Ask me about the Third Reich, National Socialism, Hitler & the Holocaust

[Saint Frankenstein]

Whaaattt?!?

First I have ever heard of any suggestion of that.

Aren't we talking about the guy who gave the Vatican its lands?

Yes, Mussolini was an atheist. He used to be a socialist before he formulated Fascism. Fascism, by the way, owes a lot to another atheist, Gabriele D'Annunzio. (As an aside, he warned Mussolini not to ally with Hitler. Mussolini later admitted his mistake. How tragic.)
Gabriele D'Annunzio - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[LuisDantas]

This sure surprises me. Oh well.

 

[pro4life]

Is it true 2 million Germans died of starvation after ww2 concluded under the Allies coalition watch?

 

[Typist]

Apologies if this has already been addressed, haven't had a chance to read the entire thread. What interests me about Nazism is....

We've been learning in recent decades the importance of respecting the laws of nature. When we ignore the rules of nature which have evolved here on Earth over billions of years, a force far stronger than ourselves, we typically get in to trouble.

I'm intrigued by the great irony that Nazism was both a truly psychopathic insane ideology, while at the same time being very much in line with the laws of nature, and thus highly rational.

The Nazis observed that life is dominated by a dance between predator and prey, and then very honestly declared themselves to be predators. From their perspective, they were performing the same useful function all predators provide, removing weak genetic material from prey populations.

Please do not read this as a rationalization in favor of Nazism. When it comes to fascists of any flavor, I enthusiastically believe the only solution is to hunt them down and put a bullet in their brain. So any political correctness lectures aimed my way will be wasted typing.

I just find it very interesting that such a despicably evil psychopathic ideology could be so loyal to the laws of nature. Nazism is in compliance with laws developed by nature over billions of years, whereas Judeo-Christian morality is only a three or four thousand years old. Hmm....

Hitler was a madman, but an honest one. When his cherished nation failed to be the strongest predator, he willingly chose that it should perish, which was entirely consistent with his long stated positions, and the laws of nature.

 

[Nietzsche]

Is it true 2 million Germans died of starvation after ww2 concluded under the Allies coalition watch?

Kind of. It wasn't intentional, the fact of the matter was just that due to the war most European farmland had been destroyed either directly through scorched-earth tactics or indirectly through armies retreating/advancing. Nor was it just Germans who starved. The Balkans, the Baltic states, Poland and a good chunk of the Soviet Union in Europe also starved. However, that 2 Million figure sounds a bit high to me. I'll need to check some sources later.

Apologies if this has already been addressed, haven't had a chance to read the entire thread. What interests me about Nazism is....

We've been learning in recent decades the importance of respecting the laws of nature. When we ignore the rules of nature which have evolved here on Earth over billions of years, a force far stronger than ourselves, we typically get in to trouble.

I'm intrigued by the great irony that Nazism was both a truly psychopathic insane ideology, while at the same time being very much in line with the laws of nature, and thus highly rational.

The Nazis observed that life is dominated by a dance between predator and prey, and then very honestly declared themselves to be predators. From their perspective, they were performing the same useful function all predators provide, removing weak genetic material from prey populations.

Please do not read this as a rationalization in favor of Nazism. When it comes to fascists of any flavor, I enthusiastically believe the only solution is to hunt them down and put a bullet in their brain. So any political correctness lectures aimed my way will be wasted typing.

I just find it very interesting that such a despicably evil psychopathic ideology could be so loyal to the laws of nature. Nazism is in compliance with laws developed by nature over billions of years, whereas Judeo-Christian morality is only a three or four thousand years old. Hmm....

Hitler was a madman, but an honest one. When his cherished nation failed to be the strongest predator, he willingly chose that it should perish, which was entirely consistent with his long stated positions, and the laws of nature.

Eh, no. Hitler's view of "Survival of the Fittest" had nothing to do with Darwin's ideas beyond having the same name. In fact, all of Darwin's work was banned & burned in the Third Reich because it implied that all humans descended from a common ancestor, and that the diversity between various peoples were wholly superficial. The "laws of nature" as espoused by Hitler and others in the Reich were extremely unscientific, because they were looking for evidence that proved their hypothesis rather than basing their hypothesis around the evidence.

There was no rationale in play in the Reich. It was pesudoscience dressed up as legitimate science. The biggest problem was that they were starting from a false point to begin with. It didn't help that they drove out a massive chunk of their best & brightest to obtain "racial purity".

