• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

at the pearly gates, would you descend into hell if they said it would save 2 sinners?

amorphous_constellation

amorphous_constellation

Well-Known Member
Tlaloc said:
The context of the story is Jesus preaching to the crowds, which he commonly did by parable.
Click to expand...

Jesus did very oftentimes preach in parable, but this is hardly one of the more metaphorically well-dressed ones. He isn't talking about chaff and wheat this time, or sowing, but rather he chose to talk about people who could be real, as well as actual actions or behavior. And that particular story does have a lot to do with heaven and hell, he is telling you a little bit about who gets to go to either. Now the most interesting verse there is 16:26, because once again it heavily implies pity can exist in heaven for those who are damned or on the path to being so. It says "those who want to go from here to you cannot." Now can you imagine, who in heaven would want to exit heaven and make for hell? Perhaps not, but the verse implies such psychology could exist, that such a person could exist in heaven for all its radiance and want to leave for hell to try and console some person in it. You can disagree, but I don't see how it could be read any other way really.
 
McBell

McBell

Unbound
Interesting how so many people refuse to address the point other than dismiss it.
One wonders what they fear in answering the question?
 
Muffled

Muffled

Jesus in me
DawudTalut said:
Peace be on you.
They shall not say it as:

Deuteronomy 24
16 Parents are not to be put to death for their children, nor children put to death for their parents; each will die for their own sin.

Galatian 6
4But each one must examine his own work, and then he will have reason for boasting in regard to himself alone, and not in regard to another. 5For each one will bear his own load.6The one who is taught the word is to share all good things with the one who teaches him

Quran ch 39
v8 If you are ungrateful, surely Allah is Self-Sufficient being independent of you. And He is not pleased with ingratitude in His servants. But if you show gratefulness, He likes it in you. And no bearer of burden shall bear the burden of another. Then to your Lord is your return; And He will inform you of what you have been doing. Surely, He knows full well all that is hidden in the breasts.
Click to expand...

I believe this is cherrypicking verses and it doesn't prove the point as well.
 
Muffled

Muffled

Jesus in me
beenherebeforeagain said:
I don't see this as a question of whether or not someone else already has died, or needs to die, to "save" anyone; at issue is would YOU personally choose do so?
Two might not be a high enough exchange rate for me, but I'd certainly consider the proposition. At 10, I'd be very inclined to take the offer; at 100 or more, even moreso. On the other hand I have and would again put my own safety in jeopardy to save and protect others in this life, even with uncertain outcomes; I suspect that my inclination that direction would continue after my exit from this life, so maybe even one would be enough.

Not that I personally believe in the pearly gates scenario; just answering whether or not I'd be willing to sacrifice myself for the benefit of others.
Click to expand...

I believe I didn't but Jesus chose for me and as my master He can do that. I served two weeks in county prison so that two men would be saved and two future preachers ministered to. Other's also benefitted because I was able to hold church despite the fact that no church services were being provided by outside ministers. I believe I enjoyed that immensely. Hell might be a little fun but not nearly as much.

I believe the scenario is possible but the idea that my going to Hell would be a way to save people seems unlikely.
 
amorphous_constellation

amorphous_constellation

Well-Known Member
Mestemia said:
Interesting how so many people refuse to address the point other than dismiss it.
One wonders what they fear in answering the question?
Click to expand...

Well, to be honest I don't want to really address it either. Then again I don't really believe in heaven or hell, though maybe that's not the best excuse. I think their maybe an afterlife however, but it is more part of a natural process where all the souls arrive more on the same plane.
 
Muffled

Muffled

Jesus in me
DawudTalut said:
Peace be on you.
It is in accordance with Torah and Quran and common sense too.
Click to expand...

I believe I am always at peace and in hamony with my maker.

I believe your understanding of the word of God is lacking and you are jsut seeing what you wish to see.
 
McBell

McBell

Unbound
Muffled said:
I believe I am always at peace and in hamony with my maker.

I believe your understanding of the word of God is lacking and you are jsut seeing what you wish to see.
Click to expand...
Interesting accusation.
How do you know you aren't just seeing what you want to see?
 
Muffled

Muffled

Jesus in me
Mestemia said:
Interesting accusation.
How do you know you aren't just seeing what you want to see?
Click to expand...

I see according to what Jesus sees through me and I find HIm most dependable and I usually agree with His logic having found out from experience that He knows more than me, is more intelligent than me and is wiser than me.
 
fantome profane

fantome profane

Anti-Woke = Anti-Justice
Premium Member
I would, but I would have one request before I am sent to hell.

I would ask to be allowed to look upon the face of God just once.


And then spit in it.
 
McBell

McBell

Unbound
Muffled said:
I see according to what Jesus sees through me and I find HIm most dependable and I usually agree with His logic having found out from experience that He knows more than me, is more intelligent than me and is wiser than me.
Click to expand...
You did not answer the question.
 
Twilight Hue

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Would Jesus jump into hell? Oh wait he's said to have done it already.

Wait a minute. Never mind. No point. People are still going to be in hell.
.
Dosent work.
 
Politesse

Politesse

Amor Vincit Omnia
Of course I would, a life lived at another's expense isn't worth living for a year, much less eternity - It would drive me mad. I think it's telling that so many value Jesus only as a no strings attached scapegoat, instead of a teacher. He taught us what it means to love another person.

My command is this: Love each other as I loved you. Greater love has no one than this: to lay down one’s life for one’s friends.
 
N

Nietzsche

The Last Prussian
Premium Member
"You can throw your sins onto somebody else, vulgarly known as scapegoating. In fact, originating as scapegoating in the same area, the same desert. I can pay your debt if I love you. I can serve your term in prison if I love you very much. I can volunteer to do that. I can't take your sins away, because I can't abolish your responsibility, and I shouldn't offer to do so. Your responsibility has to stay with you. There's no vicarious redemption. There very probably, in fact, is no redemption at all. It's just a part of wish-thinking, and I don't think wish-thinking is good for people either."

- Christopher Hitchens
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top