Banning ‘Woke’ Words in State Documents, Arkansas Governor Signs Executive Order

[icehorse]

Have you ever gone to a meeting of women who have been assaulted by transgender women in a public bathroom?

Has there ever been such a meeting? When? Where?

I don't think anyone on this forum has ever raised this as a concern, I know I have not.

 

[icehorse]

Why don't you consider paying less attention to other people's genitals and maybe pay more attention to yours?

Have you ever considered trying to understand the legitimate fears women have of being assaulted by men?

 

[Soandso]

Have you ever considered trying to understand the legitimate fears women have of being assaulted by men?

Transgender women aren't part of that category. They are a whole different category. Conflating the two constantly doesn't make it so

 

[icehorse]

Why?

I'm not going to go find stats for you, I'm going to rely on common sense:

I understand that some men are homophobic, and would rather not share locker rooms with gay men. But those homophobes aren't going to have an increased risk of being physically assaulted.

But if we allow men in women's safe spaces, women will - of course - be at a higher risk of assault.

 

[icehorse]

Transgender women aren't part of that category. They are a whole different category. Conflating the two constantly doesn't make it so

I've explained this many, many times, but okay...

The concern is that of NORMALIZING people who look like men going into women's safe spaces. Go do a search on gender ****.

Yes, I understand the current system is not perfect, but why make it worse?

And no, I'm not proposing genitalia inspection police (if I had a nickel for every time I've heard that bit of crap).

But as a society, we DO look out for each to some degree. We do call the cops when something seems dodgy.

 

[Revoltingest]

The concern is that of NORMALIZING people who look like men going into women's safe spaces. Go do a search on gender ****.

But it appears that you advocate that which you
ostensibly oppose, ie, trans men should use
women's lavatories because they were born women.

A women (by your definition)...

Moreover, to require that trans women use men's
lavatories so that men won't assault women in
women's lavatories, means that trans women who
look like women will be assaulted by men in men's
lavatories.

A man, by your definition....

 

[SkepticThinker]

I'm not going to go find stats for you, I'm going to rely on common sense:

I didn't ask you for stats. I asked you to explain why you think it was a weak comparison and why you think one is a legitimate safety issue and one is not.

Why are you so averse to answering questions?

And when are you going to point out how I'm being misogynistic?

Such a weak comparison!

One is a legitimate safety issue, one is not.

I understand that some men are homophobic, and would rather not share locker rooms with gay men. But those homophobes aren't going to have an increased risk of being physically assaulted.

What are you basing that on? Why are men not at risk of being physically assaulted by another man? I've heard some pretty bad stuff about what goes on in men's prisons.
I was in a bar just last week where a fight broke out. There weren't any trans people around. The fight was between two grown adult men.

But if we allow men in women's safe spaces, women will - of course - be at a higher risk of assault.

We're not allowing men into women's safe spaces. We're talking about trans women, aren't we?

 

[icehorse]

How many women have been assaulted by men in public rest rooms?

How many - in your opinion - is too many?

How many trans women in prison, transferred to women's prisons - have assaulted female prisoners? How many - in your opinion - is too many?

How many women have been assaulted by men in public rest rooms?

Here are just a few - easy to find - articles. There are many more.

But seriously, 1/6 of all women get assaulted by men. Your argument seems to be based on the suspension of common sense?

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0095069622000602

Where Do Most Sexual Assaults Take Place? - Plano Attorneys | Zendeh Del Law Firm, PLLC - Dallas

RAINN (Rape, Abuse & Incest National Network) is the largest anti-sexual violence organization in the United States. RAINN operates the National Sexual Assault Hotline (800-656-HOPE) and it partners with over 1,000 sexual assault providers across the country. It also operates the DoD Safe...

www.zenlawfirm.com

 

[Revoltingest]

Why are you so averse to answering questions?

Same concern I have.
Perhaps because the house of cards would fall?

