By the way -- if you claim to be a Christian...

[ElishaElijah]

If that makes you happy, I’m happy that you are happy!

I believe people are fearfully and wonderfully made by God, with a body, soul but spiritual dead until they are born again and made spiritually alive and can now communicate with God their Father.
If people believe they are just a body and soulless it’s really tragic, but I believe you all by your demonstration here.
soulless /sōl′lĭs/
adjective

1. Lacking sensitivity or the capacity for deep feeling.
2. Being without a soul, or without greatness or nobleness of mind; mean; spiritless.

soul​

(soʊl )
Word forms: plural souls
1. COUNTABLE NOUN
Your soul is the part of you that consists of your mind, character, thoughts, and feelings. Many people believe that your soul continuesexisting after your body is dead.

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

All I can deduct here is that the whole of the field of Psychology which includes psychiatrists and other areas that use it, is the same as studying leprechauns, unicorns and bigfoots.

So, I guess we can close the subject.

In my opinion, not even psychology, modern medical technology, or modern science can explain everything, as I explained in another thread here.

 

[Kenny]

In my opinion, not even psychology, modern medical technology, or modern science can explain everything, as I explained in another thread here.

I completely agree with you! If we really think about it, mankind still knows only a pinhole to what is yet to be learned and discovered!

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

I completely agree with you! If we really think about it, mankind still knows only a pinhole to what is yet to be learned and discovered!

In my opinion, the more people who share their experiences with supernatural phenomena (see some statistics here), the more science will have to take it seriously. I hope this happens during my lifetime because I'd like to hear a comprehensive explanation for my experiences that science has yet to provide.

 

[Kenny]

In my opinion, the more people who share their experiences with supernatural phenomena (see some statistics here), the more science will have to take it seriously. I hope this happens during my lifetime because I'd like to hear a comprehensive explanation for my experiences that science has yet to provide.

My wife’s mom was a witch with out-the-body traveling. My wife has seen the supernatural first hand including a woman that was possessed that would take 4 men to hold her down as a guttural male voice would answer questions.

Obviously, my filter for analyzing these things are Biblically based. I believe the Bible does explain it.

Regardless, I believe you have seen and experienced the spiritual arena that can be found on this earth.

As you said, hopefully, science will address it in our lifetimes.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

I would also classify this as the soul operating through the brain.

While I believe I have a soul, I have no evidence of it or how it operates. If it is none-physical how is it attached to the physical. If my personality is associated with my brain and arises or comprises the soul, then the person that I am has developed over the time and experience of my life and wasn't stamped, fixed from the beginning. Thus my soul would be said to have developed too. Although, I'm sure some mental and emotional traits may have been minted at a very early age. This seems to be the consensus I'm picking up from this thread. I was not, at the age of 5, the same person I was as an infant. So to at 18, I was not the person I was at 5. And on and on until now. This is consistent with what I'm hearing and what I reckon most people understand of their own life and development over time.

What I wonder is how others reconcile that with a biblical statement of Jeremiah 1:5 "Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee..."? How can I as an adult have been known by anyone at a different, earlier stage in my life? How can that be true for anyone?

 

[Polymath257]

All I can deduct here is that the whole of the field of Psychology which includes psychiatrists and other areas that use it, is the same as studying leprechauns, unicorns and bigfoots.

So, I guess we can close the subject.

No, we have minds, beliefs, and behaviors. That is what psychology studies. It does NOT study anything non-material. I challenge you to find a psychology textbook that even mentions a 'soul'.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

It IS the study of the soul! The soul controls the material mind which controls the behavior

How is that accomplished? How can something immaterial effect the material at all? What would be the evidence of that?

which are control by the soul

That has not been empirically verified.

Then how do you know or is it just your belief that is how it happens?

Because it goes beyond the material

You can’t see it?

I can't see Bigfoot either or many things that people have claimed without evidence.

The soul has a spiritual component

As I understand it, the soul is the spiritual component.

I wouldn’t agree. I would say it is spiritual that affects the material and therefore more spiritual

Or..

two people looking at the same evidence and coming to different conclusions

But one person looking at evidence and another not seeing or looking at any evidence do not come to equivalent conclusions and the one without any evidence cannot come to a valid conclusion at all.

I see and hear that statement a lot, but the problem is that often it is a statement made by those not really looking at the evidence at all from anything indicated.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Would you then attribute the same response to those attracted to the cruel theology of atheists by the atrocities done in the name of atheism?

I'm curious to know how you would describe this "cruel theology" and define it. Is this a term of your own devising or something you've learned?

 

[Dan From Smithville]

I believe there is something within us genetically that teaches us some right from wrong as we are social animals and all social animals have a "pecking order" of some type, although there are always going to be some "delinquents" as well.

Thus, maybe this right from wrong pecking order may be the "soul".

