Bakers Who Refused Lesbian Couple A Wedding Cake WILL Have To Pay $135,000

[oldbadger]

Court rules Oregon bakers who refused to make lesbian couple a wedding cake WILL have to pay them $135,000 in damages

Owners of the since-closed Gresham bakery Aaron and Melissa Klein had refused to make a wedding cake for Rachel and Laurel Bowman-Cryer
An appellate court Thursday upheld a penalty against the bakery owners and they will now have to pay the lesbian couple $135,000
Rachel and Laurel Bowman-Cryer praised the ruling saying: 'Oregon will not allow a 'Straight Couples Only' sign to be hung in bakeries or other stores'

An appellate court Thursday upheld a penalty against Oregon bakery owners who refused to make a cake for a same-sex wedding almost five years ago.

The owners of the since-closed Gresham bakery - Aaron and Melissa Klein - argued that state Labor Commissioner Brad Avakian violated state and federal laws by forcing them to pay emotional-distress damages of $135,000 to the lesbian couple Rachel and Laurel Bowman-Cryer.

Their lawyers said Avakian and the state Bureau of Labor and Industries violated the Kleins' rights as artists to free speech, their rights to religious freedom and their rights as defendants to a due process.

But the Oregon Court of Appeals sided with the state Thursday, saying the Kleins failed to show the state targeted them for their religious beliefs.

The judges also found public statements made by Avakian before deciding the case did not establish a lack of impartiality.

'Today's ruling sends a strong signal that Oregon remains open to all,' Avakian said after the 62-page opinion was released Thursday.

The decision comes weeks after the U.S. Supreme Court heard arguments in the high-profile case of a Colorado baker who refused to make a wedding cake for a same-sex couple.
source​

I can only say, good enough for them!

And the bakery is no more.
Now it's just a question of actually collecting a single dollar off the Kleins.
Self righteous folks need to think again before they let their bigotry control them.

But Punitive damages in the USA do look crazy OTT to us over here, though.

 

[Notanumber]

Crowd funding might help alleviate the financial pain of the court’s decision.

 

[Skwim]

Crowd funding might help alleviate the financial pain of the court’s decision.

Would you contribute?

.

 

[Notanumber]

Would you contribute?

.

It might be interesting to see how many would. Maybe a poll is required.

 

[Vee]

Perhaps you wouldn't, but I guarantee a lot of conservative Christians would very well scream persecution and seek vengeance if it were done to them.

I don't doubt. It is sad that some people sit on an imaginary high horse of righteousness but when they have the opportunity to show their true colors, the inside doesn't match the cover.
Everyone should try to be more understanding and forgiving instead if displaying that vengeful, aggressive behavior we see so much.

 

[Mindmaster]

You mean this actual teaching? (Matthew 10)

13 If the house is worthy, let your peace come upon it; but if it is not worthy, let your peace return to you. 14 If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, shake off the dust from your feet as you leave that house or town. 15 Truly I tell you, it will be more tolerable for the land of Sodom and Gomorrah on the day of judgment than for that town.

This seems pretty straightforwardly saying to have nothing to do with people who refuse to hear and accept Jesus. Do not see much friendly acceptance here.

Because of the size and scale of The Bible, it is possible to cherry pick lines from it to back up any line of thinking. We've lived 2,000 years since the time the book with authored, hopefully we all learned something since then. Taking any holy book for rote dogma is simply admitting your own failings as a human, knowledge has to be tempered with things like tolerance and humility or it simply leads to cruelty and arrogance. We don't live in this 2,000 year old world either, so there is also that. The minute this book becomes more important than your fellow human beings, every copy of it can be shredded and burned. It has outlived its usefulness...

 

[sayak83]

Because of the size and scale of The Bible, it is possible to cherry pick lines from it to back up any line of thinking. We've lived 2,000 years since the time the book with authored, hopefully we all learned something since then. Taking any holy book for rote dogma is simply admitting your own failings as a human, knowledge has to be tempered with things like tolerance and humility or it simply leads to cruelty and arrogance. We don't live in this 2,000 year old world either, so there is also that. The minute this book becomes more important than your fellow human beings, every copy of it can be shredded and burned. It has outlived its usefulness...

Actually Jesus's words are present in only four slim books of the entire Bible.
The point I am making is that the legend of Jesus's openness is much much exaggerated. The point I am also making is that it's better to clearly articulate that these principles come from one's own empathy and humane-ness rather than wrongly ascribing them to Jesus. Let's give credit where credit is due.. your own soul/conscience.

 

[Mindmaster]

Actually Jesus's words are present in only four slim books of the entire Bible.
The point I am making is that the legend of Jesus's openness is much much exaggerated. The point I am also making is that it's better to clearly articulate that these principles come from one's own empathy and humane-ness rather than wrongly ascribing them to Jesus. Let's give credit where credit is due.. your own soul/conscience.

It's very unlikely any of those words are actually Jesus'.

I would accept that some of it is probably inspired by his teachings, but it definitely is a victim of the "pass it down" phenomenon.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

Racism may have been based on religious beliefs by those who had twisted beliefs or twisted the scriptures, but by no means were all racists thoughts based in religion, nor were all who practiced religion racists. Many devout Christians were involved in fighting against slavery and racism. Still, this does not change the fact that one's skin color or race is not a moral behavior.

