can you be saved without any knowledge of christianity?

[emiliano]

who does god have compassion on? or is that unknowable?

God has mercy/compassion on whoever He wills, that is what both the NT and the OT says.
Rom 9:15
For He says to Moses, "I will have mercy on whomever I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whomever I will have compassion."

 

[tumbleweed41]

I see you where taught salvation though works, most Christians subscribe to salvation by Grace through Faith, we can not save ourselves, only God can save us, He chooses us not us Him.

Jhn 15:16
You did not choose Me, but I chose you and appointed you that you should go and bear fruit, and [that] your fruit should remain, that whatever you ask the Father in My name He may give you.


​

Jesus speaking to his disciples, when read as a whole describes how Jesus found and picked his disciples, they did not come and search for him.
15:14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you. 15:15 Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth: but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you. 15:16 Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.
Not arguing salvation here, just putting the verse in the context it was written.

 

[emiliano]

Jesus speaking to his disciples, when read as a whole describes how Jesus found and picked his disciples, they did not come and search for him.
15:14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you. 15:15 Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth: but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you. 15:16 Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.
Not arguing salvation here, just putting the verse in the context it was written.

Let see other scriptures that make it clearer:

Jhn 17:9
"I pray for them. I do not pray for the world but for those whom You have given Me, for they are Yours.
Jhn 6:37
All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will by no means cast out.
Jhn 6:44
No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up at the last day.
Jhn 6:65
And He said, "Therefore I have said to you that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted to him by My Father." ​

We are saved only if God wills it so, if He has Mercy on us.

 

[Squaell]

Jesus Christ came to teach how you need to live and to be , he is showing that way to him and to the doors to enter kingdom of heaven. And when somebody come to this door somehow different he will let him in no matter from where he had that manual which brought you to him. So if this people who did not know Jesus Christ find his way without even knowing him , they even smarter then all that people who was reading his teachings and not understanding what he was teaching them.

 

[davidthegreek]

as i understand it. if christianity is true, you have to give yourself to jesus and accept him as your lord and savior to go to heaven. so no, in that case, it would matter. if something like that is true, it wouldnt matter if you knew it to be true or not, it'd still be true.

They might: The lord will save whom he will save. and Will Have Compassion on whom he will have compassion. God Judges according to hearts. If the person accepts him at the end. Why wouldn't he save them?

 

[davidthegreek]

for my questions chrstianity is assumed to be true. so saving is required, and for a person not to go to hell, they would need to be saved by jesus. i was asking if a person who has no access to christians or the bible, could they still be saved? do you have to be taught to be saved? or can you come by it on your own? if christianity were true, i would assume it'd be a kind of natural thing.

People above all are saved by God's Grace, love and generocity. Jesus will save those whom he wishes to save, and he will have compassion on those whom he wishes to have compassion. His fathers house has many mansions. Which means he can host anyone he wishes. Anything beyond that we can't say. However taking christianity as the truth of God. When Jesus said blessed are the merciful, for they shall obtain mercy. I believe he made a promise that the merciful will be blessed with mercy, provided that their souls are open to him. Other than that I can't say anything.

 

[Xian Catalyst]

i dont know if the title of this post really gets across my question. what i mean is, can a person, who has never read the bible, and never met a christian and had a conversation about it, come to know jesus and be saved? like a native in the amazon jungle, who has never had any opportunity to meet a christian, or read the bible, what would happen to him? or even, lets say back in....800 ad for example, what happened to , for example, the japanese? they never had any opportunity to know anything about christianity. up until europeans started exploring (and conquering) the world, the rest of the world didnt really have any chance of knowing anything about christianity. what happened to these people?

*edit* i forgot my other question. i wonder, can a person who has never read the bible, and never met a christian, can they without either, come to be a christian on their own? can a person who is a blank slate, come to be a christian on their own, without any of these resources? or would you need someone and or the bible to teach you to become a christian?

Read 1 john 4:16-18.

It says that if you love, then God is in you and yo uare in Him. Likewise, if you don't love He's not in you and you aren't in Him. NOW that word love has some caveats in the Greek and in context, so the modern english twist on it, and that insulting "Agape is God's love" thought doesn't cut the muster either.

Now, if you made all the altar calls, and all the baptisms, and all the other stuff you could dream up, but didn't have love, you are going to hell. I DO NOT CARE HOW LOUD YOU SCREAM on the corner.