 

[Typist]

Eh, no. Hitler's view of "Survival of the Fittest" had nothing to do with Darwin's ideas beyond having the same name.

Eh, no. Please re-read the post you are attempting to debunk, and observe I made no mention of Darwin.

The "laws of nature" as espoused by Hitler and others in the Reich were extremely unscientific, because they were looking for evidence that proved their hypothesis rather than basing their hypothesis around the evidence.

I made no mention of science. I made no claim to the contrary, so again, you are debunking assertions of your own invention. I hope you win that debate, which seems certain, given you are the only one in it!

 

[Whiterain]

I just find it very interesting that such a despicably evil psychopathic ideology could be so loyal to the laws of nature. Nazism is in compliance with laws developed by nature over billions of years, whereas Judeo-Christian morality is only a three or four thousand years old. Hmm....

2015 years old, give or take a few years or centuries.

What gets me is the amount of lies that were used to disgrace the Nazi Reich, stuff I heard growing up. They were going to pave the Earth and make people genetic freaks with blonde hair and blue eyes with their Nazi science.

I do believe the blond haired blue eyed Nord is the common ancestor of the Caucasian race, people just get disgusted when you try and talk about genetic purity anymore. I learned about the Mongrels in school and that's been totally done away with, that entire teaching.

When Hitler imposed very strict environmentalism laws as well as putting various animals in protection.

Animal welfare in Nazi Germany - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Ecofascism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Typist]

2015 years old, give or take a few years or centuries.

Bit of a quibble. Judeo-Christian morality arose out of Judaism, and perhaps even earlier influences. It predates Jesus by probably at least 1,000 years.

Jesus is perhaps best seen at the most effective salesman of that morality. His amazing charisma and compelling tragic hero story etc put it on the front page of western culture, so to speak.

 

[Nietzsche]

Eh, no. Please re-read the post you are attempting to debunk, and observe I made no mention of Darwin.

Natural Selection through Survival of the fittest was codified by Darwin, and it is his work by which modern understanding of nature stems. So unless you're thinking of something else, Darwin is where we start. Even more so in Hitler's own time.

I made no mention of science. I made no claim to the contrary, so again, you are debunking assertions of your own invention. I hope you win that debate, which seems certain, given you are the only one in it!

The answer to your question is one that runs deep into the very fabric of Nazi ideology. You might as well ask someone to explain the Great Depression without referencing WW1 or the Treaty of Versailles.


For instance;

The Nazis observed that life is dominated by a dance between predator and prey, and then very honestly declared themselves to be predators. From their perspective, they were performing the same useful function all predators provide, removing weak genetic material from prey populations.

One, ignoring the "declared themselves predators" bit(which I've never seen mentioned in either German or English sources) they weren't looking to "weed out" populations. Two, what they sought was the natural extreme of Colonial Imperialism. Only instead of doing it in Africa, it was to be done in Eastern Europe & the Balkans. This concept is known as Lebensraum. Slavs were to be reduced to what amounts to a slave-labour population "only educated enough to read road-signs"(that's a direct quote from Hitler).

That of course only applies to the ones they allowed to live. The majority of them were going to be killed to make room for colonization of Eastern Europe with Germanic individuals. Germans, Dutch, Flems, Scandinavians.

That was the position they started from, not the one they arrived at. What I'm trying to get at is that their use of "Natural Selection" was just the fig-leaf by which to justify their subjugation & extermination of conquered peoples. They weren't interested in actual Natural Selection.

 

[Nietzsche]

If you don't think that Nazism is anti-Christian, then you simply don't understand Nazi ideology. The article has nothing to do with the writer's views, it's just detailing the findings found in thousands of documents from the Third Reich and evidence from the Nuremberg Trials.

To be fair, I think it is best said that Hilter was an atheist who nevertheless found Christianity to be a useful tool of control. It is a lose/lose for Christians and Atheists who want Hitler to be in the other guys camp.

Now that I have you, what is up with that avatar of yours?

Both of you are wrong. I went into detail on this in the first few pages of this thread. So time for a lesson;

Here.