I am aware that there is research into this, but know very little about it. I recall seeing a popular account about a family line in Washington or Oregon that had multiple generations that were prone to violent crime and the research was trying to determine the genetics that might lead to that. I would imagine it is a polygenic trait and there isn't an "evil" gene fixed in the line. But it is a very complex set of behaviors and far outside my knowledge.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

You will have to read the previous posts. Psychology is the study of the soul

I'm going to have to go along with @Polymath257 on this. Psychology is the study of the mind, mental development and human behavior. It is not the study of the soul. Given what we have already discussed, there isn't anything a scientist could study in that area.

Brain function can be studied. It is already known that damage to certain areas of the brain will result in somewhat predictable, though not completely predictable outcomes. Severe or chronic sleep deprivation can practically alter a person's personality. But the existence, presence and actions of a soul are beyond any capacity to study and the existence of it and anything that might be associated with it are based on belief by faith alone.

 

[shunyadragon]

I disagree.

contemporary /kən-tĕm′pə-rĕr″ē/

adjective [the life​

1. Belonging to the same period of time.
   "a fact documented by two contemporary sources."
2. Of about the same age.

No evidence the letters were contemporary to [the life of] Jesus, Actually Nothing is contemporary to [the life of] Jesus not even Paul. No text of the Gospel within 200 years of the life of Jesus. No independent references to Jesus during his life.

 

[Kenny]

While I believe I have a soul, I have no evidence of it or how it operates. If it is none-physical how is it attached to the physical. If my personality is associated with my brain and arises or comprises the soul, then the person that I am has developed over the time and experience of my life and wasn't stamped, fixed from the beginning. Thus my soul would be said to have developed too. Although, I'm sure some mental and emotional traits may have been minted at a very early age. This seems to be the consensus I'm picking up from this thread. I was not, at the age of 5, the same person I was as an infant. So to at 18, I was not the person I was at 5. And on and on until now. This is consistent with what I'm hearing and what I reckon most people understand of their own life and development over time.

I think it is easy to see the realities of a soul. If a baby is born with a “blank soul” or, in other words, a blank page where they then develop their soul, then all babies would be exactly the same at birth. To be “minted at an early age” gives the connotation that they all start the same

But they are not.

You have quiet babies, loud babies, wide awake babies and all types of soul personalities.

What I wonder is how others reconcile that with a biblical statement of Jeremiah 1:5 "Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee..."? How can I as an adult have been known by anyone at a different, earlier stage in my life? How can that be true for anyone?

When we decided to have a baby, we said, “We are going to name this boy Kenny Jr.”. You could say that in our minds we knew him even before we had him. How much more can the Father of all say the same.

 

[shunyadragon]

Would you then attribute the same response to those attracted to the cruel theology of atheists by the atrocities done in the name of atheism?

Would you then attribute to those attracted to the cruel actions of Christians and Christian rulers done in the name of Jesus in the persecution and ethnic cleansing of non-believer such as Jews, and practiced forced conversion by the sword.

At times it is best to be a Christian or else . . .

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

My wife’s mom was a witch with out-the-body traveling. My wife has seen the supernatural first hand including a woman that was possessed that would take 4 men to hold her down as a guttural male voice would answer questions.

Obviously, my filter for analyzing these things are Biblically based. I believe the Bible does explain it.

Regardless, I believe you have seen and experienced the spiritual arena that can be found on this earth.

As you said, hopefully, science will address it in our lifetimes.

I used to believe that Satan and demons were real, but I consider this belief to be the last remnant of my indoctrination that I have disavowed. And the irony is that I realized this and decided to let go of it while participating in a thread where the OP stated that demons are real and insisted their existence could be proven. Suffice it to say, I don't believe that the spirits that I see, hear, sense, and communicate with are demonic because I no longer believe in demonic entities. I don't believe what the Bible teaches about the afterlife either. I have a lifetime of firsthand experiences that have taught me otherwise, and I'd consider it dishonest to continue believing in the Bible's depictions of the afterlife. If you are interested, I explained in the following post why I no longer believe in demons, Satan, God, Jesus, or the Bible. I know that you and other Christians believe differently, and that's fine with me. To each his own.

What makes somebody atheist and not a theist?

What makes somebody atheist and not a theist? Generally, not believing in god or gods.

www.religiousforums.com

 

[Dan From Smithville]

I think it is easy to see the realities of a soul.

How is it that you see it then and what can you do for me or others to demonstrate what you see and that is evidence of the soul?

If a baby is born with a “blank soul” or, in other words, a blank page where they then develop their soul, then all babies would be exactly the same at birth.

I don't know that a soul cannot be blank or that it contains a pre-existing map of entire, as yet unlived life either.

