can you be saved without any knowledge of christianity?

[JMorris]

i dont know if the title of this post really gets across my question. what i mean is, can a person, who has never read the bible, and never met a christian and had a conversation about it, come to know jesus and be saved? like a native in the amazon jungle, who has never had any opportunity to meet a christian, or read the bible, what would happen to him? or even, lets say back in....800 ad for example, what happened to , for example, the japanese? they never had any opportunity to know anything about christianity. up until europeans started exploring (and conquering) the world, the rest of the world didnt really have any chance of knowing anything about christianity. what happened to these people?

*edit* i forgot my other question. i wonder, can a person who has never read the bible, and never met a christian, can they without either, come to be a christian on their own? can a person who is a blank slate, come to be a christian on their own, without any of these resources? or would you need someone and or the bible to teach you to become a christian?

 

[JMorris]

i asked because, if something like this is universaly true. then shouldnt people come to know the christian god without ever needing the bible or speaking to a christian? just like breathing is good and fire hurts? i wonder if anyone is ever going to answer this.......

 

[doppelganger]

"Saving" is a Christian concept. Why would anyone need it if they knew nothing of Christianity?

 

[JMorris]

"Saving" is a Christian concept. Why would anyone need it if they knew nothing of Christianity?

for my questions chrstianity is assumed to be true. so saving is required, and for a person not to go to hell, they would need to be saved by jesus. i was asking if a person who has no access to christians or the bible, could they still be saved? do you have to be taught to be saved? or can you come by it on your own? if christianity were true, i would assume it'd be a kind of natural thing.

 

[doppelganger]

for my questions chrstianity is assumed to be true.

But it can't be true to someone who doesn't know anything about it. Truth is contextual. I can imagine that I think they need saving, but that's a far cry from them actually needing saving, which only really matters to them, doesn't it?

 

[JMorris]

as i understand it. if christianity is true, you have to give yourself to jesus and accept him as your lord and savior to go to heaven. so no, in that case, it would matter. if something like that is true, it wouldnt matter if you knew it to be true or not, it'd still be true.

 

[doppelganger]

as i understand it. if christianity is true, you have to give yourself to jesus and accept him as your lord and savior to go to heaven. so no, in that case, it would matter. if something like that is true, it wouldnt matter if you knew it to be true or not, it'd still be true.

Except truth doesn't work that way. You could imagine that everybody needs to accept Jesus as their lord and savior to go to heaven, but that would have absolutely no effect on someone who has never heard of Christianity. It might be "true" to you, but they still wouldn't need any "saving" because they would have no need of it without knowledge of Christianity.

 

[JMorris]

Except truth doesn't work that way. You could imagine that everybody needs to accept Jesus as their lord and savior to go to heaven, but that would have absolutely no effect on someone who has never heard of Christianity. It might be "true" to you, but they still wouldn't need any "saving" because they would have no need of it without knowledge of Christianity.

so your saying, that if christianity is true, and the christian god says to everyone on earth "come to jesus or go to hell", he's either going to overlook those who has no access to christianity, or is unable to send them to hell for not coming to jesus? the "come to jesus or go to hell" only applies to people who have heard about it?

assuming that christianity is true, what your saying dosent really make any sense. for the sake of the question, christianity is assumed to be true, universally, applied to everyone just the way it says it is. im not sure why im having to explain that.....
but yes, if its not applied to everyone, and truth is reliant on what one knows, then it wouldnt matter. but if the truth is the truth regardless of what you know, and christianity is the truth, then again, i ask the original questions.

 

[doppelganger]

so your saying, that if christianity is true, and the christian god says to everyone on earth "come to jesus or go to hell", he's either going to overlook those who has no access to christianity, or is unable to send them to hell for not coming to jesus?.

No. I'm saying we have a very, very limited ability to influence the self-actualization of reality outside our own minds and a thought system that has not stored any information about Christianity will not need "saving" no matter what a "Christian" thinks.

An image of another person in the Christian's thought might need "saving" - but the image is not the person, is it?

 

[JMorris]

No. I'm saying we have a very, very limited ability to influence the self-actualization of reality outside our own minds and a thought system that has not stored any information about Christianity will not need "saving" no matter what a "Christian" thinks.

An image of another person in the Christian's thought might need "saving" - but the image is not the person, is it?

uggh. what a "christian" thinks is what im intrested in. i wasnt asking a question about the nature of knowing in general, i was asking a question on what affect knowledge and access to materials has on the ability to be saved in a christian sense.

 

[doppelganger]

uggh. what a "christian" thinks is what im intrested in. i wasnt asking a question about the nature of knowing in general, i was asking a question on what affect knowledge and access to materials has on the ability to be saved in a christian sense.

I know. Your intent is to try to set up a moral argument for the injustice of "God" - precisely because you already know the answer that most self-proclaimed "Christians" will give. But it's also a "Christian" answer that without the law there is no judgment. Which is another way of saying exactly what I am telling you in this discussion. Without knowledge of the law there is no sin and no need for "saving" from the consequences of sin. Romans 6-8.

 

[JMorris]

i wasnt trying to set anybody up. i really wanted to know, because the way i saw it would have been unfair. so i was asking in order to find out if it were possible to be saved "Without knowledge of the law"

 

[JMorris]

im not a constant jerk

 

[doppelganger]

Salvation is psychological rather than metaphysical.

 

[JMorris]

Salvation is psychological rather than metaphysical.

ok..... that dosent answer my questions

 

[doppelganger]

ok..... that dosent answer my questions

Sure it does.

 

[JMorris]

*sighs* whatever

 

[Katzpur]

i dont know if the title of this post really gets across my question. what i mean is, can a person, who has never read the bible, and never met a christian and had a conversation about it, come to know jesus and be saved? like a native in the amazon jungle, who has never had any opportunity to meet a christian, or read the bible, what would happen to him? or even, lets say back in....800 ad for example, what happened to , for example, the japanese? they never had any opportunity to know anything about christianity. up until europeans started exploring (and conquering) the world, the rest of the world didnt really have any chance of knowing anything about christianity. what happened to these people?

The answer to this question pretty much explains why I'm a Mormon. It addresses the dilemma of how a belief in Jesus Christ is required for salvation but how a loving God has provided a way for those who died without ever having hear the gospel of Jesus Christ can come to believe in Him. So, the short answer to your question is "Yes, they can be saved." The long answer is a bit more complex, and I won't bother going into it unless you're interested in reading quite a bit more than I suspect you are.

*edit* i forgot my other question. i wonder, can a person who has never read the bible, and never met a christian, can they without either, come to be a christian on their own? can a person who is a blank slate, come to be a christian on their own, without any of these resources? or would you need someone and or the bible to teach you to become a christian?

Nobody becomes a Christian through osmosis. Resources of some kind are required.

 

[JMorris]

lol, i know ive been rather unpleasent everywhere else, but here, im asking a question id really like to know the answer to. i wouldnt mind some more reading, i did ask the question after all.

maybe you'll provide the answer to this in the next post, but, if you cant become a christian through "osmosis" what happened to the people who never had any way of learning about jesus? and the people who still dont have access to that?

 

[blackout]

*edit* i forgot my other question. i wonder, can a person who has never read the bible, and never met a christian, can they without either, come to be a christian on their own? can a person who is a blank slate, come to be a christian on their own, without any of these resources? or would you need someone and or the bible to teach you to become a christian?

why RE-source when you can go straight to The Source?

I wonder if someone read a bible from cover to cover without any further instruction...
if their understanding/interpretation of it would look ANYTHING at all like mainstream christianity at all. I HIGHLY doubt it.