Ask About Islam

[Birdnest]

Not so. In many circumstances Islam has strict an specific rules that must be followed. There is no place for individuals to use their own judgment in this context. What is haram is haram, for example. A Muslim can't say to themselves, "Well, not eating pork might have been a reasonable precaution in olden times, but with modern livestock farming and slaughter methods and regulations, and efficient transport and storage, there isn't really any need today".

Similarly, if someone claims that Islam forbids killing, they are simply wrong. It does not. There is no "nuance" or "different answers".

These things are literally in black and white!

Pork is haram, but eating it out of a necessity is not. Therefore it isn't entirely black and white.

Even the less educated Muslims and non-Muslims know that there is capital punishment in Islam for certain crimes. Most likely anyone saying killing is prohibited is referring to unlawful killing, i.e. murder.

 

[MyM]

Except this is a myth of course, they are fastidiously clean animals, and very intelligent, far more intelligent than dogs.

I don't believe you know much about pigs. What goes on inside them and what diseases they carry and give way even a lil undercooked on what can pass to a human.

The dogs saliva carries very bad germs and in Islam, one should wash their hands seven times when touching the saliva of a dog. The only thing wrong in Islam about pigs, is, ya just don't eat them for they do indeed carry harmful diseases to humans when consumed.

 

[Sheldon]

I don't believe you know much about pigs.

I don't care what you believe.

What goes on inside them and what diseases they carry and give way even a lil undercooked on what can pass to a human.

What have those two straw men to do with my post?

The dogs saliva carries very bad germs

So what?

and in Islam, one should wash their hands seven times when touching the saliva of a dog.

Cool, what's your point?

The only thing wrong in Islam about pigs, is, ya just don't eat them for they do indeed carry harmful diseases to humans when consumed.

Nonsense, I eat pork and have done for years, with no ill effects. Many people eat pork throughout the world, so your claim is demonstrable nonsense. If you undercook many other kinds of white meat you can catch salmonella, pig meat is not unique in that. You know nothing about pigs clearly, except the superstitious guff derived from archaic religions.

 

[MyM]

I don't care what you believe.



What have those two straw men to do with my post?



So what?



Cool, what's your point?



Nonsense, I eat pork and have done for years, with no ill effects. Many people eat pork throughout the world, so your claim is demonstrable nonsense. If you undercook many other kinds of white meat you can catch salmonella, pig meat is not unique in that. You know nothing about pigs clearly, except the superstitious guff derived from archaic religions.

You can't keep away can you lol you gotta keep comin back and degrading Muslims.

The diseases associated with swine include ringworm, erysipelas, leptospirosis, streptococcosis, campylobacterosis, salmonellosis, cryptosporidiosis, giardiasis, balantidiasis, influenza, infection with pathogenic E. coli, and brucellosis. These are just a few from google

Pigs have their own viruses that affect their own as well. Pseudorabies (also known as Aujeszky's disease or "mad itch") is a viral disease most prevalent in swine, often causing newborn piglets to die.

Pigs eat their own poop. ... Pigs will eat the poop of just about any creature if they're hungry enough.

Pig bites are often severe with a high incidence of infection that is often polymicrobial with organisms including Staphylococcus and Streptococcus spp. (including Streptococcus suis), Haemophilus influenzae, Pasteurella, Actinobacillus and Flavobacterium species.

The 288 outbreaks attributed to pork between 1998 and 2015 resulted in 6,372 illnesses, 443 hospitalizations, and four deaths. Salmonella was found to be the most common pathogen linked to pork outbreaks.

Feral swine pets are known to carry at least 30 viral and bacterial diseases and nearly 40 parasites that can be transmitted to humans, pets, livestock, and other wildlife.

Eating undercooked or raw pork can result in parasitic infections. Taenia solium, or pork tapeworm, is an intestinal parasite. Most of the time it's harmless, but it can occasionally cause a disease called cysticercosis, which leads to epilepsy.

People living near pig farms or agricultural fields fertilized with pig manure are more likely to become infected with methicillin-resistant Staphylococcus aureus (MRSA) bacteria.

