Can you give me an observable evidence that Evolution is true?

[Guy Threepwood]

You keep assuming that the 'stable state' is permanent. It isn't. It is only stable from our view. The changes will continue. They just won't be drastic.


We would not be born sick and told to be well.

stable is a subjective term obviously, but organisms suddenly appearing from nowhere half a billion years ago, and never changing since, is pretty stable,
..
then how would you know the difference between sick and well?

 

[Nietzsche]

then how would you know the difference between sick and well?

Precisely. There would be no sick. I'm omnipotent, I don't have to make anything "bad". It can be all good.

 

[Guy Threepwood]

Precisely. There would be no sick. I'm omnipotent, I don't have to make anything "bad". It can be all good.

You cannot have good without bad, they are relative terms, they define each other

 

[Nietzsche]

You cannot have good without bad, they are relative terms, they define each other

Only in the world that we live in. If I am omnipotent, I could and would make a world where that is not at all the case.

 

[viole]

You cannot have good without bad, they are relative terms, they define each other

Ergo, there is no good in Heaven. Correct?

Ciao

- viole

 

[Guy Threepwood]

Only in the world that we live in. If I am omnipotent, I could and would make a world where that is not at all the case.

where 1+1=3? it's not a matter of omnipotence, but logic, you can't have left without right because they literally define each other. Take away one and you take away the other,

 

[Guy Threepwood]

Ergo, there is no good in Heaven. Correct?

Ciao

- viole

heaven is where you go when you chose good over bad, you must know both first

 

[Nietzsche]

where 1+1=3? it's not a matter of omnipotence, but logic, you can't have left without right because they literally define each other. Take away one and you take away the other,

Only here. If I am omnipotent, the fabric of reality is mine to spin. I can make a world where 1 and 1 is 3. Why not? Omnipotence means all-powerful. It means that there is no limits to what I could do. I do not have to work within any laws if I don't want to. I can repeal those laws and write new ones. It doesn't have to make sense here. At all. There would be no here. There would be no broken world.

 

[viole]

heaven is where you go when you chose good over bad, you must know both first

So, little children, or aborted fetuses, do not go to Heaven. Correct?

Ciao

- viole

 

[Guy Threepwood]

Only here. If I am omnipotent, the fabric of reality is mine to spin. I can make a world where 1 and 1 is 3. Why not? Omnipotence means all-powerful. It means that there is no limits to what I could do. I do not have to work within any laws if I don't want to. I can repeal those laws and write new ones. It doesn't have to make sense here. At all. There would be no here. There would be no broken world.

spin the fabric how you wish, 1+1 still = 2

Such a 'perfect' world was created, and still exists, where you can live with no fear, no hate, no grieving over death, the weather is always perfect and food floats into your mouth- for Jellyfish. And hence no joy, love, laughter either, would you trade? me neither

 

[Guy Threepwood]

So, little children, or aborted fetuses, do not go to Heaven. Correct?

Ciao

- viole

if the soul has learned and chosen good, that's the point, as Neetz said, he's want a world with only good, the only way to create this is to create a world where good is chosen, over bad. It has to exist relative to world where 'bad' exists, yes?

 

[McBell]

if the soul has learned and chosen good, that's the point, as Neetz said, he's want a world with only good, the only way to create this is to create a world where good is chosen, over bad. It has to exist relative to world where 'bad' exists, yes?

So in reality, he wants a world in which everything chooses him.
For if he was all powerful, he could have created a world that is all good from get go.
So it is not that he wants a world that is all good, he wants to be chosen over everything else.

 

[viole]

if the soul has learned and chosen good, that's the point, as Neetz said, he's want a world with only good, the only way to create this is to create a world where good is chosen, over bad. It has to exist relative to world where 'bad' exists, yes?

Can you imagine the soul of a miscarriaged fetus choosing evil? Or choosing anything at all?

Ciao

- viole

 

[Nietzsche]

spin the fabric how you wish, 1+1 still = 2

Such a 'perfect' world was created, and still exists, where you can live with no fear, no hate, no grieving over death, the weather is always perfect and food floats into your mouth- for Jellyfish. And hence no joy, love, laughter either, would you trade? me neither

if the soul has learned and chosen good, that's the point, as Neetz said, he's want a world with only good, the only way to create this is to create a world where good is chosen, over bad. It has to exist relative to world where 'bad' exists, yes?

