Ayran is synonymous with Sanskrit, and what all happened to the people who speak the Tamil language

[GoodAttention]

So 2300 BCE was when starting in the Levant when the Akkadian Empire was in control.
Early Dynastic IIIB 2500–2334 BC
Dynasty of Akkad (Sargon the Great) 2334–2154 BC

@GoodAttention While the Early Dynastic IIIB and Dynasty of Akkad (Sargon the Great) were happening and you @GoodAttention explained that the Tamil language didn't come from the Akkadian, then during this time from people who spoke the Tamil language, did they during this time have three zones, and was this Ancient Southern India where these three zones were?

This is an interesting question, because unlike the Egyptian and Mesopotamian civilizations which had a centralized "kingship", it does not appear that this was the case for the Indus Valley (from my understanding). So I don't believe there is a zone structure as such, since to me this refers to an "area of influence".

Furthermore, Ancient South Indian (ASI) and Ancient North Indian (ANI) I believe refer to genetic markers to differentiate the two groups.

My understanding there are 3 factors that we can use to consider history of peoples, namely

(1) Genetics (10s of thousands of years)
(2) Language (Hundreds to thousands of years)
(3) Location/movements (Hundreds of years)

Example of zones in another thread, however, I wonder if the people who spoke Tamil also had these same three zones.



@GoodAttention
When reading the PDF further below in this post showing zones below

Keep in mind: I'm not saying this is the date and areas that you're referring to: when reading this PDF, I'm showing zone structures, and did the people who spoke Tamil also use these zone structures too, or something similar, during 2300 BCE

Here's the PDF

Biblical Claims About Solomon’s Kingdom in Light of Egyptian “Three-Zone” Ideology of Territory

Biblical Claims About Solomon’s Kingdom in Light of Egyptian “Three-Zone” Ideology of Territory

www.academia.edu

I am not certain, but I believe the question to ask is how far south and east of the Indus Valley was the presence of any Tamil language?

 

[Bharat Jhunjhunwala]

So 2300 BCE was when starting in the Levant when the Akkadian Empire was in control.
Early Dynastic IIIB 2500–2334 BC
Dynasty of Akkad (Sargon the Great) 2334–2154 BC

@GoodAttention While the Early Dynastic IIIB and Dynasty of Akkad (Sargon the Great) were happening and you @GoodAttention explained that the Tamil language didn't come from the Akkadian, then during this time from people who spoke the Tamil language, did they during this time have three zones, and was this Ancient Southern India where these three zones were?

Example of zones in another thread, however, I wonder if the people who spoke Tamil also had these same three zones.



@GoodAttention
When reading the PDF further below in this post showing zones below

Keep in mind: I'm not saying this is the date and areas that you're referring to: when reading this PDF, I'm showing zone structures, and did the people who spoke Tamil also use these zone structures too, or something similar, during 2300 BCE

Here's the PDF

Biblical Claims About Solomon’s Kingdom in Light of Egyptian “Three-Zone” Ideology of Territory

Biblical Claims About Solomon’s Kingdom in Light of Egyptian “Three-Zone” Ideology of Territory

www.academia.edu

At 2300 bce there was no Tamil. Entire south India was uninhabited. People migrated from the Indus after it's collapse at 1500 BCE and Tamil evolved thereafter.

 

[GoodAttention]

At 2300 bce there was no Tamil.

Yet the RigVeda has Tamil loan words? How old is the RigVeda?

You yourself have said that Tamil cannot be excluded as the language spoken in the Indus Valley.

My understanding is that some people from the Indus Valley migrated southward to the Indian Peninsula at 1500 BCE. Some of these became the Tamils. They may have indeed maintained the original language of the Indus Valley, but Tamil has not helped decipher the Indus Valley script, so it is not clear what is the relationship between Tamil and Indus Valley language, but association cannot be ruled out.

Entire south India was uninhabited.

Uninhabited? Evidence is to the contrary.

History of South India - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

People migrated from the Indus after it's collapse at 1500 BCE and Tamil evolved thereafter.

Which people are you talking about?

IVC is considered to have declined at 1900BCE at the time of the 4.2ky event combined with the influx of Indo-Aryan peoples.

Movement of peoples out of the Indus south-east occured at the same time.

 

[GoodAttention]

Continuing on with the theory that the Hebrew patriarchs travelled east, I will attempt to give as accurate phonetic translations.

Abram

அப்பர்​

appar n. 1. Ram, he-goat;

The adding of m at the end could signify "the", or the man who is. This then becomes அப்பரம். This word I believe is also used colloquially to ask or say "and then", perhaps telling that the name will change.

