Can someone be a Muslim Jew?

[IndigoChild5559]

However, if an American converts to Judaism he is not required to also be an Israelite. So your point about a Russian arbitrary calling himself an American is off-topic. I consider Judaism to be a religion and Israelite a nationality.

If an American converts to Judaism, he is a Hebrew/Israelite/Jew. You see there are two ways to become a Jew. One of them is to be born a Jew, born of a Jewish mom. The other way is through formal conversion. "Jews" are not a religion. Jews are a tribal people, the b'nei Yisrael. Most Jews claim Judaism as their religion, but not all. You have i.e. atheist Jews.

 

[gnostic]

Can someone be a Muslim Jew?

Each and every Muslim is a truthful follower of Moses and Jesus, please. Right?

Regards

Can you still be a Muslim if you don’t follow Muhammad and his teachings and the Qur’an?

It is my understanding that the core of being a “Muslim” is Islam and everything relating to Islam: the Qur’an and Muhammad.

 

[Sedim Haba]

I ran into this assertion while reading an article: "I think of myself as a Muslim Jew" The author examines the story of Moses in both the Quran and Torah seeking to show lack of contradiction: The context of my question is this OpEd from a Reform Rabbi:

Quran And Torah: The Story Of Moses – OpEd

There are some interesting points in that article:

Islam teaches clearly that God does not have just one people or one true religion. Rather, God chose not to create human beings as one nation or with only one religion so that each religion could compete with all the others in order to see which religion produces the highest percentage of moral and loving people; and which people best embody in their personal and communal lives the moral teachings of their prophet.

As it is written in the Quran [5.48] “For every one of you did We appoint a law and a way. If Allah had pleased He would have made you one people, but (He didn’t) that He might test you in what He gave you. Therefore compete with one another to hasten to virtuous deeds; for all return to Allah, so He will let you know that in which you differed.”

His asserts:

We see again that the differences between the Quran and the Torah are the result of different lessons being derived from the same events. These different lessons are not in opposition to one another; they complement and enrich each other.

All irrelevant. Belief matters not, neither the Jew nor Muslim would consider such a Muslim-Jew
to be a member of their fold. Unlike most on this forum, I have personal painful experience in
the attempt to 'blend' two Abrahamic faiths. From my experiences here, the attempt to 'blend'
Islam would be even less successful, despite the fact there is fundamentally no difference in
what I believe and what a Muslim believes, I have seen only silence on queries on this forum.

I now believe all Abrahamic faiths are mutually exclusive and evil at the core.

I suppose I'm Noachide now, but since the 'rabbis' dictate that too, I don't so declare myself such.

 

[viole]

My take is that it is possible to identify with both, but for example in which direction do they pray? Mecca or Jerusalem?.

I would suggest, in that case, to pray on the geodesic that contains those two points.

Ciao

- viole

 

[Colt]

Can someone be a Muslim Jew?

Each and every Muslim is a truthful follower of Moses and Jesus, please. Right?

Regards

No, not really.

 

[syo]

I ran into this assertion while reading an article: "I think of myself as a Muslim Jew"

Totally fine with me. I support omni.

 

[Flankerl]

I consider

Largely irrelevant what you consider Jews and their beliefs to be.
People are allowed self determination and as such Jews have made that decision thousands of years ago.

an Israelite

Also if you want to write about this topic at least get the terminology right.

Israelite: The descendants of Yakov/Israel (includes Samaritans who are Israelites but not Jews)
Jew: Another word for Yudah, descendants of Yudah son of Yakov, prior to the Babylonian Exile the members of the Tribe of Yudah, during and afterwards the common nomenclature for all surviving Israelites that stayed true to Hashem
Hebrew: Another word for Israelite

Israeli: Citizen of the State of Israel

 

[Flankerl]

I suppose I'm Noachide now, but since the 'rabbis' dictate that too, I don't so declare myself such.

Those darn Rabbis dictating a concept that I wouldn't even know about without the darn Rabbis expanding on it in the darn Oral Torah!!!

 

[sun rise]

I now believe all Abrahamic faiths are mutually exclusive and evil at the core.

There are those who draw barriers between them and those who do not. One of the latter was Hazrat Inayat Khan who penned a prayer, Salat, which included this:

Allow us to recognize Thee
In all Thy holy names and forms;
As Rama, as Krishna, as Shiva, as Buddha;
Let us know Thee as Abraham, as Solomon, as Zarathustra, as Moses, as Jesus, as Mohammed,
And in many other names and forms,
Known and unknown to the world.

Of course this illustrates how a Muslim Sufi can look at religion with a different eye than others.

 

[firedragon]

because Islam claims in the Quran (2:79) that the Torah has been corrupted.

