Are Religions and Gods manmade?

[Trailblazer]

So if governments around the world decide to stick with the present course, you're fine with that

I am fine with that for now because I know that it will change eventually, because if Baha'u'llah....

Isaiah 9:6-7 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace. Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the Lord of hosts will perform this.

Baha’is believe that Baha’u’llah was the Prince of Peace because world peace will be established during His religious dispensation. Baha’u’llah set up a system of government and it has already been established among the Baha’is. The institutions of that government are fully operational, but still in their infancy. They will be more developed in the future as the prophecy says (increase in government). Eventually governments will choose to adopt what the Baha'is have built, but it will always be voluntary.

Are these social problems?

■The oneness of God
■The essential unity of religion
■The unity of mankind
■Harmony of religion and science
■Independent investigation of truth
■The need for universal compulsory education
■The need for a universal auxiliary language
■Obedience to government and non-involvement in partisan politics

No, they are not social problems, but if everyone understood them and put them into place, that would eliminate the social problems we now see.

When you educate people are you talking about everyone even the educated Western world or just the uneducated third world?

We are talking about the whole world, that is what is meant by 'universal' compulsory education.

Who will set the curriculum for either group?

Who will do the teaching?

I suppose that how education will be handled will vary widely according to the country.

 

[Trailblazer]

I didn't say that.

I said you give no reasons for your belief Baha'is will work other than your own entrenched beliefs.

I give reasons they will not work.

The reason it will work is very simple. It was ordained by an Almighty God, and what God has ordained cannot fail because God is infallible. Sure that is a belief, but all you have is a personal opinion, which is based solely upon what you see in the present world, but that is nothing to base an opinion upon because people can change. It is never easy, but it is possible.

“The world’s equilibrium hath been upset through the vibrating influence of this most great, this new World Order. Mankind’s ordered life hath been revolutionized through the agency of this unique, this wondrous System—the like of which mortal eyes have never witnessed.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 136

“Beseech ye the one true God to grant that all men may be graciously assisted to fulfil that which is acceptable in Our sight. Soon will the present-day order be rolled up, and a new one spread out in its stead. Verily, thy Lord speaketh the truth, and is the Knower of things unseen.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 7

We see that new world order slowly emerging all over the world.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

So no restrictions to rid the world of recreational drug use. Does that mean you will go for total war against all recreational drug use?

How is the War on Drugs fairing so far?

Whose morals and virtue?

These issues will be decided by the Majority. Individual action is not appropriate.

I see the drug lords will not go out without a fight, do you see them singing kumbaya any time soon?

Regards Tony

 

[Trailblazer]

These issues will be decided by the Majority. Individual action is not appropriate.

Just like the U.S. election.

 

[joelr]

All you accomplished, was in knocking down a straw man. Your reference actually supports my Old Earth pov.

And you just ignored all the other evidences.... which, BTW, I did not get from a creationist website! Most of them are YEC believers, I am not.

You have to say something. Right now you are saying nothing.

I posted current science that does not support any flood ever. You failed to produce a counter-argument so that stands. No flood.
You did not explain what you consider a strawman, so that is moot.
You did not answer to the fact that myths are not historical. You did not answer to the fact that not only are these myths they are copied from older myths from Mesopotamian sources. And the rest of the OT is full of improbable stories about Gods and archeology confirms that events like Exodus did not happen and Moses and the Patriarchs are myth.
The apoctalyiptic, world ends in fire, people resurrect, a world messiah, good vs evil, hell/Satan were taken from Persian myths and not part of the Israelite religion until the Persian occupation which was 300 years long.
So Noah is most definitely a Bronze Age fiction. Creationisn, Old Earth pov...whatever? Still not real no matter which group?

 

[joelr]

Bahaullah didn't predict the Atom Bomb.
He only predicted future wars in places he knew there had been wars and the countries were gearing up to go again.

