That's the thread - where was the cause for this - other than just circumstances.
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brainwashed?
- Thread starter syo
- Start date
That's the thread - where was the cause for this - other than just circumstances.
Clearly we see that God wants children taught to believe and understand His Word. When a person—child or adult—believes that the Bible is true from the very first verse, he or she has a framework from which to understand and evaluate the claims of scientists, philosophers, theologians, and teachers of all sorts. Teaching a child to trust God’s Word is a righteous action and, above all, is not brainwashing. Instead, it is equipping him or her with completely reliable biblical truth by which all other claims are to be evaluated.
For example, the secularist wants to take Christian children and teach them the religion of humanism with its many tenets like materialism, atheism, evolution, the big bang, and millions of years. Naturally, they get upset when children are taught the true religion found in the pages of the Bible. Are We Brainwashing Our Children?
See... No brainwashing here. Move along.
For example, the secularist wants to take Christian children and teach them the religion of humanism with its many tenets like materialism, atheism, evolution, the big bang, and millions of years. Naturally, they get upset when children are taught the true religion found in the pages of the Bible. Are We Brainwashing Our Children?
See... No brainwashing here. Move along.
Drizzt Do'Urden
Deistic Drow Elf
I'm confused now. The name of the thread is Shaped by Design or My Precious Stone?
I'll try to check it out later, but generally speaking, everything in this universe has a cause. Everything that we've studied in great detail has been shown to have a cause, the cause being the natural laws and processes that define and manage this universe..
The big question is what caused those natural laws and processes to exist?
We know that galaxies, solar systems, stars, planets, moons, the existence of life, the evolution of life, et al are due to the natural laws and processes that define and manage this universe, but what caused those natural laws and processes to exist?
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Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
Atheist agenda Ken?
U.S. has a lot of people of different religions not just christian. The idea is not to take out religion, but to have a place where one person's religion isn't compromised by another (as in christian and Muslim history
)
I remember when they did take prayers out of schools. We stooped putting our hands over our hearts and later on everything changed all together. Muslims at my college have their place to pray (called a meditation area) but I was told by one christian they tried to get a section for their Catholic prayers, they were denied. Can you think of it, everything is christian and everything is not is "atheist" like we are trash thrown aside for christians to tolerate?
I mean, I would love everything to be traditional only if it doesn't compromise my belief, yours, a Muslims, nor a Pagans (and so forth).
....
U.S. has a lot of people of different religions not just christian. The idea is not to take out religion, but to have a place where one person's religion isn't compromised by another (as in christian and Muslim history
) I remember when they did take prayers out of schools. We stooped putting our hands over our hearts and later on everything changed all together. Muslims at my college have their place to pray (called a meditation area) but I was told by one christian they tried to get a section for their Catholic prayers, they were denied. Can you think of it, everything is christian and everything is not is "atheist" like we are trash thrown aside for christians to tolerate?
I mean, I would love everything to be traditional only if it doesn't compromise my belief, yours, a Muslims, nor a Pagans (and so forth).
....
Shaped by Design? was the link - click on it.
Drizzt Do'Urden
Deistic Drow Elf
OK, I read it. You guys were talking about design in nature and ID... What does design/ID have to do with what I'm asking about?
Everything has a cause - and in this case it just appears to be chance - the stone being trapped in the rock pocket and eroded away to such a symmetrical shape by the action of water alone. Hence we have something that might appear to have been designed but which most certainly wasn't. So, everything has a cause? But where it might just be random effects in fact.
Drizzt Do'Urden
Deistic Drow Elf
Yep, everything in this universe has a cause. Can you name one thing that isn't caused in this universe?
Follow along for a second, I'm copying and pasting another post of mine so I apologize if you come across the other one later and want to chime in on that thread.
I think we can reasonably assume a creator. After all, as I said, everything we've studied in great detail has been shown to have a cause.
1. The diversity of life we see around us today couldn't have evolved without life first coming to exist.
2. Life can't exist if there are, number one, no elements to build it with, and number two, a place for it to find a suitable place to perch (ie a planet or moon).
3. Planets and moons can't exist without the elements to make them up, and without stars dying and spreading their elemental guts across the universe when they explode.
4. The overwhelming majority of elements can't exist without stars to manufacture them in their cores via nuclear fusion.
5. Stars can't exist if the first element, hydrogen, isn't created soon after the big bang.
6. The first element can't exist without the big bang
7. The big bang can't happen without natural laws that define and manage the universe going forward.
8. The natural laws that made all of the above possible don't just exist without a cause...
It has been suggested that maybe the universe that we see today is just the result of a previous universe's death, maybe that the universe goes through a series of big bangs and big crunches, as if this somehow still disproves a creator. It doesn't, in my opinion, because that still doesn't explain the cause of the natural laws and processes that allow all of that to happen (ie a big crunch to big bang to big crunch ad infinitum.)
The natural laws and processes that define and manage this universe had to come from something.
We call that something, we give that something the placeholder name, god.