No. It. Does. Not.

Do I need to define these words for you? I will, because obviously you are missing something.

om·nip·o·tent
ˌämˈnipəd(ə)nt/
adjective
adjective: omnipotent
1.
(of a deity) having unlimited power; able to do anything.

cre·a·tion
krēˈāSH(ə)n/
noun
noun: creation; noun: Creation; noun: the Creation

1. 1.
   the action or process of bringing something into existence.
   "the creation of a coalition government"
   synonyms: establishment, formation, foundation, initiation, institution, inauguration, constitution;More
   production, generation, fabrication, fashioning, building, construction, origination, development
   "the creation of a coalition government"
   antonyms: destruction
   • a thing that has been made or invented, especially something showing artistic talent.
     plural noun: creations
     "she treats fictional creations as if they were real people"
     synonyms: work, work of art, production, opus, oeuvre;More
     achievement, intellectual property;
     informalbrainchild
     "Margaret Atwood's literary creations"
2. 2.
   the bringing into of existence of the universe, especially when regarded as an act of God.
   • everything so created; the universe.
     "our alienation from the rest of Creation"
     synonyms: the world, the universe, the cosmos;More

re·al·i·ty
rēˈalədē/
noun
noun: reality

1. 1.
   the world or the state of things as they actually exist, as opposed to an idealistic or notional idea of them.
   "he refuses to face reality"
   synonyms: the real world, real life, actuality;More
   truth;
   physical existence
   "distinguishing fantasy from reality"
   antonyms: fantasy
   • a thing that is actually experienced or seen, especially when this is grim or problematic.
     plural noun: realities
     "the harsh realities of life in a farming community"
     synonyms: fact, actuality, truth
     "the harsh realities of life"
   • a thing that exists in fact, having previously only existed in one's mind.
     "the paperless office may yet become a reality"
   • the quality of being lifelike or resembling an original.
     "the reality of Marryat's detail"
     synonyms: verisimilitude, authenticity, realism, fidelity, faithfulness
     "the reality of Steinbeck's detail"
     antonyms: idealism
   • relating to reality TV.
     modifier noun: reality
     "a reality show"
2. 2.
   the state or quality of having existence or substance.
   "youth, when death has no reality"

Are we clear on our terms now? Good.

Were I omnipotent, I would create a reality where there was no sick, no grief, no suffering. Only joy, only happiness. You only need to know pain, suffering and hate in this world to appreciate happiness. I would make a world where we are not made that way. Where we can know it without having to experience the other. Where 1 + 1 = 3 because I am God and the reality I made makes it so. That is what omnipotence is. That is what creation means. That is what reality should be, from the perspective of a just & loving creator.

So in reality, he wants a world in which everything chooses him.
For if he was all powerful, he could have created a world that is all good from get go.
So it is not that he wants a world that is all good, he wants to be chosen over everything else.

Not quite. I want a world where I wouldn't come to exist at all.

 

[McBell]

Not quite. I want a world where I wouldn't come to exist at all.

Except I was referring to god, not you

 

[Nietzsche]

Except I was referring to god, not you

Oh. My mistake. My apologies.

 

[Shad]

A theist here that has no issue with evolution. Evolution is a fact, not a theory. Darwin did not propose a "Theory of Evolution" He wrote a Theory of the cause for it.

Evolution was recognized as fact at least 1000 years before Darwin. One example is in the writings of the Muslim Scientist al-Jahiz in His 9 volume "Kitab al-Hayawan"
See HERE

While we theists can present a rational explanation for evolution through "Divine intervention" we are acting stupid when we deny the existence of Evolution.

Although it was through selective breeding a very large amount of the food products (Meats and vegetables) we modern people eat, did not exist 100 years ago. Evolution through selective breeding. In more modern times we now even have new plant varieties developed through Genetic Engineering. If us frail, ignorant humans can cause evolutionary changes in just a few decades it is very ignorant to say nature and God(swt) did not do much more over millions of years.

Less time reading apologetics, more time reading what they source. Now if you actually read the book, which you didn't, you would of realized the book was a translation of Aristole's works rather than a product of the translator. Also he not proposed an ideas which are like the modern theory which you would of realized if you had read the book.

