Awareness of existence

[Secret Chief]

The word "soul" is descriptive in Buddhism even when the word is not used. The journey remains reincarnation and the eventual extinction of the "soul?"

Mein gott, it's like talking to a Bahai.

"Would you be surprised to learn that reincarnation is not a Buddhist teaching?
"Reincarnation" normally is understood to be the transmigration of a soul"
- What the Buddha Didn't Teach About Reincarnation

I'm on a hiding to nothing here aren't I? I say Buddhism rejects the notion of a soul, but you say it doesn't; it just doesn't use the word. This could obviously be used ad infinitum. Buddhism rejects the notion of a creator deity that made the world in six days. No it doesn't, it just uses different words.

 

[shunyadragon]

Mein gott, it's like talking to a Bahai.

Nice you begin your post with an insult.

Actually I am fundamentally a Universalist and I serious question claims of all Religions including Baha'i. I go seriously question when believers claim what the Enlightened or Messianic figures taught or did not teach

"Would you be surprised to learn that reincarnation is not a Buddhist teaching?
"Reincarnation" normally is understood to be the transmigration of a soul"
- What the Buddha Didn't Teach About Reincarnation

You may claim is normally understood with this rewording, but regardless of whether you describe it as reincarnation or transmutation. It is the journey through lives to achieve the goal of extinction,

I'm on a hiding to nothing here aren't I? I say Buddhism rejects the notion of a soul, but you say it doesn't; it just doesn't use the word. This could obviously be used ad infinitum. Buddhism rejects the notion of a creator deity that made the world in six days. No it doesn't, it just uses different words.

Well. this depends on how you define the subjective concept of the soul. The concept of the 'self' in Buddhism can very well translate to the souls, just a variation of what others may call the soul differently in different religions.

Ātman (Buddhism) - Wikipedia). Ātman

Ātman (/ˈɑːtmən/), attā or attan in Buddhism is the concept of self, and is found in Buddhist literature's discussion of the concept of non-self (Anatta). Most Buddhist traditions and texts reject the premise of a permanent, unchanging atman (self, soul).

Differences claimed from the human subjective perspective do indeed divide religions.

 

[Secret Chief]

Nice you begin your post with an insult.

You may claim is normally understood with this rewording, but regardless of whether you describe it as reincarnation or transmutation. It is the journey through lives to achieve the goal of extinction,


Well. this depends on how you define the soul. The concept of the 'self' in Buddhism can very well translate to the souls, just a variation of what others may call the soul differently in different religions.

Ātman (Buddhism) - Wikipedia). Ātman

Ātman (/ˈɑːtmən/), attā or attan in Buddhism is the concept of self, and is found in Buddhist literature's discussion of the concept of non-self (Anatta). Most Buddhist traditions and texts reject the premise of a permanent, unchanging atman (self, soul).

I knew I shouldn't have bothered. Carry on. Next up - the Buddha was a Messenger of God: different words but that's the gist.

 

[Secret Chief]

Nice you begin your post with an insult.

Not an insult, just how tedious this gets. I think @Trailblazer and I have done it to death and wouldn't bother any more. Claiming Buddhism is about souls is a Bahai claim. If you want to talk insults, I could feel insulted by your telling me Buddhism is concerned with souls. But I'm not.

edit- just seen you are a Bahai. If I'd known I'd probably not bothered responding. Standard patronising, misleading and arrogant stuff then. Please explain my religion to me.

 

[Paul65]

What exactly do you mean by that?

I don't get how this makes time responsible for the evil that exists on Earth, could you please explain?

Also, while you're at it how do you define "evil"?

And another question: what exactly does your religion teach about good and evil? According to your religion how should we behave towards other humans... and why should we behave as we are supposed to?

Evil is war, the suffering of people, diseases. Time is universal, like day and night, it can be both good and bad. By honoring God in the time, our lives become better, I have experienced it myself. No one forces you to behave in any way; just live according to your conscience because it is the indicator of whether you are a good or bad person.

 

[SalixIncendium]

Not an insult, just how tedious this gets. I think @Trailblazer and I have done it to death and wouldn't bother any more. Claiming Buddhism is about souls is a Bahai claim. If you want to talk insults, I could feel insulted by your telling me Buddhism is concerned with souls. But I'm not.

Of course not. I think anyone who has engaged a Baha'i in debate knows many of them like to try to shoehorn their concepts into others' religions to make themselves appear "universal."

 

[Secret Chief]

Of course not. I think anyone who has engaged a Baha'i in debate knows many of them like to try to shoehorn their concepts into others' religions to make themselves appear "universal."

In my ignorance, as I just edited to add above, I didn't know I was being corrected by a Bahai. They must **** a lot of people off I imagine.

 

[Valjean]

I would prefer to use the term 'religion for everyone'.

Interesting,
This implies a purpose or function of religion. What makes a religion "for" someone?

Some see religion as a social community of people with similar values and culture. Some see it as a way save themselves from the wrath of a punitive god. Some see it as a mechanism of social control, to avoid anarchy. Buddhism sees it as a psycho-therapeutic modality. Me, as a Vedantist, see it as a metaphysical theory; an ontological abstraction.

First and foremost, in my religion, the primordial beginning, or the birth of God, is described. This is very important because it brings God closer to every person since we are all born as well. The second crucial matter is an explanation that God is not responsible for the evil on Earth, as time, which originated from God, is to blame. It may sound a bit convoluted, but that's the crux of the matter. In the cycles of time, I have written that the entire cycle involves the creation and destruction of the cosmos, and this is happening all the time; that's what destiny is all about. My religion does not conflict with science because what we are discovering through science aligns with religion, as it happened within time.

"Birth of God?" Does God have a beginning? When was that? How do you know? How did this birth come about?
"Primordial beginning sounds like the "Big Bang," ~13,8 billion years ago. Is this what you're referring to?

