Very Zen.
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Buddha and Christ - Convergent or Divergent?
- Thread starter Dawnofhope
- Start date
whirlingmerc
Well-Known Member
Some forms of Buddism believe in the extinguishing of desires.
Jesus would believe in the redemption of desires.
That would be one difference
Buddism makes a person their own light in a sense
Jesus makes the light outside yourself
A damaged person in need of redemption needs a lighthouse outside themselves to look to for life
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
Remember the story about the ducks; Are they flying away?Very Zen.
Most scholars believe that the letters of Paul were written by a guy described in Acts or in the letters themselves. Taking the majority view does not automatically make it truth.
Q-lite (see link under my message) is somewhat like so-called Q but it assumes that aLuke knew and somewhat used gMatthew. aLuke did not at all like gMatthew hence his effort to write a new parallel version of the gospel by using mostly gMark and Q-lite but one of the authors of gLuke (there are two stages in which gLuke was written) chose to copy some of the Jesus sayings from gMatthew and add them to the copied Q-lite sayings into gLuke.
So these sayings are excluded from Q-lite and they don't at all fit with the style of Q-lite but they fit very well with the style of gMatthew.
Scholars such as Burton Mack tend to say that these sayings were written in a "second or third stage of the development of Q" because they stick to the idea that aLuke never saw or knew gMatthew.
Some people would argue that if aLuke knew gMatthew then there is no need for a hypothical sayings collection like Q-lite, but there are other arguments for the existence of such a sayings collection. Some of the Q-lite sayings are more primitive or more in line with the spirit of the original Q-lite in gLuke than they are in gMatthew. You cannot explain this fact if you assume that aLuke copied all of these sayings from gMatthew. Therefor you have to assume that aLuke copied those special sayings from another source that contained the sayings in a more original form and this sayings source was Q-lite.
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Yes, but that is the Jesus Christ of Christianity who was developed by christians.
The Yeshua of Q-lite (I would say the historical Yeshua) teaches about karma and how to avoid and get rid of it in order to become like the beloved Father, Rule of God or Holy Spirit (enlightened).
Yeshua teaches that your only desire or goal should become to reach the Rule of God or Holy Spirit.
He also teaches that the latter is infinite and that you should search It within yourselves, not without.
So Yeshua teaches more or less the same as Buddha.
Christians made the original teachings of Yeshua less esoteric and more exoteric by adapting the sayings and adding their own in a more exoteric framework.
If the Infinite loving Father or Holy Spirit lives inside your subjective 'I-feeling', that does not mean that "you are your own light". It does mean that the Light that lives within you has Cosmic proportions and is very different from what you have always imagined it to be. Yeshua teaches how to realise that.
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Thanks for posting. The discussion we had about Buddhism on a previous thread was excellent. We are both comfortable with agreement and agreeing to disagree. Your knowledge and experience from several years of practicing Buddhism are valuable.
I’ve just returned from a Tibetan Buddhist Centre today as they were the host for this months interfaith council meeting. This council in my city has been running for 15 years and devoted to promoting tolerance and better understanding between peoples of different faiths.
Our host was invited to provide a short presentation on Buddhism with an opportunity for questions and answers. It was suggested for historic reasons Tibetan Buddhism was closer to Hinduism than other branches of Buddhism. The belief in reincarnation was cited as an example.
Let’s consider some points you have raised in regards similarities and differences. I appreciate your response as always.
Ok. So they were both men who had compassion and were concerned for their fellow man. They were both religious reformers in respect to their traditions. The religious traditions and beliefs were very different of course. Interestingly Judaism and Hinduism (it wasn’t called Hinduism back then) are in some respects indigenous faiths rather than world religions. Neither Hinduism nor Judaism has developed too far beyond its culture of origin, nor would we expect them too. The Teachings their respective Founders brought led to Buddhism and Christianity, world religions in a much truer sense than Hinduism or Judaism. Both these nascent Faiths were very distinctive from those they emerged from. No one would claim Christianity or Buddhism are sects of Judaism or Hinduism.
Both Buddha and Christ taught primarily using parables and stories.
As Christ’s ministry lasted only three years and He died a criminal’s death at the hands of the Romans, His apostles used the imagery of the crucifixion to emphasis the spiritual principles of sacrifice and salvation. It may be worth considering how Buddha taught the eightfold noble path as a means to escape suffering from our lower nature. So we sacrifice the lower part of our nature to follow the noble path. In so doing we become enlightened or saved.