There are more than 24 diseases that people can get from wild hogs. Most of these diseases make people sick when they eat undercooked meat. The germs that cause brucellosis are spread among hogs through birthing fluids and semen. Infected hogs carry the germs for life.

They are not clean animals and often they roll in the mud to keep cool but that doesn't make them clean because of it.

 

[Aupmanyav]

World-wide bacon is some 32 billion USD business. It forms the largest portion of meat products at 36%.

 

[MyM]

World-wide bacon is some 32 billion USD business. It forms the largest portion of meat products at 36%.

Imagine...just because the sales is up doesn't mean it's good for ya...I betcha drugs are even higher

 

[Sheldon]

You can't keep away can you lol you gotta keep comin back and degrading Muslims.

You find facts degrading, how odd?

The diseases associated with swine include ringworm, erysipelas, leptospirosis, streptococcosis, campylobacterosis, salmonellosis, cryptosporidiosis, giardiasis, balantidiasis, influenza, infection with pathogenic E. coli, and brucellosis. These are just a few from google

So what, I never said pigs were immune to disease?

Pigs have their own viruses that affect their own as well. Pseudorabies (also known as Aujeszky's disease or "mad itch") is a viral disease most prevalent in swine, often causing newborn piglets to die.

Again so what, you've Googled disease in pigs, what's your point? What has this to do with pigs being intelligent and fastidiously clean? Or with your false claim that eating pork was risky, which was palpable nonsense.

Pigs eat their own poop. ... Pigs will eat the poop of just about any creature if they're hungry enough.

As do other animals, they have evolved to re-digest nutrients form waste, again so what? It's an evolved survival mechanism.

Eating undercooked or raw pork

Why would you eat undercooked pork? You seem to be going from some sort of record for straw man fallacies here?

People living near pig farms or agricultural fields fertilized with pig manure are more likely to become infected with methicillin-resistant Staphylococcus aureus (MRSA) bacteria.

Again so what? Pigs are a very close evolutionary relative of humans, so of course diseases can be spread between the species. Since I never remotely claimed otherwise, what is the point of this straw man?

They are not clean animals and often they roll in the mud to keep cool but that doesn't make them clean because of it.

"We last shared a common ancestor with pigs about 80 million years ago, compared to about 70 million years ago when we diverged from rodents. A new study has revealed a potential hidden evolutionary link between pigs and primates."

Domesticated pigs have less hair than wild pigs, and like humans are one of very few mammals that can get sunburn, they have learned to coat their skins in mud to protect them in hot and sunny climates. That is a clear mark of intelligence. Again this is characteristic they share with humans, and again it is because humans and pigs are closely related and share recent evolutionary ancestry.

Amazing Facts About Pigs
Pigs are highly intelligent.
No barnyard animal has a better sense of smell.
Pigs are one of the cleanest animals.
The pig is the friendliest animal on the farm by far
Pigs are social.
Pigs are very peaceful animals and rarely show aggression

"the preoccupation with uncleanliness and pollution when it comes to pigs is curious, particularly in light of new evidence, which suggests that they are anything but. Our observations at Basel Zoo in Switzerland that wild boar are carefully cleaning their cuisine indicate that, far from being dirty or unpleasant, these omnivorous flat-snouted hoofed mammals of the family Suidae are actually rather fastidious and clean."

 

[MyM]

You find facts degrading, how odd?



So what, I never said pigs were immune to disease?



Again so what, you've Googled disease in pigs, what's your point? What has this to do with pigs being intelligent and fastidiously clean? Or with your false claim that eating pork was risky, which was palpable nonsense.



As do other animals, they have evolved to re-digest nutrients form waste, again so what? It's an evolved survival mechanism.



Why would you eat undercooked pork? You seem to be going from some sort of record for straw man fallacies here?



Again so what? Pigs are a very close evolutionary relative of humans, so of course diseases can be spread between the species. Since I never remotely claimed otherwise, what is the point of this straw man?




"We last shared a common ancestor with pigs about 80 million years ago, compared to about 70 million years ago when we diverged from rodents. A new study has revealed a potential hidden evolutionary link between pigs and primates."

