Can we compromise on abortion?

[Heyo]

What help are you expecting? In Texas there are food programs, education programs, child care programs, health care programs for people that cannot afford them. There is also the ACA.


Most women are not forced to get pregnant. Texas State Law has exceptions for endangering the life of the mother. Texas HB1280 | 2021-2022 | 87th Legislature

In the case of a rape that should be an exception. I hope the mother would have the child though.


I do agree that if the health of the mother is endangered it should be left up tp the mother.

Again what do you mean by health and support?

I mean the reality. You are defending something I didn't object to. In your dream the law is protective of women's health (which is not the reality) and women and children get assistance that protects then from the hardships of rearing a child in a financially precarious situation (which is not the reality). You'll have to wake up to proceed in a rational debate.

I guess that is a point I'll have to give to the @Alien826, you can't compromise with a delusional interlocutor.

Sidenote: While I'm all for addressing the argument, not the person, it seems you are deliberately avoiding to reply to me. (You have learned to reply to others, Posts #506, #507). Why is that?

 

[Clizby Wampuscat]

But it still is not universal healthcare even there.

There are programs to help people with medical bills, this is the point of my post.

 

[Clizby Wampuscat]

I do believe the answer to that is actually quite logical. As I often do say, "Accidents cause people".

Then provide the answer.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

What else is it if not a human life. It is human and it is life. I hold this belief because it is true.

Well, it is neither true nor false. It is a belief. I just happen to have another belief.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

There are programs to help people with medical bills, this is the point of my post.

It should be obvious that any program that currently exists isn't enough to prevent abortions that are currently happening.

If you want different from the status quo, you'll need something different from the status quo.

 

[Clizby Wampuscat]

What's the difference between military and civilians? You can simply be discharged from the military and become a civilian if you refuse mandatory military vaccines!

Not without negative consequences. What I am saying is a choice to become vaccinated in the military was made when you voluntarily joined, same with pregnancy, the choice to become pregnant was made when you chose to have sex. Vaccinations are a consequence of joining the military and pregnancy is a consequence of having sex.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Not without negative consequences. What I am saying is a choice to become vaccinated in the military was made when you voluntarily joined, same with pregnancy, the choice to become pregnant was made when you chose to have sex. Vaccinations are a consequence of joining the military and pregnancy is a consequence of having sex.

What a load of nonsense.

You're comparing enlistment - i.e. where you get a whole long set of forms explicitly saying "I agree to (insert all the things the military expects me to agree to)" that you sign and then you get compensated for (BTW: have you ever heard of a gratuitous promise? Sounds like you haven't) - to participating in an activity with a risk of an outcome?

Give your head a shake. Your comparison is completely off-base.

 

[metis]

There are programs to help people with medical bills, this is the point of my post.

And my point was and is that it isn't enough, especially when dealing with long-term care.

 

[metis]

Then provide the answer.

Answer to what specifically?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Answer to what specifically?

How many roads must a man walk down?

 

[crossfire]

Not without negative consequences. What I am saying is a choice to become vaccinated in the military was made when you voluntarily joined, same with pregnancy, the choice to become pregnant was made when you chose to have sex. Vaccinations are a consequence of joining the military and pregnancy is a consequence of having sex.

Not anywhere comparable! First of all, a vaccine is meant to prevent a medical condition. ( Not getting the vaccine leaves you at greater risk of serious illness.) Still, if you come down with the illness even though you were vaccinated, the military will still treat you to get rid of unwanted medical condition. The closest analogy you might get comparing vaccinations and pregnancy is to compare vaccinations to birth control. So, if you follow the same lines of practice the military has regarding vaccination and illness and apply them to pregnant women (ignoring the fact that we are talking about civilians,) then birth control would be mandatory and accidental pregnancies would be treated.

 

[fantome profane]

Not without negative consequences. What I am saying is a choice to become vaccinated in the military was made when you voluntarily joined, same with pregnancy, the choice to become pregnant was made when you chose to have sex. Vaccinations are a consequence of joining the military and pregnancy is a consequence of having sex.