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I don't think we can. As for the stone, there are many other instances of things that just appear to form from chance or by one or more natural laws - and the latter hardly means a creator has designed these.
I believe scientists are still working on this one. What will you say if they do indeed produce life from non-life?
I'm hardly an expert on astrophysics and fundamental particles so I can't really comment other than that it still appears to be up in the air as to what actually happened - if indeed there was a Big Bang.
Well, it has been proposed, I believe, that the natural laws and processes we see in our universe might not exist in another similar universe. The 'it must be so because it is' argument is not exactly genuine. Perhaps we are an experiment of some higher being - and this is happening in many other galaxies too - spread so far apart that they never interfere with each other. Who knows - but it seems like an awful lot to manage for one creator just so we can praise and glorify this creator. Too mind-boggling for me. Much more likely to just be a natural process.
Guy Threepwood
Mighty Pirate
didn't read past the personal insult
yes, same in USSR and China, free thinking individuals are always a major threat to socialist dictatorships
yes, same in USSR and China, free thinking individuals are always a major threat to socialist dictatorships
Guy Threepwood
Mighty Pirate
That's the paradox unique to atheist beliefs, that the laws of nature are ultimately accounted for by... those very same laws.. it don't work!
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Drizzt Do'Urden
Deistic Drow Elf
What will I say if they do indeed produce life from non-life? They already pretty much have... Dr Jack Szostack, from the Howard Hughes Medical Institute at Harvard, who has one Nobel prize already in cellular biology, and is on track to get another for his work on abiogenesis, has already pretty much figured out the way in which life comes from non life.
Szostack was one of those wunderkind of decades ago, one of those kids who graduates from high school before he reaches 10, gets multiple degrees and doctorates in college by the age of 19, etc. I applaud his efforts, and he's making real progress. He has worked out the most likely way it all went down. Obviously, it isn't the exact way in which life formed here on earth, but the basic mechanics and chemistry has all been worked out and they've had several very successful experiments proving their hypothesis.
RE the big bang... Everything we know about the universe so far is pointing to it as the start of our space time bubble. Hypothetical universes where the natural laws and processes might be different than in ours are just that, hypothetical. Could they exist? Sure, but there sure isn't any evidence to suggest they do yet.
What makes you think a creator would need to manage anything? You're anthropomorphizing something needlessly. Do you imagine god sits around all day every day creating or preventing calamity here, there and yon, that he's tweaking DNA to create new species on planets all over the universe?
No, that's what it created the natural laws and processes for, to manage the universe going forward.
Ever heard of a Rube Goldberg machine? The universe is the ultimate Rube Goldberg machine, with no need for a god to manage things or tweak this or that all the time.
Samantha Rinne
Resident Genderfluid Writer/Artist
It's, honestly speaking, a two-way street. Rural Americans, who worked hard at an agriculture, crafting, real estate, or the like as a job, who put their kids through college with the money they earned the hard way look at the internet startups and bloggers for money, and the kids that eat Tide pods... yeah. About that. These people do not at all seem grounded in anything normal, they act like some sort of weird cult.
https://www.spectator.co.uk/2017/01...ocy-of-the-liberal-elite-its-their-education/
Honestly, I perfectly understand why atheist types can see a Christian childhood as some kind of abuse or brainwashing. But it's kind of mirroring what Christians see when they look at predominantly-liberal materialistic atheists.
QuestioningMind
Well-Known Member
Many of the religious appear to think S/He/It has something to do with us humans.
Frater Sisyphus
Contradiction, irrationality and disorder
There is brainwashing everywhere, culture thrives off it - but It's not something that equates to following a religion, whether one considers the item in question to be "absurd" or not is irrelevant. But it can and does happen, yes.
Apologes
Active Member
I would just say they've been brainwashed into thinking that others have been brainwashed and they haven't. Unsubstantialized assumption about someones mental state on a basis of them having a different worldview surely doesn't merit much other than an unsubstantialized statement about their own mental state.
Thermos aquaticus
Well-Known Member
I would rather not use "brainwashed" since that is unnecessarily rude and condescending.
Let's put it another way. If a young pregnant woman came up to you and said that she was a virgin would you tend to not believer her? If she then told you that she was carrying the son of a supernatural deity, would you believe her? Probably not, right?
What atheistic ideas are you talking about? The only one I can think of is the idea that you should only accept a claim once there is evidence to support it.
Rational Agnostic
Well-Known Member
Most people, in general, do not think for themselves, and follow the beliefs of whoever they deem to be "authorities." Atheists are no different. They just trust atheist intellectuals like Dawkins, Harris, and Pinker more than theistic intellectuals. While it's true that no one would be a Christian without first being told Christianity is true by someone else, I would wager that the majority of atheists (particularly youngsters) would not be atheists had they not been told atheism is a philosophy for cool, smart people by other atheists. BTW, I lean strongly toward atheism myself, but I'd like to think that I came to that conclusion by my own thinking, and not because someone told me to.