Buddha was certainly critical of the theism as it existed in Hinduism and instead taught a more practical path. Some Buddhists see Buddha as having Divine or omniscient qualities such as Christ is considered Divine in Christianity.
I provided teachings from Buddha that emphasised these Divine qualities of Buddha earlier in the thread and there are more along this theme.
Perhaps the biggest divergence for both Christianity and Buddhism is the extent to which Their follower’s beliefs and practices no longer reflect Their Founders original intent.
Both Buddha and Christ were enlightened Beings. They were not the first, I agree.
I’m entirely comfortable with different perspectives. We have two traditions that have started from very different origins and evolved largely in isolation from each other. Of course there’s differences and divergences. But we are one people sharing the earth and the barriers that once existed, have diminished. We must find a new understanding of our faith to accommodate multiculturalism whether we are Buddhist or Christian.
I’m simply stimulating a discussion and encouraging us to reflect. Hope you’re OK about that.
Now is a time of convergence and unity like no other time in history.
Thanks again for your post.
I’ve just returned from a Tibetan Buddhist Centre today as they were the host for this months interfaith council meeting. This council in my city has been running for 15 years and devoted to promoting tolerance and better understanding between peoples of different faiths.
Our host was invited to provide a short presentation on Buddhism with an opportunity for questions and answers. It was suggested for historic reasons Tibetan Buddhism was closer to Hinduism than other branches of Buddhism. The belief in reincarnation was cited as an example.
Let’s consider some points you have raised in regards similarities and differences. I appreciate your response as always.
Ok. So they were both men who had compassion and were concerned for their fellow man. They were both religious reformers in respect to their traditions. The religious traditions and beliefs were very different of course. Interestingly Judaism and Hinduism (it wasn’t called Hinduism back then) are in some respects indigenous faiths rather than world religions. Neither Hinduism nor Judaism has developed too far beyond its culture of origin, nor would we expect them too. The Teachings their respective Founders brought led to Buddhism and Christianity, world religions in a much truer sense than Hinduism or Judaism. Both these nascent Faiths were very distinctive from those they emerged from. No one would claim Christianity or Buddhism are sects of Judaism or Hinduism.
Both Buddha and Christ taught primarily using parables and stories.
As Christ’s ministry lasted only three years and He died a criminal’s death at the hands of the Romans, His apostles used the imagery of the crucifixion to emphasis the spiritual principles of sacrifice and salvation. It may be worth considering how Buddha taught the eightfold noble path as a means to escape suffering from our lower nature. So we sacrifice the lower part of our nature to follow the noble path. In so doing we become enlightened or saved.
Buddha was certainly critical of the theism as it existed in Hinduism and instead taught a more practical path. Some Buddhists see Buddha as having Divine or omniscient qualities such as Christ is considered Divine in Christianity.
I provided teachings from Buddha that emphasised these Divine qualities of Buddha earlier in the thread and there are more along this theme.
Perhaps the biggest divergence for both Christianity and Buddhism is the extent to which Their follower’s beliefs and practices no longer reflect Their Founders original intent.
Both Buddha and Christ were enlightened Beings. They were not the first, I agree.
I’m entirely comfortable with different perspectives. We have two traditions that have started from very different origins and evolved largely in isolation from each other. Of course there’s differences and divergences. But we are one people sharing the earth and the barriers that once existed, have diminished. We must find a new understanding of our faith to accommodate multiculturalism whether we are Buddhist or Christian.
I’m simply stimulating a discussion and encouraging us to reflect. Hope you’re OK about that.
Whats the dealio with differences and divergants. If you look at our geology of the planet, weve been converging and diveraging all throughout the earths history.
Now is a time of convergence and unity like no other time in history.
Thanks again for your post.
Thank you for your considered response. It’s challenging learning about faiths that are not our own. Christianity is very much part of my traditions and culture so I always appreciate having Christians in my life. I’ve married into Buddhism so that’s a natural part of my life. Buddha and Christ being Manifestations of God according to Baha’i beliefs makes it easy to have close affiliation with Christians or Buddhists.
On the other hand if I had a religion that was disparaging of other religions it would be harder. I suppose I would simply avoid discussing religion with Christians and Buddhists. I certainly wouldn’t be too interested in learning about their traditions.
Buddha and Yeshua both taught similarly; it is the religions that were created around them that taught differently.
Both taught selflessness, to seek enlightenment, that Works/Karma lead to salvation, that none attachment leads to the Divine, to meditate, give up wealth, to work toward Oneness as the ultimate goal.
In my opinion.
- There is no self or to hate the self (psyche).
- Live a life serving others.
- They both use the word heart contextually to mean soul.