Domesticated pigs have less hair than wild pigs, and like humans are one of very few mammals that can get sunburn, they have learned to coat their skins in mud to protect them in hot and sunny climates. That is a clear mark of intelligence. Again this is characteristic they share with humans, and again it is because humans and pigs are closely related and share recent evolutionary ancestry.

Amazing Facts About Pigs
Pigs are highly intelligent.
No barnyard animal has a better sense of smell.
Pigs are one of the cleanest animals.
The pig is the friendliest animal on the farm by far
Pigs are social.
Pigs are very peaceful animals and rarely show aggression

"the preoccupation with uncleanliness and pollution when it comes to pigs is curious, particularly in light of new evidence, which suggests that they are anything but. Our observations at Basel Zoo in Switzerland that wild boar are carefully cleaning their cuisine indicate that, far from being dirty or unpleasant, these omnivorous flat-snouted hoofed mammals of the family Suidae are actually rather fastidious and clean."

You left out the part with the diseases, the viruses and the parasites. It is unhealthy to eat pork, lard or anything to do with pig. Unless you are starving and as a matter of life or death, only then it is allowed if you cannot find anything else.

 

[muhammad_isa]

You left out the part with the diseases, the viruses and the parasites. It is unhealthy to eat pork, lard or anything to do with pig. Unless you are starving and as a matter of life or death, only then it is allowed if you cannot find anything else.

Pig farms are disgusting.
It is highly likely that covid originated in China.

Pork is eaten in large quantities in China. They eat more pork than US does beef [per capita]

It is interesting to note that pig farms in China were in severe crisis[disease] at the time covid first appeared in 2019.
China was having to import huge amounts of pork to satisfy demand.

 

[KWED]

Or maybe they know that there are many ways to build sentences in english.

It's rather that they affect a slight Middle-Eastern accent and inflection, as if their native language is Arabic.

 

[MyM]

Pig farms are disgusting.
It is highly likely that covid originated in China.

Pork is eaten in large quantities in China. They eat more pork than US does beef [per capita]

It is interesting to note that pig farms in China were in severe crisis[disease] at the time covid first appeared in 2019.
China was having to import huge amounts of pork to satisfy demand.

yeah wouldn't doubt it one bit

 

[KWED]

Pork is haram, but eating it out of a necessity is not. Therefore it isn't entirely black and white.

I was referring to the prohibition not being open to interpretation, nuance or context. Even if pork is eaten by an individual out of necessity, it is still haram for everyone else.

Even the less educated Muslims and non-Muslims know that there is capital punishment in Islam for certain crimes. Most likely anyone saying killing is prohibited is referring to unlawful killing, i.e. murder.

Murder is prohibited in every culture and society, so it's a pretty meaningless statement. (There is also the issue of how lawful and unlawful killings are defined.)
I was referring to things like when people quote sura 5:32 to show that killing is generally prohibited, when people point out the various passages in the Quran and sunnah that call for fighting against those who refuse to submit to Islam.

 

[KWED]

I don't believe you know much about pigs.

*insert irony meme here*

What goes on inside them and what diseases they carry and give way even a lil undercooked on what can pass to a human.

This applies to all livestock animals. Pigs are essentially no different. The reality is that more people get ill and die from eating poultry and fish than from eating pork. So why aren't they haram?

 

[KWED]

The diseases associated with swine include ringworm, erysipelas, leptospirosis, streptococcosis, campylobacterosis, salmonellosis, cryptosporidiosis, giardiasis, balantidiasis, influenza, infection with pathogenic E. coli, and brucellosis. These are just a few from google

Also from Google, the NHS recommends lean pork as a healthy source of protein. Who do you think is the better judge of what is healthy to eat, you or the National Health Service?

Pigs have their own viruses that affect their own as well. Pseudorabies (also known as Aujeszky's disease or "mad itch") is a viral disease most prevalent in swine, often causing newborn piglets to die.

Also from Google... "Pseudorabies is a disease that can also affect cattle, dogs, cats, sheep, and goats."

Pigs eat their own poop. ... Pigs will eat the poop of just about any creature if they're hungry enough.

Pigs will not eat their own faeces if there is anything else to eat. Chickens will eat their own poop when there is other food available. Do you eat chicken?