Sarai

சார்​

cār --சாரு, கிறேன், ந்தேன், வேன், சார, v. n. To lean upon, to recline against, சாய. 2. To rest on or in, to repose on, to depend on, to adhere to, பற்றிக்கொள்ள. 3. To apply to, to resort to, to take shelter or refuge with, அடைய. 4. To approach, to approximate, to incline towards, அணுக. 5. To gain access to, to reach, to arrive at, கிட்ட. 6. To side with, to join a party ஓர்பாற்சார. 7. To be attached to, connected with, &c., அனுசாரமாக. 8. To be biassed or warped in judgment, to be partial to, நடுநிலைகோண. (c.) 9. To be adjacent, contig uous, to join, அடுக்க. 1. To come on- as events, disease, &c., சுகதுக்கங்கள்சார. 11. To tend or incline towards--as in color, smell, taste, temper, quality, &c., பொ ருந்த.--Note. The verb sometimes con veys a transitive sense. அழகுசார்ந்தபூ. The beautiful flower. (p.) நான்போய்ச்சார்ந்தவிடம். The party with which I am connected by affinity or marriage. (c.)

The name is only complete when adding a Tamil letter to the end, ஐ or ai. This is specifically a vowel, and of the 12 vowels in Tamil it stands alone. It has a deeper meaning related to motherhood I hope to write about later. Written out in full the name is சார்ஐ.

Abraham

அப்பிரகம்​

appirakam s. Mica or talc, ஓர்வகைலோகக்கல். Wils. p. 59. AB'H RAKA. Of this are five kinds:1. பொன் னப்பிரகம், gold-colored mica. 2. வெள்ளி யப்பிரகம், silver-colored mica. 3. தேனப் பிரகம், honey-colored mica. 4. கிருஷ்ணாப் பிரகம், black-colored mica. 5. கெந்தகாப் பிரகம்; yellow-colored mica.

Mica is interesting for many reasons, but I believe the metaphor for the name is because a single "book" can be divided into many sheets, signifying the many descendants the will come from Abraham. Mica is also ground to give paint, and has medicinal properties.


Sarah

சாராக​

cārāka adv. சார்² + ஆ-. Benami;மலரனையாக. Nāñ.

Benami is a South Asian term "denoting a purchase of property that is conducted in such a way as to conceal the identity of the true buyer". The name is given the moment she is blessed to give Abraham a son. The "ka" which is added to make feminine is not needed as it is already implied in many ways, including her previous name, and that she is to now become a mother. The "ka" is also then given to Isaac.

Isaac

ஈச(க்க)ன்​

īcaṉ * n. īša. 1. Supreme Being; Lord of the universe;

If we are to describe how Isaac came to exist, we could say he is "of/by/from God", but by adding the (க்க) to make icaakkan, the word collapses since it now says "God's eye". I believe this is what makes the name humerous within the Hebrew context, and hence why it has the meaning it does. To keep the meaning without the idolotry, the name is shortened to icaak, or ஈசக்.

Rebekkah

ரப்பை(க்க)​

rappai n. Eyelid. See இரப்பை.

The poetry of this name speaks for itself. Adding the same two letters as for Isaac, the name is both complete and made feminine, but also the coupling of the two individuals, given it then translates to "inside the eyelid".

Continuing to provide Tamil considerations I have explored from the names mentioned in the Hebrew scriptures.

Adding a note to clarify the ச letter in Tamil is pronounced "sa", and not "ca" as is transliterated in the descriptions.


Haran

காரன்​

kāraṉ part. kāra. Masculinetermination of certain nouns, meaning doer,possessor, as vēlai-k-kāraṉ, paṇa-k-kāraṉ வேலைக்காரன் பணக்காரன் என்பவற்றிற்போல,வினைமுதல் உடைமை முதலிய பொருளில்வரும் ஆண்பாற்பெயர் விகுதி

This is not a name that is dignified in any way. The term "possessor" is used because a "karan" is determined by what he does or what he owns. Personally, I think this is to describe a person who was greedy, selfish, lustful, and immoral, hence why he had an "early" death, without any lasting consequence other than his children. In this sense, he is the opposite of a righteous patriarch.


Lot/Lut

லுத்(தன்)​

luttaṉ n. lubdha. Miser;உலோபி. லுத்தனுக்கு இரட்டிச்செலவு.

I believe this is a somewhat fitting description for the son of Haran, who was "too cheap" or "too possessive" to have his own daughters married. The parenthesis around the last two letters separates Lut, meaning miser, with "than", meaning the man or person who is.