- Both teach that enlightenment is within us.
- Both teach to meditate on the infinite consciousness.
- Both break down the previous religious misunderstandings, and ask people to question.
- They both taught the golden rule, 'do unto others as you wish done unto you'.
- Both taught not to strike back those who strike you.
- Not to judge.
- Love your enemies.
- Overcome hate with love.
- More blessed to give than to receive.
- Avoid being religious for show.
- Both taught the Way (Dharma).
- etc...
Thanks for providing an insightful list of similarities between Christianity and Buddhism. I appreciate it.
Interesting post based on an intriguing worldview and theology. How would you describe your faith or beliefs?
A list of similarities between Buddha (Discernment) and Yeshua (Salvation)... Christians and Buddhists don't agree the same.
Will make a list of their differences as well...
In my opinion.
Both oral and traditions have their roles but with strengths and weaknesses. I wouldn’t rely on oral traditions at all to accurately portray what someone said 40 years ago let alone 400 years ago. For that reason we can’t reliably determine what either Christ or Buddha said. Unfortunately the problem is compounded exponentially with Buddhism. We simply have no way of knowing for certain.
Difference Between Oral Communication and Written Communication (with Comparison Chart) - Key Differences
Spiritual journey is layered. It is like many paths to the same summit. The truth is not two, but its manifestation are many. It is said that the upayas (methods) are many, suitable for different times-cultures. But when we touch the wisdom within, we find that it is not two. All religions encourage us to know the wisdom within.
MY OPINION. YMMV.
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The Buddhists I have personally met are very quiet reflective people. I mean ethnic Asian Buddhists here, not so much western converts. Vancouver has many, and there is a beautiful retreat center (says a lot in itself ... a place where you can go just for personal self-reflection) an hour's drive away. Very peaceful place.
And still you don't see the irony, do you? From a non-Baha'i view, your faith is indeed very disparaging of other religions. Individuals like yourself may vary, because you are able to look past the literature that says that?
And that is not at all a problem, since Dharma is supposed to be living, not static.
iam1me
Active Member
When I got my BA in Religious Studies I was fortunate to be taught about Buddhism and Asian Religions from professors who were themselves Buddhists. One of them would bring his small dog to work with him - and he loved to invite students into his office for tea, haha. While I can't say I agree with the philosophy, those were some of my favorite classes.
That sounds rather realistic. At the Hindu monastery I`m associated with, a little group of elderly Japanese Buddhist ladies comes by once a week to do landscaping in a peaceful quiet environment. I`d be surprised if it wasn`t followed by tea at someone`s house.
godnotgod
Thou art That
A list of similarities between Buddha (Discernment) and Yeshua (Salvation)... Christians and Buddhists don't agree the same.
Will make a list of their differences as well...
In my opinion.
Yes, this is actually a crucial point, at least in comparing modern Christianity (ie 'Paulanity, the myth of Jesus') to Buddhism, the goal of Christianity (Religion Game) being Salvation of an individual soul, while that of Buddhism (Master Game) is spiritual Awakening into Universal Consciousness (Nirvana) and the dissolution of the fictional self (Identification).
The authentic Yeshua, a Nazarene mystic, from which the myth of the Romanized 'Jesus' was derived, was closer to the Buddha in doctrine, sans the doctrines of blood sacrifice and bodily resurrection. During his 18 missing years, the Buddhist monks at the Hemis monastery in Ladakh, Tibet, knew him lovingly as 'our beloved St. Issa', (meaning 'Salvation') where he lived and taught amongst them. It is this monastery which claims to have a scroll of his teachings, translated in a book by Nicolas Notovitch, and it is this same monastery to which he was taken after the Crucifixion, where he lived until he died, and now entombed in Srinagar, Kashmir under the name of Jesus-Yuz Asaf (son of Joseph), first recorded in 112 AD.
A Buddhist monk shows the St. Issa scrolls to a traveler at Hemis
Jesus Lived in India
It is totally implausible to me that a man of such notoriety could have lived undetected in a small hamlet for some 18 years without the word of his presence being spread like wildfire, and what clinches it for me is that zero evidence exists of any 1st century 'Nazareth' where he supposedly lived quietly for those 18 years. Being a Nazarene, a sect of the Essenes, I firmly believe Yeshua lived instead at the Nazorean Essene monastery atop Mt. Carmel, just 10 miles from present day Nazareth, traveling East into Tibet, China, Persia, and India from that home base. There is not a shred of written evidence of his 18 missing years from the Christian accounts, but a notable body of evidence does exist from the East as to his whereabouts.
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