And again, this could not be more clear if you put it on a billboard. You want to make sure that women face a negative consequence if they have sex. This is not about protecting life, this is about punishing and controlling women.

 

[crossfire]

And again, this could not be more clear if you put it on a billboard. You want to make sure that women face a negative consequence if they have sex. This is not about protecting life, this is about punishing and controlling women.

Indeed, the language employed is very much like those inflicting punishment.

 

[Clizby Wampuscat]

OK children, settle down. Johnny, put your phone away.

Well, when two very careless people love each other very much ....

Again, how do people get pregnant accidentally? Careless is not accidental, it is a choice.

 

[Clizby Wampuscat]

By making use of a contraceptive and it failing to prevent a pregnancy, for example.

That is a choice. People know or should know that contraception is not 100% reliable.

 

[SkepticThinker]

Again, how do people get pregnant accidentally? Careless is not accidental, it is a choice.

Condoms break. People forget to take pills. Or mix birth control pills with antihistamines without knowing about the negative interactions.
Hell I knew a couple where the guy had a vasectomy and the woman was on the pill and she still ended up pregnant.

 

[Clizby Wampuscat]

Hmm, somebody failed sex ed..

Make fun if you want but only one person has actually answered the question so far. Most women and men make a choice to have sex. The resulting life are what they need to take responsibility for.

You still have no valid response to the issue of bodily autonomy. You would not allow some stranger to hook themselves up to you for nine months so that they could share a kidney, and that is far less extreme than what happens to a woman for nine months.

I do, you just disagree, we have been through that already.

When you are willing to foster someone for nine months in that manner then I will take your claims of being "pro-life" seriously.

I don't take your claim of being pro choice seriously either.

 

[Clizby Wampuscat]

Why make laws for problems that do not exist? By week 22 over 99% of the abortions that occur during a pregnancy have already happened. The remaining 1% are almost all tragedies in that they are medically necessary abortions. You appear to have a rather low opinion of women. In a matter as serious as this they do not tend to be any more whimsical than men, and in fact probably less so. And the very very very few women that would opt for such a procedure are all but guaranteed to be horrible mothers.

Why not just limit insurance coverage after 22 weeks? Only cover medically necessary abortions.

Do you think abortion up to birth should be legal? When would you restrict abortion? How does this answer my question?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Again, how do people get pregnant accidentally? Careless is not accidental, it is a choice.

Between "careless" and "accidental," which one do you think implies deliberate consent to having a child?

 

[Clizby Wampuscat]

Nah .. you don't know what your talking about mate - all over the map .. Forced medical treatment and the Krystalnacht - yet havn't figured out who you sound like .. Mind bending lack of understanding .. not being able to figure out that threatening someone's job "Vax or lose Job" --- is "FORCED Medical Treatment"

But that is another issue .. 100% you are talking tyranny of the Majority ... just don't know it ,, due to lack of understanding of what the term means. Second -- you failed to distinguish Law with respect to Essential Liberty .. and Law which is not "Rape, Murder and arguably speed limits"

and the argument is not that "Human life should be protected" .. as that is a preposterously stupid argument ... failing to understand the difference between the noun and descriptive adjective use of the word "Human" The Dump you had this morning is "Human LIfe" .. so no .. the argument is not that your morning defication should be protected.

What you are trying to say is that tht argument is "A HUMAN" or "Life of a HUman" or " the life of a Person" should be protected .. but even with the correction you are still wrong ..

There is no debate about whether or not we should protect a Human from harm - until you first show that A Human Exists .... there is no "LIfe of a HUMAN" unless a human exists. .. not A Human Cell a human heart cell .. a human bacterial cell .

Human feces is not human life. Look up what it is made of.

and yes .. a coherent answer can be given for the existence of a Soul --- and in fact was already given you.. just not for the existence of a soul prior to around 22 weeks... so prior to this time ..with no soul .. there is no Person .. No Human to be protected.

Where have I been given the coherent argument for a soul?