Yes, the political analysists at the time were also predicting a larger war in Germany.
But in the evidence book a God-messenger has to know MORE than is taught in schools about philosophy, science and medicine.
Except he gets all the science wrong, knows no medical advances and the predictions are what others are predicting.
It's a complete fail going by the standards set in the book?
His Western philosophy is less than beginner?
Those people should try reading Kant and his influences. Such a fraud.
He clearly had some humanist ideas for a society but for whatever reason he went too far and decided to lie and say he was getting messages from gods. Besides the evidence sucks the gods he speaks for are fiction as well. He might have well just said he was speaking for Zues, EL and Osirus?

 

[Hockeycowboy]

You still didn’t explain the evidence I gave! You didn’t address any of it!

This is my last reply to you, in which I will answer your issues....

I posted current science that does not support any flood ever. You failed to produce a counter-argument so that stands. No flood.

I first posted evidences supporting the Flood. You chose to ignore them.

You did not explain what you consider a strawman, so that is moot.

Uh, yes I did. You attacked YEC. I’m OEC. Big difference!

You did not answer to the fact that myths are not historical.

I will now. Myths from widely disparate, unrelated regions that share identical features/ events in their stories, indicate those features have some truth to them. Otherwise, how would they get their similarities?

You did not answer to the fact that not only are these myths they are copied from older myths from Mesopotamian sources.

if you mean the Flood stories....which would seem more genuine to you? The story presenting an Ark whose dimension ratios were seaworthy, or the story which had a giant box as their Ark?

Surely you can reason on that, I think you’re able.

archeology confirms that events like Exodus did not happen and Moses and the Patriarchs are myth.

You can’t confirm a negative. Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Besides, I posted evidence...Jacob-baal is a confirmed Pharaoh! How did a king with a distinct Hebrew name become a ruler of Egypt?? That’s just one piece of evidence among many.

The apoctalyiptic, world ends in fire,

Not literal. Did you ever read the Biblical account (2 Peter 3)? It says the Heavens will be burned up, too.

Link:
"New Heavens and New Earth" - Why Destroy the Old?

So-long.

 

[PAUL MARKHAM]

I am fine with that for now because I know that it will change eventually, because if Baha'u'llah....

Isaiah 9:6-7 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace. Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the Lord of hosts will perform this.

Baha’is believe that Baha’u’llah was the Prince of Peace because world peace will be established during His religious dispensation. Baha’u’llah set up a system of government and it has already been established among the Baha’is. The institutions of that government are fully operational, but still in their infancy. They will be more developed in the future as the prophecy says (increase in government). Eventually governments will choose to adopt what the Baha'is have built, but it will always be voluntary.

No, they are not social problems, but if everyone understood them and put them into place, that would eliminate the social problems we now see.

We are talking about the whole world, that is what is meant by 'universal' compulsory education.

I suppose that how education will be handled will vary widely according to the country.

The flaw in your vision is people don't want to join together. We're a tribal race and been one for maybe 10,000 years or more. Look at the US split down the middle, EU falling apart, competition, wars, genocide, murders, etc is the way we are. 10,000 years of the same problems and your god hasn't lifted a finger, if he has one, to change anything. We now fight over who has the right religion with nothing to base the god theory on that's solid.

We compete here. Sports teams, gender, race, politics, etc.

A new race hasn't come for 10,000 years, it won't come now.

 

[PAUL MARKHAM]

These issues will be decided by the Majority. Individual action is not appropriate.

I see the drug lords will not go out without a fight, do you see them singing kumbaya any time soon?

Regards Tony

So long as some people want drugs, drugs will exist. Drug lords aren't the problem, the buyers are the problem. Individual action is appropriate.

Your view of the world is naive at best.

So one unworkable solution. What are you going to do with the rest of the problems I proposed? Crime, murders, theft, etc.

 

[Trailblazer]

The flaw in your vision is people don't want to join together. We're a tribal race and been one for maybe 10,000 years or more. Look at the US split down the middle, EU falling apart, competition, wars, genocide, murders, etc is the way we are.

That is certainly not true for everyone. Many people like to band together and work together in groups.

10,000 years of the same problems and your god hasn't lifted a finger.