Milcah

மீலம்(க)​

mīlam n. Heaven; வானம். (சங்.அக.)

This name is in stark contrast to her brother, which the scriptures do at times attempt to distance from each other. It is as if she takes from her mother (whomever she is) rather than her father Haran. Adding the "ka" letter within the parenthesis whilst dropping the preceeding "im" makes the name feminine, sounding out as Milakah. Interestingly, "akah" sounds out as elder sister, used when referring to a female (generally elder) respectfully.


Iscah

இச்சம்(க)​

iccam * n. icchā. Wish. Seeஇச்சை. புணர்த்திய விச்சத்துப் பெருக்கத்திற் றுனைந்து(பரிபா. 7, 37).

There is mystery and wonder around the sister of Milcah in the Hebrew scriptures, as much as there is an element of sadness too. Using the same approach, the name would sound out as Issakah. There are three levels to this name I note, first that it can mean "she wished to be the older sister", in which case she would have been married to Nahor and become a mother. Second is the making of her name sound out as the feminine form of Isaac. Lastly is, in one sense her wish comes true if using the Tamil cultural context, given she becomes an older sister to Isaac as their fathers are brothers.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Aiyo sambhar, கண்ணில் பார்க்க முடியாது! (I will not even look at it!)

Except when it is part of a thali with a ghee dosa, paper thin of course.

Speaking of which, in the south the thali is tied at marriage, do you also have this custom?

Perhaps not, if it was prepared by my wife.
We have a different system among Kashmiris. It is a combination of two things, At-haru, hanging from the ear and holding a Dej-haru, an appendage like a small shaving brush with silver or gold thread. Muslims too wear it, but their's used to be of cotton threads. You can see the married women wearing that in the images below.
Apart from that Kashmiri women wear a small non-discript gold ring on a thread after marriage and that is known simply as 'at'.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Yet the RigVeda has Tamil loan words? How old is the RigVeda?

RigVeda is at least 6,000 years old. Could be even older (from before the ice-age). It is the sole surviving lore of the Proto-Indo-Europeans. Of course, its language and even content has changed many a time, but we still find indications of its time in the sub-Arctic regions, especially a thirty day dawn and dusk and an Arctic night of two months when sun was not visible at all. Hindus still have that - 'ati-ratra' (the greater night).

Tamil words in RigVeda or Sanskrit words in Tamil do not surprise me. After all they have lived together for some 3,500 years and intermarried. All brahmins are not Aryan brahmins. The local priests and shamans were accepted in the four-tiered 'varna' system. and so were the warrior clans.

 

[GoodAttention]

Perhaps not, if it was prepared by my wife.

By the sounds of it you will not leave enough to share

We have s different system among Kashmiris. It is a combination of two things, At-haru, hanging from the ear and holding a Dij-haru, an appendage like a small shaving brush with silver or gold thread. Muslims too wear it, but their's used to be of cotton threads. You can see the married women wearing that in the image below.
Apart from that Kashmiri women wear a small non-discript gold ring on a thread after marriage and that is known as 'at'.

View attachment 97739

Thank you for sharing. As always the women are pious, contemplative, and joyful.
The young man on the left looks like he is whispering a joke (he is of course praying).
The gentleman on the right going through his calendar for the next event he must attend.

 

[Aupmanyav]

By the sounds of it you will not leave enough to share

Thank you for sharing. As always the women are pious, contemplative, and joyful.
The young man on the left looks like he is whispering a joke (he is of course praying).
The gentleman on the right going through his calendar for the next event he must attend.

To tell you truly, my wife has 'barkat' (prosperity) in her hands. What she prepares does not finish for days, and we have to eat it for days after days.
It is a 'Shiv Ratri' photograph. The celebration is held at mid-night. The gentleman is reading out some prayer or mantra. That is the time when 'Rama Braur' (Rama, the cat) knocks on your door. Asked what does he bring, he answeres in his gruff voice - Prosperity, health and happiness (it used to be an elder member of the family). Then the door of the house is opened for 'Rama Braur'. We used to be awakened from sleep for the ceremony when we were children. Mind you, Kashmiri brahmins are non-vegetarian and meat was offered to Lord Shiva. Of the three family Goddesses (Kula Devis) for Kashmiri brahmins, ours is 'Jwala' and she is non-vegetarian. 'Ragnya' too is non-vegetarian, only 'Sharika' is a strict vegetarian. However, most Kashmiris have abandoned that tradition now under the influence of Vaishnavism.