Ask me anything about the science of Evolution :)

[Subduction Zone]

It is worth mentioning that bacteria have sex, too.

Thanks, I was about to mention horizontal gene transfer, but forgot:

Horizontal gene transfer - Wikipedia

And that sort of interchange may lie at the base of the evolution of sex itself.

 

[1137]

Recent evidence has completely undermined any quantum change in the upper Paleolithic. As more evidence accrues of similar artistic behavior in Africa from 100,000 years ago.
The Earliest Known Artist’s Studio | Science | Smithsonian

Yes, like I said 100,000 years after we evolved the brains that supposedly create consciosness. This is the issue.

 

[sayak83]

Yes, like I said 100,000 years after we evolved the brains that supposedly create consciosness. This is the issue.

Well, modern human fossils crop up from around 200,000 years ago. Complex behavior occurs with slow accrual of cultural knowledge over generations, and this is necessarily slow at the beginning. For example complex tool making starts from 200,000 years on. But artistic development is seen occuring only in regions and periods that had relatively large and stable human population. Small, hard-scrabble groups did not have the time or resources to devote to aesthetic work, and that characterized the general situation for humans in the earlier periods.

Read this below. Its no longer plausible to maintain any sudden development of human cognition at a given point in time. Instead the process was gradual and cumulative cultural accrual.

http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/deadthings/2018/03/15/human-behavior-evolution/#.Wr2J5RPhWUA

As can be seen.. modern behavior like body paint and trade can be traced in East Africa from 200,000 years ago.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Yes, like I said 100,000 years after we evolved the brains that supposedly create consciosness. This is the issue.

What problem? You have been shown that none of the fruits of our intelligence appeared abruptly.

 

[1137]

Well, modern human fossils crop up from around 200,000 years ago. Complex behavior occurs with slow accrual of cultural knowledge over generations, and this is necessarily slow at the beginning. For example complex tool making starts from 200,000 years on. But artistic development is seen occuring only in regions and periods that had relatively large and stable human population. Small, hard-scrabble groups did not have the time or resources to devote to aesthetic work, and that characterized the general situation for humans in the earlier periods.

Read this below. Its no longer plausible to maintain any sudden development of human cognition at a given point in time. Instead the process was gradual and cumulative cultural accrual.

Radical Revision To Timeline Of Human Behavior Evolution - Dead Things

As can be seen.. modern behavior like body paint and trade can be traced in East Africa from 200,000 years ago.

I'm talking about higher cognitive abilities, not animals running plants in themselves. Further, why is this the only trait we see in only a single species?

 

[1137]

What problem? You have been shown that none of the fruits of our intelligence appeared abruptly.

I worded that poorly. There was 100,000 years of anatomically modern humans BEFORE there was higher consciousness.

 

[sayak83]

I'm talking about higher cognitive abilities, not animals running plants in themselves. Further, why is this the only trait we see in only a single species?

I am also talking of higher cognitive abilities.
Because we drove the other hominid species that had them to extinction. Many animals are independently evolving them though. We are simply the first, but unlikely to be the last.
Chimpanzees and monkeys have entered the Stone Age

Dolphins have ‘human-like’ societies...but are held back by a lack of opposable thumbs, say scientists

 

[Subduction Zone]

I worded that poorly. There was 100,000 years of anatomically modern humans BEFORE there was higher consciousness.

But there wasn't. What makes you say that?

 

[1137]

But there wasn't. What makes you say that?

Because there was....

What Was The Upper Paleolithic Revolution?

http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/0392192107076869

 

[Subduction Zone]

Because there was....

What Was The Upper Paleolithic Revolution?

http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/0392192107076869

You are ignoring the links already posted that show that to be an overstatement.

 

[Thermos aquaticus]

I'm talking about higher cognitive abilities, not animals running plants in themselves. Further, why is this the only trait we see in only a single species?

One species has to be the first, and we just happen to be that species. It would also appear that the first species to evolve these traits will outcompete similar species and push them to extinction, as appears to be the case with H. erectus and H. neanderthalensis.

 

[1137]

You are ignoring the links already posted that show that to be an overstatement.

Oh yeah, sorry I chose scientific sources over blog posts.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Oh yeah, sorry I chose scientific sources over blog posts.

Those "blog posts" are based upon scientific sources. You are merely cherry picking articles that you do not understand at best.

 

[1137]

Those "blog posts" are based upon scientific sources. You are merely cherry picking articles that you do not understand at best.