Scripture also says in EPhesians 4 that through WORKS the members of the Church are made mature, as mature as Jesus was, which most "churches" deny can happen on earth before you die. (Sometimes scripture matters less than posturing...)

Now, I can start with those two, and get progressively deeper. But just with these two we can see that you learn to love through doing loving works, and when the love grows to maturity, as long as you had the love right, HE is in you and you are in Him.

I"m guessing it's hard to not be "saved" whatever that means, if you are inhabited by him....

 

[james2ko]

i dont know if the title of this post really gets across my question. what i mean is, can a person, who has never read the bible, and never met a christian and had a conversation about it, come to know jesus and be saved? like a native in the amazon jungle, who has never had any opportunity to meet a christian, or read the bible, what would happen to him? or even, lets say back in....800 ad for example, what happened to , for example, the japanese? they never had any opportunity to know anything about christianity. up until europeans started exploring (and conquering) the world, the rest of the world didnt really have any chance of knowing anything about christianity. what happened to these people?

*edit* i forgot my other question. i wonder, can a person who has never read the bible, and never met a christian, can they without either, come to be a christian on their own? can a person who is a blank slate, come to be a christian on their own, without any of these resources? or would you need someone and or the bible to teach you to become a christian?

Scripture authoritatively claims Christ is the only way to salvation (Act 4:12). God also wishes for all men to eventually be given an opportunity to inherit eternal life (Luk 3:6). In a vision, John witnessed physically resurrected humans, small and great, standing before the great white throne to be judged or evaluated (Rev 20:12;Joh 5:28.) . Rev 20:11-15 describes this very period.

Among the resurrected will be the men of Nineveh and of Jesus' generation (Mat 12:41), the Queen of the South (Mat 12:42), the people of Sodom and Gomorrah (Mar 6:11), the men of Tyre and Sidon (Luk 10:14). The indication is that every man, woman, and child, from different time periods ranging thousands of years will be physically resurrected together for their second chance at life but their first real chance to accept or reject Christ.

 

[Xian Catalyst]

Scripture authoritatively claims Christ is the only way to salvation (Act 4:12). God also wishes for all men to eventually be given an opportunity to inherit eternal life (Luk 3:6). In a vision, John witnessed physically resurrected humans, small and great, standing before the great white throne to be judged or evaluated (Rev 20:12;Joh 5:28.) . Rev 20:11-15 describes this very period.

Among the resurrected will be the men of Nineveh and of Jesus' generation (Mat 12:41), the Queen of the South (Mat 12:42), the people of Sodom and Gomorrah (Mar 6:11), the men of Tyre and Sidon (Luk 10:14). The indication is that every man, woman, and child, from different time periods ranging thousands of years will be physically resurrected together for their second chance at life but their first real chance to accept or reject Christ.

How did God save the people under the High Priesthood of Melchizedek?

 

[james2ko]

How did God save the people under the High Priesthood of Melchizedek?

Every human being ever born from Adam to the return of Christ, will have their unhindered, first real opportunity at salvation during this judgment/evaluation period, which occurs after the millennium (Rev 20:5).

 

[Xian Catalyst]

Every human being ever born from Adam to the return of Christ, will have their unhindered, first real opportunity at salvation during this judgment/evaluation period, which occurs after the millennium (Rev 20:5).

HEY, I don't fault you for your opinion. I just can't support it. If I did, it would mean God lied to the Jews. I don't accept that. I'll take him at His word.

I think that is a case of Christadolatry... NOT YOURS, you are just repeating something that makes sense to you that you heard from others. But the fact is, it's a position with problems biblically.

The only possible argument for the side you mention, is that the Jews were atoned for, but still don't get forgiven. And that's sorta like saying you bathe in dry water.

I know how I read, I've got no attitude here. I'm just laying it out blunt, but peacefully and conversationally.

 

[Xian Catalyst]

Christ's priesthood runs like Melchizedeks, if Mel wouldn't mediate to God for you, neither will Christ's.

So, how did people get saved under MEL. If Christ can, Mel could.

 

[james2ko]

HEY, I don't fault you for your opinion. I just can't support it. If I did, it would mean God lied to the Jews. I don't accept that. I'll take him at His word.

I think that is a case of Christadolatry... NOT YOURS, you are just repeating something that makes sense to you that you heard from others. But the fact is, it's a position with problems biblically.

The only possible argument for the side you mention, is that the Jews were atoned for, but still don't get forgiven. And that's sorta like saying you bathe in dry water.