But the important bit are two equally valid quotes made by Hitler;

13 Dec 1941"Christianity is an invention of sick brains: one could imaginenothing more senseless,nor any more indecent way of turning the idea of the Godhead into a mockery”

My feelings as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter. In boundless love as a Christian and as a man I read through the passage which tells us how the Lord at last rose in His might and seized the scourge to drive out of the Temple the brood of vipers and adders. ...Today, after two thousand years, with deepest emotion I recognize more profoundly than ever before the fact that it was for this that He had to shed his blood upon the Cross.

So yeah. No, Hitler wasn't an Atheist. Or a Christian. I'd say Deist of sorts. The "Watchmaker God" idea, where he sets it up and leaves it running.

 

[Kalibhakta]

Regardless of his beliefs, he used Christianity as a useful Tool.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Regardless of his beliefs, he used Christianity as a useful Tool.

Exactly. So I'm not "wrong". Hitler was just being pragmatic when he was playing up to the beliefs of the masses. They had something else in store for Germany, religiously.

 

[Nietzsche]

Exactly. So I'm not "wrong". Hitler was just being pragmatic when he was playing up to the beliefs of the masses. They had something else in store for Germany, religiously.

The Christian churches were to be marginalized, but there was never a program in place to get rid of them, not by Hitler anyway.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

The Christian churches were to be marginalized, but there was never a program in place to get rid of them, not by Hitler anyway.

Christianity was to be phased out after the war.
Religious views of Adolf Hitler - Wikiwand

 

[Whiterain]

Not all the undesirables were exterminated though. What about those few that threw down the shovel and said they wanted to live god shenanigan!! There were various 'undesirables' that enlisted into the Reich as well, where the shenanigan are their stories?

Those would be some of the grizzliest stories, Jews, Muslims, Poloks in trenches with the Nazi with the shoota'.

The mentality back then must have been so subordinate. I would have snapped when soldiers showed up at my door let alone walking me onto trains and then to the camp. Shenanigan all of that.

Do you know about any riots or anything occurring? I know there was some harebrained scheme to over throw the Nazi at Auschwitz that would have been dubiously foiled.

 

[LuisDantas]

Eh, no. Please re-read the post you are attempting to debunk, and observe I made no mention of Darwin.



I made no mention of science. I made no claim to the contrary, so again, you are debunking assertions of your own invention. I hope you win that debate, which seems certain, given you are the only one in it!

You realize your post #444 just decrees out of the blue that Nazism was rational and "in line with the laws of nature"?

Nietzsche can only work with what he is given, and your post is of dubious coherence at best.

 

[psychoslice]

I have always loved the SS uniforms, I once had my own SS uniform which I use to wear to the gay parities, it was so great.

 

[Nietzsche]

Christianity was to be phased out after the war.
Religious views of Adolf Hitler - Wikiwand

There is a difference between what Hitler wanted to do and what he could do. He'd tried to wreck the position of the Churches before & during the war and was hit with stiff resistance. He would've tried, failed, and given it up.

Not all the undesirables were exterminated though. What about those few that threw down the shovel and said they wanted to live god shenanigan!! There were various 'undesirables' that enlisted into the Reich as well, where the shenanigan are their stories?

Those would be some of the grizzliest stories, Jews, Muslims, Poloks in trenches with the Nazi with the shoota'.

The mentality back then must have been so subordinate. I would have snapped when soldiers showed up at my door let alone walking me onto trains and then to the camp. Shenanigan all of that.

Do you know about any riots or anything occurring? I know there was some harebrained scheme to over throw the Nazi at Auschwitz that would have been dubiously foiled.

The Warsaw Uprising comes to mind. It was basically a Concentration Camp. As for the Untermenschen allowed to serve the Reich, most of them were either SS or in Sonderkommando battalions. The Sonderkommando were made up entirely of Inmates from the camps, and in one case they were two Prison-Battalions. One of German criminals and one of Russian PoWs.

I have always loved the SS uniforms, I once had my own SS uniform which I use to wear to the gay parities, it was so great.

I have a ridiculous amount of various Nazi memorabilia. My replica stuff;

SS Daggers, SS-Ehrenrings(in Sig, Hagal, Swastika and 'Double' patterns), a Parade Uniform, medals, some armbands, SS-Degen, a replica uniform patterned directly after Reinhard Heydrich's(The Man with the Iron Heart)...