Pig bites are often severe with a high incidence of infection that is often polymicrobial with organisms including Staphylococcus and Streptococcus spp. (including Streptococcus suis), Haemophilus influenzae, Pasteurella, Actinobacillus and Flavobacterium species.

I've never been bitten by a pig. Have you?

The 288 outbreaks attributed to pork between 1998 and 2015 resulted in 6,372 illnesses, 443 hospitalizations, and four deaths. Salmonella was found to be the most common pathogen linked to pork outbreaks.

Eggs and poultry are the most common sources of salmonella infection. Are eggs and poultry haram?

Basically, none of your arguments make any sense.

 

[Link]

Salam

We remember God's Name before an animal is killed to keep the meat blessed. God has told us pig is unclean, is this because of physical uncleanness or spiritual uncleanness? Probably the the latter.

The thing is we believe Jinn and they have people invoking them on animals when killed, has a spiritual effect on the food.

To us it's highly important to keep energy clean coming in. Sins also effect the body spiritually and water cleanses them from sins if we do it with good intention.

Salah has blessings on soul but also you can feel effect on body.

 

[Birdnest]

I was referring to the prohibition not being open to interpretation, nuance or context. Even if pork is eaten by an individual out of necessity, it is still haram for everyone else.

Yes, indeed, praise be to Allah that He has given us a clear religion.

Murder is prohibited in every culture and society, so it's a pretty meaningless statement.

Not since plenty of propagandists run around screaming that Muslims are commanded to kill all disbelievers, in general, literally whoever comes their way.

There is also the issue of how lawful and unlawful killings are defined.

It's not an issue. Like with the prohibition of pork we have a myriad of guidelines for cases of murder and for cases of capital punishment.

I was referring to things like when people quote sura 5:32 to show that killing is generally prohibited,

But ayah 5:32 is pretty thorough.. it says when it is prohibited and when not. What's the problem?

when people point out the various passages in the Quran and sunnah that call for fighting against those who refuse to submit to Islam.

It isn't so much about rejecting islam, it's about oppression and injustice.

 

[Birdnest]

It's rather that they affect a slight Middle-Eastern accent and inflection, as if their native language is Arabic.

Alright, point one instance to me when you come by it, if you like. I've never seen a Middle-Eastern accent and inflection in writing.

I should point out that the majority of Muslims do not speak Arabic as their native language.

 

[Sheldon]

You left out the part with the diseases, the viruses and the parasites.

As it was an irrelevant straw man, and had nothing to do with my post refuting your claim that pigs are dirty animals.

It is unhealthy to eat pork, lard or anything to do with pig.

Rubbish, countless people eat pork regularly, myself included, and have suffered no ill effects. I had bacon for lunch, and I'm doing just fine.

Unless you are starving and as a matter of life or death, only then it is allowed if you cannot find anything else.

Really, I'm pretty sure i can eat pork whenever I am minded to, and of course countless millions throughout the world also consume pork meat. I may take some belly pork out of the freezer for tomorrow. You haven't lived if you have never tasted a fine Iberrico ham. Whenever I'm in Spain i make a point of trying this delicacy.

I note you ignore the links I provided showing that pigs are both intelligent animals and fastidiously clean, though I can't say i'm surprised.

 

[KWED]

It is unhealthy to eat pork, lard or anything to do with pig.

You are simply wrong. Your claim has no basis in fact.

"Pork can form part of a healthy diet" - NHS
"Pork is a good source of certain nutrients, as well as high-quality protein. Consumed in moderation, it can make a good addition to a healthy diet." - WebMD
"Substituting beef and chicken with pork also positively affects weight, BMI, percentage body fat, fat mass and abdominal fat" - British Journal of Nutrition
"This study demonstrated that regular inclusion of lean fresh pork in the diet in place of other meats may improve body composition without adversely affecting risk factors for diabetes and CV disease." - National Centre for Biotechnology Information

Obviously, like all red meat, excessive consumption is not recommended.

 

[Sheldon]

Pork is eaten in large quantities in China. They eat more pork than US does beef [per capita]

Proof if proof were needed that pork is a perfectly healthy part of the human diet.