I know how I read, I've got no attitude here. I'm just laying it out blunt, but peacefully and conversationally.

I'm always open to understanding if it is biblically supported. I provided a small sample of biblical support (I have lots more). Where is yours?

 

[Xian Catalyst]

I'm always open to understanding if it is biblically supported. I provided a small sample of biblical support (I have lots more). Where is yours?

Where God said, "I give you this sacrifice and it will atone for your sins".

Either it atones for them, or it does not.

Christ on the cross atoned one event for all sins.

God said those sacrifices atoned for sins.

Either way it's grace that saves you, not the blood. Bloodalotry is an ugly discussion. It implies God isn't Omnipotent and has to fight himself.

 

[james2ko]

Where God said, "I give you this sacrifice and it will atone for your sins".

Either it atones for them, or it does not.

Christ on the cross atoned one event for all sins.

God said those sacrifices atoned for sins.

Either way it's grace that saves you, not the blood. Bloodalotry is an ugly discussion. It implies God isn't Omnipotent and has to fight himself.

This is an irrelevant conclusion as it does not address the passages that imply and state sacrifices will again be reinstated. You still have yet to provide a scriptural reference. We are not allowed to debate on this forum, if you want to discuss it, ask a moderator to move the thread to the proper debate forum.

 

[greentwiga]

Back to the original concept.

Look at Romans. There, it says that anyone who sees God and obeys all the commands that he knows, i.e. does good, will be saved. Then he says that everyone in the world has broken some of the laws of God that he knows. We all deserve spiritual death, even without ever having heard a word of the Bible. God then is giving us a second chance by sending Jesus. This is why we need to go into the world with good news of the second chance. If we don't, in some way, God will hold us accountable.

Thus, everyone had the opportunity to be saved by obeying the laws he knew and everyone blew it.

 

[Katzpur]

i dont know if the title of this post really gets across my question. what i mean is, can a person, who has never read the bible, and never met a christian and had a conversation about it, come to know jesus and be saved? like a native in the amazon jungle, who has never had any opportunity to meet a christian, or read the bible, what would happen to him? or even, lets say back in....800 ad for example, what happened to , for example, the japanese? they never had any opportunity to know anything about christianity. up until europeans started exploring (and conquering) the world, the rest of the world didnt really have any chance of knowing anything about christianity. what happened to these people?

*edit* i forgot my other question. i wonder, can a person who has never read the bible, and never met a christian, can they without either, come to be a christian on their own? can a person who is a blank slate, come to be a christian on their own, without any of these resources? or would you need someone and or the bible to teach you to become a christian?

I don't believe a person can be saved without a knowledge of Jesus Christ, but that doesn't mean what you'll probably think it means. I don't believe that a knowledge of Christ has to come during a person's mortal life. You see, my belief is that none of us immediately go to Heaven (or Hell, for that matter) immediately after death. Instead, when our spirit leaves our body at death, it does not cease to exist as a cognizant entity but continues to be fully aware and able to continue to learn, understand, and make choices. I believe that the spirits of all who have ever died reside in an intermediate realm (neither Heaven nor Earth) until such time as Christ returns to begin His millennial reign and the final judgment commences. During this period of time (which, for some people, could be several thousand years, depending upon when they lived), they can still learn of Christ and come to recognize the power of His atoning sacrifice on their parts. By the time we all stand before God to be judged, everyone will have had the opportunity to hear of the Christian gospel, to understand it and to either accept or reject it.

 

[chongjasmine]

It is not the knowledge of Christianity that saves a person.
Rather, it is the belief in Jesus as the savior and accepting Jesus into one's life that saves a christian.
So yes, a person can be saved without christian knowledge.

 

[EnsignRo]

I agree with chongjasmine. If you accept Jesus into your life you will be saved. As it states in John 3:16 16 'For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.'

 

[steveng]

I believe this: the ONLY way anyone will get to heaven, is by accepting Jesus into their heart (the prayer of salvation) Do Churches agree with that ? If they do, then why aren't they making SURE their members are praying that prayer ? Is it because it is too bold for the conservative style church service ?
I think it is essential, and ALL churches should help all their members to pray that prayer, and get their name written in the book of life. There is nothing the devil would hate more, than to loose its influence on the church. The churches decission to not help people to accept Jesus, is exactly what the devil want's.
PLEASE, prayfully consider this, both leadership of the church, and its members.
Do you agree with this ?
I would like to hear your opinion on this crutial matter.