Ditto homophobia

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

You mean this actual teaching? (Matthew 10)

13 If the house is worthy, let your peace come upon it; but if it is not worthy, let your peace return to you. 14 If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, shake off the dust from your feet as you leave that house or town. 15 Truly I tell you, it will be more tolerable for the land of Sodom and Gomorrah on the day of judgment than for that town.

This seems pretty straightforwardly saying to have nothing to do with people who refuse to hear and accept Jesus. Do not see much friendly acceptance here.

You're assuming gay people aren't Christians.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Racism may have been based on religious beliefs by those who had twisted beliefs or twisted the scriptures, but by no means were all racists thoughts based in religion, nor were all who practiced religion racists. Many devout Christians were involved in fighting against slavery and racism. Still, this does not change the fact that one's skin color or race is not a moral behavior.

Neither is homosexuality. When a person owns and operates a public business he can't enforce his morals upon others.

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

Crowd funding might help alleviate the financial pain of the court’s decision.

Just a bit of speculation here; maybe a potential factor in why the fine was set so high is the increasing tendency of Christian 'victims' to get their fines crowd-funded and paid for them by their fellows?

 

[Subduction Zone]

And the bakery is no more.
Now it's just a question of actually collecting a single dollar off the Kleins.
Self righteous folks need to think again before they let their bigotry control them.

But Punitive damages in the USA do look crazy OTT to us over here, though.

One of the articles I linked said that the money was already in escrow. In other words even if they declared bankruptcy the money is gone from them.

ETA: They paid the fine almost exactly two years ago:

Sweet Cakes owners pay damages while continuing appeal of $135,000 bias case

The money has been sitting in escrow since, pending the final outcome of this trial.

 

[Subduction Zone]

You're assuming gay people aren't Christians.

Worse yet, it appears he is assuming that they are "immoral".

 

[Subduction Zone]

Just a bit of speculation here; maybe a potential factor in why the fine was set so high is the increasing tendency of Christian 'victims' to get their fines crowd-funded and paid for them by their fellows?

Could be. They got over $100,000 from a Gofundme page before it was shut down and received over a half million in total contributions. Sounds like a good way to make money to me

 

[oldbadger]

One of the articles I linked said that the money was already in escrow. In other words even if they declared bankruptcy the money is gone from them.

ETA: They paid the fine almost exactly two years ago:

Sweet Cakes owners pay damages while continuing appeal of $135,000 bias case

The money has been sitting in escrow since, pending the final outcome of this trial.

Fair enough.

Well, I don't know (or care) if the Kleins were Christians, but if they were then they bust Christian law by refusing to serve a prospective customer in the State of Oregan, because by breaking Oregan Legislation they broke Christian law, so I have no sympathy at all for 'em. (Romans 13:1)

And its no good if they would start screaming about old biblical laws because their God repealed those particular laws of Moses.

Nice one..........

 

[Subduction Zone]

Fair enough.

Well, I don't know (or care) if the Kleins were Christians, but if they were then they bust Christian law by refusing to serve a prospective customer in the State of Oregan, because by breaking Oregan Legislation they broke Christian law, so I have no sympathy at all for 'em. (Romans 13:1)

And its no good if they would start screaming about old biblical laws because their God repealed those particular laws of Moses.

Nice one..........

I will not claim that someone is "not a true Christian" yet I see Christians claim that about other Christians that disagree with their personal interpretation of the Bible quite often. And whether or not the Mosaic laws were repealed is debatable. From my understanding some of them did not apply to non-Jews, such as the dietary laws, but Jesus actually said that they weren't changed at all.

 

[oldbadger]

.............. And whether or not the Mosaic laws were repealed is debatable. From my understanding some of them did not apply to non-Jews, such as the dietary laws, but Jesus actually said that they weren't changed at all.

Yes, indeed that is what Jesus said....... he wanted all* the Mosaic laws reinstated and kept, especially the poor laws, but he did not want the 106 * scarificial laws re-instated.
But Christians don't take much notice of what Jesus said if Paul (or Cephas) said something more useful for the moment. Many Christians just cherry-pick the verses that suit their needs.
One group of extreme Christians would like to 'glass' (nuke?) Mecca, and if questioned about the righteousness of such action they will quote Revelations where Jesus returns with sword flicking from his mouth, or Jesus demanding that disciples sell personal effects to buy swords etc.
There are over a thousand differing guidances, rules and laws in the NT, a believer would just have to pick what suits.

 

[oldbadger]

Could be. They got over $100,000 from a Gofundme page before it was shut down and received over a half million in total contributions. Sounds like a good way to make money to me

Right.
That's it.
I'm off to get chucked off a bus, or refused a meal somewhere.
And then it's just the dreadful headache of how to spend all that money. I've already got a good mountain bike.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Right.
That's it.
I'm off to get chucked off a bus, or refused a meal somewhere.
And then it's just the dreadful headache of how to spend all that money. I've already got a good mountain bike.

Actually you would have to chuck someone off of your bus to be able to claim to be a "victim" as the Kleins did. Hmm, both fun and profitable. I'm off.