Can a rich Church or man get into heaven?

[Greatest I am]

My father was a licensed United Methodist minister from 1985-2004 when he retired. He was never paid more than 500 or 600 dollars a month. He was part time and did not have a degree from a seminary. He went to the Methodists licensing school for a year and then was licensed as a minister. He certainly is not rich. The minister at the UU church I go to is paid about $70,000 per year. He has a wife and two sons at home. 70,000 is an adequate living for a family of four but I certainly wouldn't call him wealthy. People who complain about ministers being in it for the money need a reality check. If a person wants to get rich there are much easier ways to do it than being a minister or priest, such as being a lawyer, dentist, surgeon, etc. If a person goes into the ministry looking to strike it rich, he/she is most likely in for a rude awakening unless he is super charismatic and writes a best selling religious book and starts a very successful tv or radio ministry. Ministers who do thatsuccessfully are very few and far between. Most nonCatholic churches in this country have 300 or fewer members and it is harder to grow them large than it used to be. If you check I think you will be able to verify that all I have said here is facts, not fantasies.

A preacher teaching of God at 70 g.
A teacher teaching anything else should then make 70 g.

I know of few teachers that make 70 g.

Perhaps some teacher will enlighten us.

Regards
DL

 

[Greatest I am]

A rick man shall enter into prosparity in paradise if he gave his richs to those in need, he may not need to give them all but spreading the wealth to help those in need is how he sahll stand before the gates and rejoice. For as said in the bible about greed Man can not serve two masters, he will grow to love one and loath the other. Now thats just a paraphrase but it speaks about mans love for money. If he loves his money so much he can't bare to part with it than he shall suffer the flames of eturnle damnation due to his succumbing to the sin of greed, but if he helps those in need and spreads his wealth than he shall stand with god in paradise.

If he spreads it then he is no longer rich. If still rich then he has not spread it enough.

Regards
DL

 

[keithnurse]

If he spreads it then he is no longer rich. If still rich then he has not spread it enough.

Regards
DL

How much of his wealth he gives away is for him to decide, it's nobodys business but his own. It's cute the way people talk about people suffering in hell if they don't give away their wealth. The fact is we don't know what happens after we die so threats or promises of hellfire do nothing to motivate me to do anything.

 

[Greatest I am]

How much of his wealth he gives away is for him to decide, it's nobodys business but his own. It's cute the way people talk about people suffering in hell if they don't give away their wealth. The fact is we don't know what happens after we die so threats or promises of hellfire do nothing to motivate me to do anything.

Fear is a poor motivator.

Be good for goodness sake.

Jesus was clear about giving to the poor. He did not say give so much and retain a few million for personal needs.
Most wealth is amassed through exploitation of labor and markets.
This makes the accumulation of wealth immoral.
Are there moral ways to amass great wealth and what are they?

Regards
DL

Regards
DL

 

[keithnurse]

A preacher teaching of God at 70 g.
A teacher teaching anything else should then make 70 g.

I know of few teachers that make 70 g.

Perhaps some teacher will enlighten us.

Regards
DL

Churches are membership organizations which do what the members want them to do when the members vote on decisions. It is their prerogative what to pay their ministers and other staff. You have no say in the matter. Other teachers work for public schools or universities or other schools which are all separate organizations exercizing THEIR prerogative to pay their teachers what ever they decide. What are you going to do? set up a huge government beaurocracy to force all organizations and churches to pay their teachers and ministers exactly the same? I can't think of any other way for you to successfully dictate to the whole world what they should pay their ministers and teachers.

 

[keithnurse]

If a man has wealth it is totally his prerogative what he decides to give away. It is nobodys business how much of his money he chooses to keep for himself.

 

[Greatest I am]

If a man has wealth it is totally his prerogative what he decides to give away. It is nobodys business how much of his money he chooses to keep for himself.

So rich people have no responsibilities to man or God?
They can hoard it all without thought to the starving or poor?

Regards
DL

 

[keithnurse]

So rich people have no responsibilities to man or God?
They can hoard it all without thought to the starving or poor?

Regards
DL

Now YOU"RE the one distorting what I"VE said. tsk tsk. Read my previous posts on this thread and the other thread on how much wealth is it ok for a person or organization to have for the answer to your question. I will not answer it again to someone who refuses to read it. BTW, you did not answer my question "what you going to do, create a giant government beaurocracy to force all organizations and churches to pay their teachers and ministers exactly the same?"

 

[Greatest I am]

Now YOU"RE the one distorting what I"VE said. tsk tsk. Read my previous posts on this thread and the other thread on how much wealth is it ok for a person or organization to have for the answer to your question. I will not answer it again to someone who refuses to read it. BTW, you did not answer my question "what you going to do, create a giant government beaurocracy to force all organizations and churches to pay their teachers and ministers exactly the same?"