I may have a problem. What I really want to do is get some money together and go to Eastern Europe during the Spring Thaw. You see, there are plenty of corpses left in the Motherland. With nigh-pristine uniforms. You just need some heavy equipment and money to grease the wheels for the border officials. SS, Heer, Luftwaffe and even a few Kriegsmarine uniforms are somewhere in the Russian mud. Not to mention the potential weapons and such.

 

[Whiterain]

Maybe we should start speaking in codes.

November Oscar, Tanga Hotel Alpha Tonga Sierra - Delta Uniform Mike Bravo. Oscar kilo.

--.-.-...-.-.---.--.-..-.--.-

I don't even know morse code.

Ixnay odecay shenanigan eakesay, adbay odsmay. oloay

Shenanigan.

Nazi Jews, they're out there, the worst type of scum.

It's fascinating to see someone so well versed in WW2, thank you for your continuing studies, Nietzsche.

Even with the web library at your diposal it's a blast to see this much diligence.

I know history is a hard field to try and make lucrative and I really respect and appreciate those that pay mind to it.

I lasted one quarter in a history major, it's tough, names, dates, it's ultimately a plea on memory. I could tell you great stories but no know the dates and names of the people.

 

[goodhunter819]

Here's one I have to put up with every week:
The Whores of Oblivion And Ignorance


I am sick to death of the fake wannabee fascist ideologist leaving at the back of my house so I am going to say what I need to say the way I was taught during my political history lectures, the whole concept of national socialism is national politics which means there is not immigration policies except for neighbouring countries as is Austria to Germany, the twat expecting me to want a fascist hail behind the house of me is talking of coined term by the man who was and is the most renowned leader of the third Reich, it was his national socialist teachings that saw the end of parliamentary policies in Germany to make way for a government ran through the Reichstag, if it is one thing the national socialist government did like and that was the rise of any political party except their own, which effectively means that unlike British parliamentary politics whose government host the right for more than one political party to have their say (ie) a conservative party, a Labour party, a liberal party, a socialist party, a communist party, a green party (ect) all of which have the right to voters unlike the national socialist which is an elective dictatorship, should England have had an elective dictatorship these fake wannnabee immigrant fascist living behind me would not have the freedom of choice he, she or myself have today, one of the most effective methods the fascist party of 1930s to 1940s had was the refusal right of any immigration, so (WTF) are you talking about trying to be all fascist immigrant with me for? In addition to the misconceptions of what a fascist national socialist regime would be like? without a doubt it leads to a police state which means only the unformed forces would be allowed to have fire arms, there would be a total and immediate control of socialist entertainment hence censorship of all social environment programs, there would be an exceptionally strong restriction for noise pollution so your nights of party party would be out the window, then there would be an immediate sifting system for population control and mixed race integration would totally cease at the price of human sterilization, there would be no marijuana trafficking and all drugs would be controlled by pharmaceutical authorizations alone, there would be no third world issues because if the country was not deemed suited to economical stability present and future tenths they would wipe it out by genocide, also the fascist hate of nomadic cultures are infamous, no slave would be kept because the keeping of slave would lead to a dilution of the Utopian ideals (not that I am into slavery because I am against it) and should your offspring be born ill favoured (ie) disabled in any way? they would hence be sterilised and if your produce more than one disabled child you would be sterilized, in addition to this should any person be seen not able to suite the national curriculum for whatever reasons it would be a duration of time before they a shut way until passed and furthermore to make you look an unct , what you don’t realise is that shouting that political hail is from a man who ran a government, one of the reasons the fascist of Germany came to power so easily is because they relied on system of informants of patriots sworn to the German fascist ideal to inform on people. on the subject of informing to the police you ‘you’ve got the ownership there never mind what I say, do I really need to carry on why you a wanntebee hypocrites fascist have no freaken idea you newly arrived oblivious halfwit , do you want me to carry on where your desire for the Utopian ideal will leave you much less me? For a better understanding why I don’t want your need to be hailed you want to be fascist immigrant half wit? Consider this analogy or metaphoric equation, like the Catholic I put absolute power in the church and the powers greater than man whereas the protestant dose not, in sort I don’t believe in poetics at all and put religion though unconventional above all political ideologies, so what does that mean? For the hundredth time? God its like talking to a plank of would. It means I don’t want to hail politics nor will need to be hailed by politics effectively not caring for any power black or white
C A Forbes

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( Quote :Fredrick Nietzsche ''One should aware before venturing into the unknown'')