That's wrong fundamentally. The Qur'an does not say the Torah has been corrupted. It just says that people write stuff and attribute it to God. I know that even Muslim apologists use this verse to say that this and that was corrupted. But this is not specific, but a general statement. It does not mention the Torah in that verse.

 

[firedragon]

Just as a side note, the instance of Jews being anti-Semitic is so present that there is a specific term for it

Self-hating Jew - Wikipedia

Arabs are semites too.

 

[firedragon]

 

[firedragon]

Can you still be a Muslim if you don’t follow Muhammad and his teachings and the Qur’an?

It is my understanding that the core of being a “Muslim” is Islam and everything relating to Islam: the Qur’an and Muhammad.

Though most would reject this today, it is obvious that a muslim could be a person who does not even know about Muhammed or the Qur'an. That's by linguistic definition.

But theological definitions from outside of the Qur'an composed by institutions would beg to differ. They would agree with you.

 

[Flankerl]

Arabs are semites too.

The root word Semite gives the false impression that antisemitism is directed against all Semitic people, e.g., including Arabs, Assyrians, and Arameans. The compound word Antisemitismus ('antisemitism') was first used in print in Germany in 1879[6] as a scientific-sounding term for Judenhass ('Jew-hatred'),[7][8][9][10][11] and this has been its common use since then.[7][12][13]

*yawn*

 

[Link]

Arabs are semites too.

Or both not physical offspring from Abraham (myth) but rather bani-Israel was meant metaphorically "who follows me, then he is from me"

And says about Bani-Israel "offspring of those who we carried with Nuh..." and this makes more sense, since, it can't be expected there be only believers from offspring of Jacob (a) waiting for Musa (a).

Believers from all the people who were carried with Nuh (a) makes more sense and that is what is Surah Bani-Israel says.

To me, part of the corruption of the Torah was to make the emphasis on Ahlulbayt of Ibrahim (a) leading to the Ahlulbayt of Haroun (a) to be not about that, but just about physical offspring and that Abraham (a) and his chosen offspring (a) is not about the chosen ones, but regular people who are physically blood.

When it comes to Prophets (a), the closest to them are those who follow them, not those simply born from them. God chooses them an Ahlulbayt they are sent with collectively with but this is a different issue then their actual bloodline being more special then others. God chooses from their bloodline to their be less competition for succession from false leaders claiming leadership or Prophethood, so that, it's easier to cling to the righteous leaders God chooses.

We see when Zakariya (a) fears regarding Isa (a) not being followed and that his inheritors might claim successorship, he prays for Yahya (a) who instead would prepare the way for Isa (a) and so it makes sense that Yahya (a) doesn't have offspring but prepares for his cousin Isa (a).

The Torah was corrupted in this sense, the concept of Ahlulbayt was lost, but Quran emphasized on it and showed that God always appointed an Ahlulbayt in all times.

The wisdom of Abraham and his offspring is not about everyone born from him, but about how God chooses to assign authority and weed out false claimants to false authority.

This is my take, you may disagree.

 

[Link]

On a side note, the Quran also says "and from the offspring of Adam" (chosen ones were chosen) but if all humans were offspring of Adam (a) this would be too obvious of a fact to state and emphasize on.

Bani-Adam (a) is also metaphorical that we are linked back to ancestors who pledged to follow Adam (a) and his successors (a).

The expression we are created from one soul, can be about light and we all origin from the same blessed holy spirit and that is what we are created from, and that the expression "and created from it it's spouse" is an expression woman are also of the same breath of God and are not less in that sense.

I neither believe Arabs and Jews to be all born from Abraham (I believe this rationally impossible) nor believe it's rational we all born from Adam (a) and incest was never a thing.

 

[firedragon]

The root word Semite gives the false impression that antisemitism is directed against all Semitic people, e.g., including Arabs, Assyrians, and Arameans. The compound word Antisemitismus ('antisemitism') was first used in print in Germany in 1879[6] as a scientific-sounding term for Judenhass ('Jew-hatred'),[7][8][9][10][11] and this has been its common use since then.[7][12][13]

*yawn*

Yeah. Just because someone misuses a word for propaganda, I won't use it the same. I prefer to follow the reasonable, not the fake propagandists like the German murderers.

Cheers.

 

[firedragon]

Or both not physical offspring from Abraham (myth) but rather bani-Israel was meant metaphorically "who follows me, then he is from me"

I didn't refer to Bani Israela.

 

[Link]

I didn't refer to Bani Israela.

Fair enough.

 

[rosends]

Arabs are semites too.

There has been, since the later 19th century, a technical term coined specifically to refer to anti-Jewish feeling. That term is "Anti-Semitic." It was not established in the generic. Semite, in the intent of the word's creator, referred specifically to Jews.

anti-Semitism | History, Facts, & Examples

If you would like to go back and time, and correct him, feel free. Until you do, the term will be used to point to a feeling against Jews.