No.

Teachers teach truth, preachers do not.
I believe in value for dollar. I pay for truth.

Regards
DL

 

[starlite]

Depends on what the rich man uses his money for....Job was a rich man. Even recieved double-fold after being tested

 

[Greatest I am]

Depends on what the rich man uses his money for....Job was a rich man. Even recieved double-fold after being tested

If you believe Job as literal truth then why do you not believe the literal truth of-- give all you have to the poor and follow me.

Regards
DL

 

[starlite]

If you believe Job as literal truth then why do you not believe the literal truth of-- give all you have to the poor and follow me.

Regards
DL

Jesus did not ask everyone who followed him to give up all possessions. And although he did comment on how difficult it is for a rich person to enter the Kingdom of God, he added: “All things are possible with God.” (Mark 10:23, 27) In fact, a few wealthy people did become Christ’s followers. They received specific counsel in the Christian congregation, but they were not asked to donate all their wealth to the poor.—1 Timothy 6:17. Jesus, with his extraordinary insight, saw what was below the surface. (John 2:25) He perceived a spiritual problem in this ruler, a serious one. Hence, Jesus said: “One thing is missing about you.” What was that “one thing”? Jesus said: “Go, sell what things you have and give to the poor.” (Mark 10:21) Did Jesus mean that a person must be penniless in order to serve God? No. Christ was revealing something of great importance To lay bare what was missing, Jesus offered the man a wonderful opportunity: “Come be my follower.” Just imagine—the Son of the Most High God invited that man, face-to-face, to follow him! Jesus also promised him a reward beyond imagination. He said: “You will have treasure in heaven.” Did the wealthy young ruler seize this opportunity, this glorious invitation? The account reads: “He grew sad at the saying and went off grieved, for he was holding many possessions.” (Mark 10:21, 22) So Jesus’ unexpected words revealed a problem in the heart of this man. He was too deeply attached to his possessions and, no doubt, to the power and prestige that came with them. Sadly, his love for such things far outweighed any love he had for Christ. The “one thing” missing, then, was wholehearted, self-sacrificing love for Jesus and God. Because the young man lacked such love, he turned down the invitation of a lifetime.

 

[Greatest I am]

quote]

Luke 6:24
But woe unto you that are rich! For ye have received your consolation.

Regards
DL

 

[logician]

A case can be made that being good (or giving away your possessions) to go to heaven is morally bankrupt.

 

[keithnurse]

Jesus did not ask everyone who followed him to give up all possessions. And although he did comment on how difficult it is for a rich person to enter the Kingdom of God, he added: “All things are possible with God.” (Mark 10:23, 27) In fact, a few wealthy people did become Christ’s followers. They received specific counsel in the Christian congregation, but they were not asked to donate all their wealth to the poor.—1 Timothy 6:17. Jesus, with his extraordinary insight, saw what was below the surface. (John 2:25) He perceived a spiritual problem in this ruler, a serious one. Hence, Jesus said: “One thing is missing about you.” What was that “one thing”? Jesus said: “Go, sell what things you have and give to the poor.” (Mark 10:21) Did Jesus mean that a person must be penniless in order to serve God? No. Christ was revealing something of great importance To lay bare what was missing, Jesus offered the man a wonderful opportunity: “Come be my follower.” Just imagine—the Son of the Most High God invited that man, face-to-face, to follow him! Jesus also promised him a reward beyond imagination. He said: “You will have treasure in heaven.” Did the wealthy young ruler seize this opportunity, this glorious invitation? The account reads: “He grew sad at the saying and went off grieved, for he was holding many possessions.” (Mark 10:21, 22) So Jesus’ unexpected words revealed a problem in the heart of this man. He was too deeply attached to his possessions and, no doubt, to the power and prestige that came with them. Sadly, his love for such things far outweighed any love he had for Christ. The “one thing” missing, then, was wholehearted, self-sacrificing love for Jesus and God. Because the young man lacked such love, he turned down the invitation of a lifetime.

Yes, this makes much more sense than saying all rich people should give away ALL their wealth. 1 Timothy 6:17-19 says: " As for those who in the present age are rich, command them not to be haughty, or to set their hopes on the uncertainty of riches, but rather on God who richly provides us with everything for our enjoyment. They are to do good, to be rich in good works, generous, and ready to share, thus storing up for themselves the treasure of a good foundation for the future, so that they may take hold of the life that really is life".

 

[Greatest I am]

A case can be made that being good (or giving away your possessions) to go to heaven is morally bankrupt.

You have a good point.
Without true belief in God, one cannot buy his way into heaven.
It is the follow me part of what Jesus said that is the important part.

Regards
DL