Considering that my science articles contradict yours, then if I'm cherry picking so are you

 

[Subduction Zone]

Considering that my science articles contradict yours, then if I'm cherry picking so are you

They are also earlier and were corrected by more recent studies. Try to look at the dates of your sources. That will help you understand if they are still up to date. For example I could quote an old source that describes dinosaurs as being cold blooded. It could be a "scientific source" but that does not make it immune to later correction. As we learn more older ideas are refined. The "explosion" does not appear to be an explosion any longer.

 

[1137]

They are also earlier and were corrected by more recent studies. Try to look at the dates of your sources. That will help you understand if they are still up to date. For example I could quote an old source that describes dinosaurs as being cold blooded. It could be a "scientific source" but that does not make it immune to later correction. As we learn more older ideas are refined. The "explosion" does not appear to be an explosion any longer.

Your links did not contradict my links though. They even pointed out the dates correctly I believe.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Your links did not contradict my links though. They even pointed out the dates correctly I believe.

Not my links. I was not the one that posted articles that explained how the development of culture occurred before the date in the article that you linked. Different cultural traits arose at different times. The development of civilizations intensified those changes but there was no one "explosion". You claimed a specific date and that has been found not to be the case.

 

[1137]

Not my links. I was not the one that posted articles that explained how the development of culture occurred before the date in the article that you linked. Different cultural traits arose at different times. The development of civilizations intensified those changes but there was no one "explosion". You claimed a specific date and that has been found not to be the case.

The links in question gave the same date! Holy ****...

 

[Subduction Zone]

The links in question gave the same date! Holy ****...

What? Are you confused? Your two articles may have the same date, but they do not match the dates of more recent articles:

Radical Revision To Timeline Of Human Behavior Evolution - Dead Things
ETA: We were discussing the emergence of tool usage, art, etc.. The only dates that match are those of migration, and that was not the subject we were discussing.

 

[Shaul]

I think you don't have a good idea about what evolution which and hence you think it's circular. Please read below this brief synopsis and see if it makes more sense and allay your doubts.

Basic features of the theory of evolution:-
a) Evolution is the change between generations within a population lineage defined by ancestor-descendant relationships. A population is defined by a group of living organisms that inter-breed (or exchange genetic material) often enough over the generations to be considered to have a common pool of genes between them.

b) Genes are specific segments of DNA that determines what proteins get built, how much and when. Proteins build all physical features of the body and controls and constitutes all processes occurring within the organism that determines how it lives and how it behaves.

c) Change within a population of interbreeding individuals is seen when genes are modified or the relative frequencies of various genes are altered.

d) The engine for such change are the countless ways strands of the DNA can undergo mutation during the replication process. Typical human mutation rate is 100/generation.

e)The mutations cause changes in the genes that in turn cause (in some instances) changes in what proteins are being formed, when and where.

f)This in turn modifies the structure and behavior of the individuals from one generation to the next and act as a source of variation of characteristics between members of the population and over time.

g) Variation of characters impact (positively or negatively) the ability of the organism to survive and reproduce with others of its population. The organisms that gain an advantage in survival and reproduction leave behind more offsprings that have its genes in the population. Thus genes that improve the survival and reproductive "fitness" of the individual becomes more widespread and eventually dominate over others...until a newer and more "fit" type of gene emerge to outcompete it in turn.

h) This process of enhancement of traits and associated genes that make the organisms better able to thrive in the environment it is in is called natural selection. This is how mutations that confer a survival and reproductive benefit in the organism becomes widespread in the population over time.

i)Over time, a population may change in physical features and behavior so much that it can no longer be called the same species as the earlier ancestral population.

j) If a population gets isolated into two or more groups due to new geographic barriers, the process of mutation and the enhancement of beneficial mutations through natural selection operates independently in both subgroups, making them slowly distinct from each other. Over time, the two populations become so different that they no longer look or behave the same and do not interbreed in the wild. Thus one species splits into two. This process is called speciation and results in the branching tree of life and the present diversity from past forms.

Um, my understanding of evolutionary theory is fine. But “nice” argumentation technique to insult the person you are attempting to persuade by insulting them first thing.

Then you show are brilliant display of cutting and pasting. Perhaps you want to snow the readers under with volume instead of, you know, actually addressing the question I raised. In the middle of your cut and paste you actually gave an example of my point of the circumlocution of evolutionary theory’s definition, although you seem to have missed that.

It is actually possible to prove scientifically that being the fittest of a species can not account for all of those that survive. IOW, Darwinistic evolutionary theory can not explain survivability.