God has sent Messengers in every age. After that, His job is done.

We now fight over who has the right religion with nothing to base the god theory on that's solid.

We don't have to fight, but some people choose to, because they have rejected Baha'u'llah.
Had they recognized Him, thye would know that all the divinely revealed religions are true.

A new race hasn't come for 10,000 years, it won't come now.

You cannot know that so you should not assert it.
I believe it, but i don't assert it.

 

[Muffled]

There are good things in the bibles. Do not kill, rob, bear false witness, there are stories that teach us to love our neighbour, etc.

The original concept of religion being about a god is wrong.

I believe then you should say by what authority you can say those are good things without God as an authority to say so. Are you the sole authority in the Universe?

 

[Muffled]

I believe that all the prophecies were fulfilled by Baha'u'llah, as delineated in the following book:

William Sears, Thief in the Night

I believe I am still on the prelude so I have a long way to go but I have arrived at the headline that a spaceship has arrived from Venus. I believe that should give the reader a clue.

 

[Muffled]

I am referring to prophecies in the Bible that were fulfilled by the coming of Baha'u'llah, not predictions that Baha'u'llah made. Those Bible prophecies and how they were fulfilled are in the book.

I believe I don't know of any but i am willing to bet they are contrived in the book.

 

[PAUL MARKHAM]

That is certainly not true for everyone. Many people like to band together and work together in groups.
God has sent Messengers in every age. After that, His job is done.

We don't have to fight, but some people choose to, because they have rejected Baha'u'llah.
Had they recognized Him, thye would know that all the divinely revealed religions are true.

You cannot know that so you should not assert it.
I believe it, but i don't assert it.

Stop putting words in my mouth. Different groups form. You've joined the Baha'is, some are Hindus, Muslims, Christians, Atheists and even they form their own little or large groups.

Stop telling us what god's job is or isn't. You admit to not knowing, all you do is make your version of a god fit your belief.

Most people have rejected Bahaullah who have heard of him. His message is an age-old one to stop the fighting. His plan is unworkable, even you admit that. Thinking a New Race will come along and change everything.

If all divine religions are true, can you give us a list of them please?

A new race has come in the last 10,000 years or a new race is coming in the next 10,000 years?

 

[Muffled]

DNA of Africans proves the Flood never happened.
DNA of the rest proves the Flood never happened.

The recent African origin paradigm suggests that the anatomically modern humans outside of Africa descend from a population of Homo sapiens migrating from East Africa roughly 70–50,000 years ago and spreading along the southern coast of Asia and to Oceania by about 50,000 years ago.
​

Where did the bones disappear to, where did the water disappear to?

There are explanations for the Flood stories. Rising seawater following an end to the last Ice Age, Tsunamis, and just devastating floods. Which still happen today.

I believe if you are talking about the flood that man has imagined as taking place all over the world then you are right but that is not the Biblical flood which was local.

 

[PAUL MARKHAM]

I believe then you should say by what authority you can say those are good things without God as an authority to say so. Are you the sole authority in the Universe?

The original concept of a god wasn't the god we have now. It was about things the people could see, touch experience. Trees, stars, fertility, earthquakes, volcanoes, floods, plagues, wind, rain etc. they claimed a god was responsible for them.

 

[PAUL MARKHAM]

I believe if you are talking about the flood that man has imagined as taking place all over the world then you are right but that is not the Biblical flood which was local.

In the bible it says it was worldwide, we know it was local from the evidence we have.

 

[Trailblazer]

I believe I don't know of any but i am willing to bet they are contrived in the book.

It is impossible for them to be contrived.

History is history and geography is geography. These things really happened and these places really exist.

 

[PAUL MARKHAM]

It is impossible for them to be contrived.

History is history and geography is geography. These things really happened and these places really exist.

The places exist, but the events didn't. It's been pointed out many times. But it's all incidental. His plans won't work.

 

[Spirit of Light]

The places exist, but the events didn't. It's been pointed out many times. But it's all incidental. His plans won't work.

How do you know those events didn't happen? You were there to check?