms but Literature is restricted to only one form? Since when? If this was true then Literature would not have been able to evolve over time to include all the different forms that it now has in it. Why shouldn't it include Comics now just like Art evolved to include cubism, impressionists and all the other new forms that came along?
Awesome list-I second the highlighted!
I really really wanted to like Blankets, and I like Thompson's other stuff, but it left me cold and kind of annoyed. I couldn't sympathize enough with him to gain any emotional attachment. But he does capture that high school first serious love thing rather well.
And while I like Vaughan, and Pride' is good, as is Y and Ex Machina, his voice is consistent in everything he writes. He's a bit too dependent on the Whedon school of pop-culture reference as style.
Can't praise Lone Wolf' enough! And the movies are amazing as well!
I'll add Concrete, anything by the Hernandez Bros. especially Love and Rockets, anything Clowes, When the Wind Blows still makes me weep like a wuss every time I read it, Scott McCloud (of course!), Deitch's The Boulevard of Broken Dreams, and my all time favorite little known secret Eagle: The Making of an Asian-American President.
painted wolf
Grey Muzzle
Or performance art.... or Dada... weird stuff.
wa:do
wa:do
d.
_______
i'm saying that what people are trying to do when they call comics literature is the same thing they're trying to do when they call a pop song a symphony. they're trying to say 'this is as good as high culture'.
but by saying that, they're kind of accepting that the medium itself has some kind of lower worth than literature and classical music. but i feel that comics is just a good a medium for human expression as literature. it's its own medium.
comics aren't just illustrated text. it's a lot more, and should be understood and valued on its own terms.
art form as in 'the arts' not as in 'visual arts'.