 

[Guy Threepwood]

No. It. Does. Not.

Do I need to define these words for you? I will, because obviously you are missing something.

om·nip·o·tent
ˌämˈnipəd(ə)nt/
adjective
adjective: omnipotent
1.
(of a deity) having unlimited power; able to do anything.

cre·a·tion
krēˈāSH(ə)n/
noun
noun: creation; noun: Creation; noun: the Creation

1. 1.
   the action or process of bringing something into existence.
   "the creation of a coalition government"
   synonyms: establishment, formation, foundation, initiation, institution, inauguration, constitution;More
   production, generation, fabrication, fashioning, building, construction, origination, development
   "the creation of a coalition government"
   antonyms: destruction
   • a thing that has been made or invented, especially something showing artistic talent.
     plural noun: creations
     "she treats fictional creations as if they were real people"
     synonyms: work, work of art, production, opus, oeuvre;More
     achievement, intellectual property;
     informalbrainchild
     "Margaret Atwood's literary creations"
2. 2.
   the bringing into of existence of the universe, especially when regarded as an act of God.
   • everything so created; the universe.
     "our alienation from the rest of Creation"
     synonyms: the world, the universe, the cosmos;More

re·al·i·ty
rēˈalədē/
noun
noun: reality

1. 1.
   the world or the state of things as they actually exist, as opposed to an idealistic or notional idea of them.
   "he refuses to face reality"
   synonyms: the real world, real life, actuality;More
   truth;
   physical existence
   "distinguishing fantasy from reality"
   antonyms: fantasy
   • a thing that is actually experienced or seen, especially when this is grim or problematic.
     plural noun: realities
     "the harsh realities of life in a farming community"
     synonyms: fact, actuality, truth
     "the harsh realities of life"
   • a thing that exists in fact, having previously only existed in one's mind.
     "the paperless office may yet become a reality"
   • the quality of being lifelike or resembling an original.
     "the reality of Marryat's detail"
     synonyms: verisimilitude, authenticity, realism, fidelity, faithfulness
     "the reality of Steinbeck's detail"
     antonyms: idealism
   • relating to reality TV.
     modifier noun: reality
     "a reality show"
2. 2.
   the state or quality of having existence or substance.
   "youth, when death has no reality"

Are we clear on our terms now? Good.

Were I omnipotent, I would create a reality where there was no sick, no grief, no suffering. Only joy, only happiness. You only need to know pain, suffering and hate in this world to appreciate happiness. I would make a world where we are not made that way. Where we can know it without having to experience the other. Where 1 + 1 = 3 because I am God and the reality I made makes it so. That is what omnipotence is. That is what creation means. That is what reality should be, from the perspective of a just & loving creator.



Not quite. I want a world where I wouldn't come to exist at all.

So your logical argument against a loving God, depends on the possibility of 1+1=3... and that left can exist without right.... not the most water tight logic.

this plus not wanting to exist at all, puts you in a very small minority, which is more to the point, the vast majority of humanity acknowledges God and gives thanks and love. Love cannot be forced or it is not love, there must always be those who chose otherwise.

 

[McBell]

So your logical argument against a loving God, depends on the possibility of 1+1=3... and that left can exist without right.... not the most water tight logic.

this plus not wanting to exist at all, puts you in a very small minority, which is more to the point, the vast majority of humanity acknowledges God and gives thanks and love. Love cannot be forced or it is not love, there must always be those who chose otherwise.

you keep relying on appeal to popularity.
One wonders if you will continue once Islams numbers exceed Christianities numbers...

 

[Nietzsche]

So your logical argument against a loving God, depends on the possibility of 1+1=3... and that left can exist without right.... not the most water tight logic.

this plus not wanting to exist at all, puts you in a very small minority, which is more to the point, the vast majority of humanity acknowledges God and gives thanks and love. Love cannot be forced or it is not love, there must always be those who chose otherwise.

Life is pain. Nothing more, nothing less. If we are starting before there was anything other than God, and I am in the driver's seat, I would not make life pain. My logic is just as solid as your own. Both suppose an all-powerful, reality-bending diety, who created something from nothing.

The difference is that my world wouldn't have children dying of malnutrition, the holocaust, murder, rape and torture.