Atheism is a faith

[Scuba Pete]

I know for a fact that my cat worships me and the ground I walk on.

Bwahahahahahaha!
Bwahahahahahahahaahahahahahaha!
(Even my cat is laughing at that one!)

 

[Guitar's Cry]

I would make the claim that atheists who make the stance of atheism at least have faith in the information that leads to the stance. For those atheists that have never had the choice, the matter of faith is irrelevant.

 

[Papersock]

Let's say that atheism is an assumption, and so is a belief in god because there is no proof for or against the existence of a god.
I think a belief in something with no proof is a greater assumption than not to believe in something with no proof.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Let's say that atheism is an assumption, and so is a belief in god because there is no proof for or against the existence of a god.

Good grief! Not all 'assumptions' are created equal.

 

[Papersock]

I would make the claim that atheists who make the stance of atheism at least have faith in the information that leads to the stance. For those atheists that have never had the choice, the matter of faith is irrelevant.

Good point.
But I would hope one does not simply take information completely by faith without challenging the information to make sure it is true, or nearest to truth as is possible.
Still, atheism, then, is not a faith, although an atheist might have faith.

 

[Papersock]

Good grief! Not all 'assumptions' are created equal.

Was that not the point of the second part of my post?
Maybe I'm not very good at explaining myself...

Anyway, the sentence you quoted was exactly what some theists were saying.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Why are theists so invested in characterizing atheism as a faith or a religion. It exudes insecurity, like awkward adolescents whining:

"I know you are but what am I?"​

It truly does impress me as unseemly.

 

[MoonWater]

Some of them might and we just don't know it. But most animals do not have the cognitive ability to believe in much of anything. Unless you have a very wide definition of the word believe. I doubt very much that bacteria are "aware" of anything in the same sense we are.
And I did not say that animals are inanimate objects. I said that inanimate objects do not believe in god. Do I have to present proof of that?

Sure why not. Do you also have proof that animals do not have the "cognitive ability" to believe, Do you have proof that belief even has anything to do with cognitive ability? If there's one thing I learned from math(other than what an enormous headache it is) it's that when you get down to the nitty gritty pretty much everything we hold to be true or not true, real or not real, etc. is based on assumptions. The statement "if A=B and B=C then A=C" is considered a true statement. Is this statment logical? Yes. Is it provable or has it been proven? No (if it has then please provide the proof). Following this line of thought one realizes that just about everyhting(some would argue yes, everything) is based on faith. Even a statment as simple as "that's a rock" could be considered a faith based statment . After all could you really proof that the object is in fact a rock. All your senses may tell you it is but how do you know your aren't experiencing some sort of illusion, how do you know your senses aren't being fooled? All scientific scrutiny might tell you it's a rock but how do you know the scrutiny isn't flawed? Now granted if my senses tell me it's a rock then unless evidence is presented to the contrary I'll accept that it is a rock. My point is that there is a great deal of "truth" that is faith based(because there is no proof behind it), more than most(if not all) people realize.

 

[Papersock]

Sure why not. Do you also have proof that animals do not have the "cognitive ability" to believe, Do you have proof that belief even has anything to do with cognitive ability? If there's one thing I learned from math(other than what an enormous headache it is) it's that when you get down to the nitty gritty pretty much everything we hold to be true or not true, real or not real, etc. is based on assumptions. The statement "if A=B and B=C then A=C" is considered a true statement. Is this statment logical? Yes. Is it provable or has it been proven? No (if it has then please provide the proof). Following this line of thought one realizes that just about everyhting(some would argue yes, everything) is based on faith. Even a statment as simple as "that's a rock" could be considered a faith based statment . After all could you really proof that the object is in fact a rock. All your senses may tell you it is but how do you know your aren't experiencing some sort of illusion, how do you know your senses aren't being fooled? All scientific scrutiny might tell you it's a rock but how do you know the scrutiny isn't flawed? Now granted if my senses tell me it's a rock then unless evidence is presented to the contrary I'll accept that it is a rock. My point is that there is a great deal of "truth" that is faith based(because there is no proof behind it), more than most(if not all) people realize.

That's basically what I meant when earlier in this thread I said

Everything has some possibility of being wrong. In some cases it's a very small possibility, however.

 

[MoonWater]

Why are theists so invested in characterizing atheism as a faith or a religion. It exudes insecurity, like awkward adolescents whining:

"I know you are but what am I?"​

It truly does impress me as unseemly.

Why does anyone invest in characterizing anything? i'm here because I like to debate. Are there "better" things I could be doing with my time? Certainly, but it doesn't change the fact that I am here nor does it change the fact that I am participating in this debate because I find it stimulating and fun. Besides ask enough people and no matter what your doing there will always be someone who thinks that there are "better" things you could do with your time. Because "better" is a matter of opinion.

 

[Scuba Pete]

Why are theists so invested in characterizing atheism as a faith or a religion.

Hmnnn, perhaps they are galvanized by the condescension and the mocking displayed by many atheists. Perhaps it's an attempt to level the playing field and demand some intellectual honesty.

But your question brings up yet another: Why do atheists deny their faith so vociferously?

 

[MoonWater]

That's basically what I meant when earlier in this thread I said

Everything has some possibility of being wrong. In some cases it's a very small possibility, however.

:slap: Forgot about that post. lol. I guess great minds think alike(at least in some areas)

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Hmnnn, perhaps they are galvanized by the condescension and the mocking displayed by many atheists. Perhaps it's an attempt to level the playing field and demand some intellectual honesty.

I agree that it's an attempt to level the playing field.

But your question brings up yet another: Why do atheists deny their faith so vociferously?

Before I respond, may I ask if you accept the definition of faith offered by CARM?

 

[Rolling_Stone]

Why are theists so invested in characterizing atheism as a faith or a religion.

Because it comes with assumptions that demand faith. Often the assumptions are unacknowledged, as this thread proves. Unacknowledged assumptions proves inattentiveness, intellectual dishonesty or a kind of insanity.

 

[Scuba Pete]

CARM? You lost me there. Perhaps it is best if you restate the definition, or predicate your response on that definition.

 

[Guitar's Cry]

Good point.
But I would hope one does not simply take information completely by faith without challenging the information to make sure it is true, or nearest to truth as is possible.

This is true, though really it starts by having a faith in our senses, which is both natural and risky.

Still, atheism, then, is not a faith, although an atheist might have faith.

I think I agree with this. I might assert that since I make the assumption that information is taken on faith when a claim is made, anything concluded from that information is faith-based. But I don't think I want to make that assertion...yet.

 

[Rolling_Stone]

But your question brings up yet another: Why do atheists deny their faith so vociferously?

Maybe they are refugees from the 60's and 70's, when peace activists violently protested violence.

 

[MoonWater]

Because it comes with assumptions that demand faith. Often the assumptions are unacknowledged, as this thread proves. Unacknowledged assumptions proves inattentiveness, intellectual dishonesty or a kind of insanity.

I wish I could speak so simply and eloquently.:bow: But no I always have to go into these lengthy descriptions that could be more easily displayed and understood in a couple of sentences:cover:.

 

[Guitar's Cry]

CARM? You lost me there. Perhaps it is best if you restate the definition, or predicate your response on that definition.

Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry. Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Papersock]

:slap: Forgot about that post. lol. I guess great minds think alike(at least in some areas)

The only difference is that you call it faith and I would call it something like a belief based on probability. But, again, this is semantics.