Are these "cycles of time" anything like the Hindu Yugas?

It does not conflict with science, but neither does it appear to accord with science. I have not seen this "religion" proposed in Theoretical Physics.
Have they missed something? What have you discovered that science seems unaware of?

 

[Valjean]

The process is different in each religion, yes, but we're talking about "ultimate goals," not processes.

Good point. The ultimate goal of Hinduism, for example, is very different from the goal and purpose of the Abrahamic religions.

 

[Eddi]

live according to your conscience because it is the indicator of whether you are a good or bad person.

I agree with this

But I also think that people often need help to live according to their conscience, some good people have a perfectly functioning moral compass but pay little attention to it because they are distracted from it or are misguided

How can your religion help good people to live according to their conscience?

And can it help people who are bad people behave in better ways?

Evil is war, the suffering of people, diseases. Time is universal, like day and night, it can be both good and bad.

How does time cause war, the suffering of people, and diseases?

And I don't get why you are ascribing moral qualities to time. How exactly does that work?

And why exactly do you believe that war, suffering, and disease are evil? What makes them evil to you?

By honoring God in the time, our lives become better, I have experienced it myself.

How does one honour God?

Also, I know you're new to this, so let me explain the quote feature better to you, it seems you don't yet know how to do it. If you highlight the text that another person has written a thing that says "+Quote" appears. If you press that the website (or whatever) remembers the text you have selected. You can do this multiple times. If you then go into where you type your messages you should see a button that says "Insert Quotes" below the text field. If you press that it puts what you have selected into different sections (like how your words appear in this message) and you can then address the bits you have highlighted in detail, as I have done. Thought this may help you get the most out of the forums!

(edited to correct typographical error)

 

[Trailblazer]

Claiming Buddhism is about souls is a Bahai claim.

Baha'is might claim it but it is not a Baha'i teaching that Buddhism is about souls. That is why I do not claim it.

 

[Valjean]

Evil is war, the suffering of people, diseases. Time is universal, like day and night, it can be both good and bad. By honoring God in the time, our lives become better, I have experienced it myself. No one forces you to behave in any way; just live according to your conscience because it is the indicator of whether you are a good or bad person.

"Honoring God?" What is this "God?" Why should it be honored?

Living according to your conscience is a good approach, IMHO. Religions advocate and justify all sorts of "evils" that I think we'd both agree on. Blind following is both an intellectual abdication and morally hazardous. I prefer a Humanist moral philosophy.

 

[shunyadragon]

Not an insult, just how tedious this gets. I think @Trailblazer and I have done it to death and wouldn't bother any more.

I am not @Trailblazer

Claiming Buddhism is about souls is a Bahai claim. If you want to talk insults, I could feel insulted by your telling me Buddhism is concerned with souls. But I'm not.

No, it is a problem of religions trying make subjective claims about things they are in reality clueless as to what their reality is like 'what is the difference between the concept of the soul and Atman

Of course not. I think anyone who has engaged a Baha'i in debate knows many of them like to try to shoehorn their concepts into others' religions to make themselves appear "universal."

Actually the Baha'i believes the universal exists, and NOT that it is the UNIVERSAL. In the concept of progtrssive revelation no religion represents the universal. The 'Source' some call Gods is the UNIVERSAL.

edit- just seen you are a Bahai. If I'd known I'd probably not bothered responding. Standard patronising, misleading and arrogant stuff then. Please explain my religion to me.

More insults!

This series only confirms that the individual ancient tribal religions and their divisions, ie all Buddhists, do not agree, ezch in their own way make exclusive subjective claims that other relgions do not make. One significant possibility is that they are all wrong!!!

 

[Trailblazer]

Of course not. I think anyone who has engaged a Baha'i in debate knows many of them like to try to shoehorn their concepts into others' religions to make themselves appear "universal."

Maybe some Baha'is do that and maybe I used to do that, but I have been listening to how others feel for 5 years, and by listening I have also learned about other religions and how they are different from my religion, so I try not to do that anymore. Rather, I look at both the differences and the similarities between religions.

 

[SalixIncendium]

Maybe some Baha'is do that and maybe I used to do that, but I have been listening to how others feel for 5 years, and by listening I have also learned about other religions and how they are different from my religion, so I try not to do that anymore. Rather, I look at both the differences and the similarities between religions.

That's why I said "many" and not "all."

 

[Trailblazer]

That's why I said "many" and not "all."

Indeed, if you had said "all" that would be the fallacy of hasty generalization and the fallacy of black and white thinking.

 

[Eddi]

live according to your conscience because it is the indicator of whether you are a good or bad person.

What would your advice be to someone whose conscience tells them to do evil?

What would your advice be to a serial killer who is locked up on Death Row?

 

[Paul65]

I agree with this

But I also think that people often need help to live according to their conscience, some good people have a perfectly functioning moral compass but pay little attention to it because they are distracted from it or a misguided

How can your religion help good people to live according to their conscience?

And can it help people who are bad people behave in better ways?

Thank you for your help. Time will eventually transform a bad person into a good one; they just need to make the effort. It costs nothing and will certainly help.

How does time cause war, the suffering of people, and diseases?

And I don't get why you are ascribing moral qualities to time. How exactly does that work?

And why exactly do you believe that war, suffering, and disease are evil? What makes them evil to you?

I don't know if you watch the news on TV. Has anyone in your family not died from a serious illness or been killed in an accident? That is indeed evil. Time directs everything, even our conversation.

 

[Paul65]

How does one honour God?

How to worship God, you can read on my website.

 

[Vinayaka]

The website is on Google; don't spread disinformation. Yes, that's my website. Awareness of Existence

Okay, I'll try again.