Yeshua (Jesus) taught that we need to born again when we follow Him. That simply means that we put away our old life and begin a new life with G-d. That is for those who follow Yeshua.
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Are you born again?
- Thread starter lostwanderingsoul
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Skwim
Veteran Member
Curious as to what your old life was. Drinking, doping, and just general debauchery?
No. I wasn't a drug addict, I'd never had sex, or any of that. My old life before that was going to High School, reading books, hanging with friends, etc (I was 17 when I starting following Jesus/G-d). Pretty much what I like to do now except now computers are a part of it. The only different is that I followed G-d. That's just way too boring for anyone to be interested in, but you asked.
OK, Skwim. Thanks for sharing.
Obviously we will view things with a different perspective in as much as I am of the position of free will. But with that in mind, I all be able to understand better where you are coming from.
That's a great way to live life. Congrats. My children followed that direction following Jesus real early because we started following Jesus when our eldest was just 3. What a difference it has made from where the lives of my wife and I were heading due to the baggage we were carrying from our parents.No. I wasn't a drug addict, I'd never had sex, or any of that. My old life before that was going to High School, reading books, hanging with friends, etc (I was 17 when I starting following Jesus/G-d). Pretty much what I like to do now except now computers are a part of it. The only different is that I followed G-d. That's just way too boring for anyone to be interested in, but you asked.
Skwim
Veteran Member
Tack så mycketNo. I wasn't a drug addict, I'd never had sex, or any of that. My old life before that was going to High School, reading books, hanging with friends, etc (I was 17 when I starting following Jesus/G-d). Pretty much what I like to do now except now computers are a part of it. The only different is that I followed G-d. That's just way too boring for anyone to be interested in, but you asked.
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Actually, it's rarely an issue. I usually discuss issues on the ground they're presented on. E.g. if you're discussing something to do with the divine nature of Jesus, for sake of the discussion I will accede he was divine even though I don't believe it.KenS said:
Skwim
Veteran Member
Nope. Raised and confirmed Lutheran (closest church to home). Mother, very weak Mormon; father probably atheists---never talked about religion. In high school I pretty much stayed away from Christianity until I read Bertrand Russell's book "Why I'm Not a Christian," at which time dropped it completely. Through the years I came to recognize the possibility of life after death and have since become agnostic, although the god of Abraham and all the other gods of religion are completely out of the question.
May your spiritual journey find success. I didn't grow up with anything. Church attendance count on one hand except for intern for education in a Monastery in Spain (6th grade) where the mass was in Latin (which I didn't speak). In there with my brothers for reasons beyond my mother's control
GoodbyeDave
Well-Known Member
If you believe our opinions are determined, why are you posting here and arguing against them?
Skwim
Veteran Member
First of all, I'm not arguing against my opinions. Secondly, I have no choice.
After thinking about this overnight... doesn't that translate into a murderer that had no choice, the thief that can't help himself, and the rapist who just can't change his actions?
Skwim
Veteran Member
Yup. But our immersion in the illusion is so overwhelming that we never stop to figure such things out, and proceed on as if true choice really existed. Even I, a hard determinist who recognizes the error of freewill, cannot help but live my life as if it is the operating mechanism of life. I have no choice in the matter.
well... I guess then, I am a hard-core free will enthusiast.
Then again, you could say "You just can't help yourself"!
Skwim
Veteran Member
Bingo!well... I guess then, I am a hard-core free will enthusiast.
Scary.
Skwim
Veteran Member
If one dwells on it I can see it being unsettling. It's far more comforting to believe we have at least some say in how our life proceeds. Alas . . . . . . . . . .
It also gives people an excuse (victim mentality).
On either side of the coin, who can prove they are right? It would end up being a circular argument.
Skwim
Veteran Member
I haven't seen you around here much so I assume you haven't gone onto those threads that dealt with the determinism v. freewill issue. If you had, or have and don't recall, you'd have seen that there are several members here who are determinist like myself, and believe the evidence shows that the only world view that makes sense is determinism. So in a sense some people here have 'proved" determinism to themselves. Actually, proof is only relevant in mathematics, logic, and alcohol. The best we can do is present the evidence and hope others see our reasoning, and when they do are honest enough to agree---sometimes it's not so easy to abandon freewill for determinism. In any case, I've never seen an argument for either side go circular.
Yes... I am quite new and have not read anything on this subject. Perhaps along the line of fate, which I have thought through... seems like the argument is the same.
I say circular in the sense of... "You see? You change your mind... you have free will!" - and the response would be "No, you were determined to change your position!" Circular in the sense that I don't see how one can prove to the other that they are correct.