 

[icehorse]

We're talking about trans women, aren't we?

No, we're talking about NORMALIZATION - please read ALL the posts!

 

[icehorse]

And when are you going to point out how I'm being misogynistic?

I'm tying to answer your question. To that end, in an honest attempt to communicate accurately, I asked you to confirm or deny I claim that I think you're making. Once you confirm that I'm understanding you correctly, I will answer question.

thanks

 

[icehorse]

But it appears that you advocate that which you
ostensibly oppose, ie, trans men should use
women's lavatories because they were born women.

Nope, I've NEVER proposed that.

But yet another strawman, you are indefatigable when it comes to generating fallacy arguments!

 

[fantome profane]

Have you ever considered trying to understand the legitimate fears women have of being assaulted by men?

The point is that you have not demonstrated that there is a legitimate fear of being assaulted by transgender women in public bathrooms.

However there is a legitimate fear of transgender women being assaulted by men. Have you ever considered tying to understand that?

 

[Revoltingest]

Nope, I've NEVER proposed that.

But yet another strawman, you are indefatigable when it comes to generating fallacy arguments!

You keep missing my claims about how your posts
"seem" or "appear". You don't counter them with
clarification. Instead, it's just the perfunctory old
"straw man" or "misogynist".

 

[SkepticThinker]

How many - in your opinion - is too many?

Answer my question first.

How many trans women in prison, transferred to women's prisons - have assaulted female prisoners? How many - in your opinion - is too many?

This isn't an opinion question.

How many - in your opinion - is too many?

How many trans women in prison, transferred to women's prisons - have assaulted female prisoners? How many - in your opinion - is too many?


Here are just a few - easy to find - articles. There are many more.

But seriously, 1/6 of all women get assaulted by men. Your argument seems to be based on the suspension of common sense?

I've been sexually assaulted by men. Both times, it was in the "comfort" of a private residence, by someone I already knew.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0095069622000602

Really? An article about lack of in-home toilets and how women defecating in open public areas in rural parts of India might be subject to higher rates of sexual assault?

And you think this relates to the topic of allowing trans people to use the washroom that matches their gender .... how?

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0095069622000602

From the article:

• 55% of sexual assaults occur at or near the victim’s home
• 15% of sexual assaults occur in a public place
• 12% of sexual assaults occur at or near a relative’s home
• 10% of sexual assaults are in enclosed public areas, such as a parking lot or a parking garage
• 8% of sexual assaults occur on school property

“What was the victim doing at the time the crime occurred?” According to RAINN, 48% of victims were sleeping or doing another activity at home; 29% were traveling to and from work, to and from school, or running errands; 12% were working; 7% were going to school, and 5% were doing another activity.


None of those say a thing about public washrooms.

 

[SkepticThinker]

No, we're talking about NORMALIZATION - please read ALL the posts!

NORMALIZATION of trans people using the washroom that matches their gender.

 

[icehorse]

None of those say a thing about public washrooms.

So something on the order of 30 million women - in the US alone - will be assaulted by men. In the stats I listed, that you copied:

15% occurred in public places
10% occurred in enclosed public areas

So rest rooms and locker rooms were not explicitly mentioned, but isn't it more than reasonable to assume that of the combined 25% from above, a significant percentage of those 7.5 MILLION assaults would occur in rest rooms or locker rooms?

 

[icehorse]

NORMALIZATION of trans people using the washroom that matches their gender.

I acknowledge that that's the point you're making. It is distinct from the point I'm making.

 

[icehorse]

You keep missing my claims about how your posts
"seem" or "appear". You don't counter them with
clarification. Instead, it's just the perfunctory old
"straw man" or "misogynist".

We would have more useful conversations if you stopped using fallacy arguments. What I'm not interested in doing is responding to your points (or anyone's), if they rely on a fallacy argument.

 

[Revoltingest]

We would have more useful conversations if you stopped using fallacy arguments.