To be “minted at an early age” gives the connotation that they all start the same

You have misinterpreted or mistaken what I said. Some traits or behaviors were very likely minted in me at an early age (I'll say stage). It is the traits I speak of and not the babies.

But they are not.

I do agree that all babies are not the same at birth. Though again, not an condition in alignment with my statement that it is in response to.

You have quiet babies, loud babies, wide awake babies and all types of soul personalities.

They have different personalities, but we cannot at this point describe it as "soul" personalities, since we have established nothing about the soul to declare it has personality. The evidence indicates this is a function of the brain. Again, whether a soul is acting through that remains to be established.

When we decided to have a baby, we said, “We are going to name this boy Kenny Jr.”. You could say that in our minds we knew him even before we had him. How much more can the Father of all say the same.

That's an interesting take on it, though I have seen it interpreted to mean the we who we are now was known then, but clearly, to the consensus that was developing here, most don't seem to agree with that.

 

[ElishaElijah]

Some on here need evidence on whether you have a Soul -Mind, Will and Emotion. What are we to make of this? Maybe we aren’t allowed to say in this forum but it is quite comical. Let’s start with 2+2 = 4, I made up my mind to read the Bible and obey that today.
”My soul keeps Your testimonies, And I love them exceedingly.“
‭‭Psalms‬ ‭119‬:‭167‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

 

[Kenny]

Would you then attribute to those attracted to the cruel actions of Christians and Christian rulers done in the name of Jesus in the persecution and ethnic cleansing of non-believer such as Jews, and practiced forced conversion by the sword.

At times it is best to be a Christian or else . . .

THAT, is why I said what I said. (you probably missed the point coming in at this time). What you said is what the poster said so I said the same thing in reverse.

Both statements are ridiculous.

 

[Kenny]

I used to believe that Satan and demons were real, but I consider this belief to be the last remnant of my indoctrination that I have disavowed. And the irony is that I realized this and decided to let go of it while participating in a thread where the OP stated that demons are real and insisted their existence could be proven. Suffice it to say, I don't believe that the spirits that I see, hear, sense, and communicate with are demonic because I no longer believe in demonic entities. I don't believe what the Bible teaches about the afterlife either. I have a lifetime of firsthand experiences that have taught me otherwise, and I'd consider it dishonest to continue believing in the Bible's depictions of the afterlife. If you are interested, I explained in the following post why I no longer believe in demons, Satan, God, Jesus, or the Bible. I know that you and other Christians believe differently, and that's fine with me. To each his own.

What makes somebody atheist and not a theist?

What makes somebody atheist and not a theist? Generally, not believing in god or gods.

www.religiousforums.com

Yes, that would be where we differ. I would also say that our firsthand experiences have taught us that the Bible is correct.

As I have said often, “Two people looking at the same evidence and coming to two different conclusions”.

I’m not sure about some of your deductions… would you like me to address them on that post? Or should we leave well enough alone.

 

[Kenny]

How is it that you see it then and what can you do for me or others to demonstrate what you see and that is evidence of the soul?

I’m not sure I understand the question since the example of babies seems (at least to me) a very clear example.

I don't know that a soul cannot be blank or that it contains a pre-existing map of entire, as yet unlived life either.

Again, not sure after the example. A 6 month baby comes out with a predisposition, a personality, just as much as a 9 month baby. At one year, we already see the manifestations of that soul. Sometimes we see a prodigy playing piano at 4 years… learned? We would have to say “no”.

You have misinterpreted or mistaken what I said. Some traits or behaviors were very likely minted in me at an early age (I'll say stage). It is the traits I speak of and not the babies.

We take a DISC personality test (for the purposes of what we are talking about… a soul test). You have the personality of who you are and then you have the personality that you “mask” when you are with a group of people.

I would say that you are “minted” before birth (when exactly would be up for debate) but that you can “develop” what you present to people when you are in a group.

I do agree that all babies are not the same at birth. Though again, not an condition in alignment with my statement that it is in response to.

Then I think I haven’t grasped the point you are trying to make. My apologies.

They have different personalities, but we cannot at this point describe it as "soul" personalities, since we have established nothing about the soul to declare it has personality. The evidence indicates this is a function of the brain. Again, whether a soul is acting through that remains to be established.

I think we are back to “Two people looking at the same evidence and coming to two different conclusions”. I revert back to the definition of “psychology” - the study of the soul.

I suppose we could contend the point but perhaps the simplest answer would be the best answer? A braid is a brain is a brain in all babies. It would be hard to hold to the position that all brains produce a different personality when it is just a brain. A soul seem to be the simplest solution.

That's an interesting take on it, though I have seen it interpreted to mean the we who we are now was known then, but clearly, to the consensus that was developing here, most don't seem to agree with that.

yes… not all scriptures are black and white as some can be viewed differently because of not enough information. But it was a pretty good take, wasn’t it?