Christian: The Need for a Fresh Word from God

[Katzpur]

I had no idea that the OP would appeal to Mormons. Of this I am completely innocent.

I'm surprised, Daddy-o! This is right up our alley.

By the way, I don't mean to be hostile in the least, but I don't think that Mormonism escapes Plato in the slightest. Unless there is a complete revision of LDS thought, it will remain Neo-Platonic for the forseeable future.

You lost me entirely. How so?

 

[angellous_evangellous]

I'm surprised, Daddy-o! This is right up our alley.

You lost me entirely. How so?

Darn... I was hoping not to have to explain that.

Read Plato's Timaeus and compare it to what you believe. Nailing down precisely what LDS theology is is fairly difficult, so I won't try. What I've heard, however, is thoroughly Platonic.

The Internet Classics Archive | Timaeus by Plato

 

[Buttercup]

Of course. Philo and Josephus were Hellenized Jews and wrote quite a bit.

I did at least know that fact.

Christians were much more Greek than Jews.

The fact of Greek philosophical influence just never really stood out to me about first century Christians other than language. Looks like I have a reading assignment to undertake. Thanks.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

I did at least know that fact. The fact of Greek philosophical influence just never really stood out to me about first century Christians other than language. Looks like I have a reading assignment to undertake. Thanks.

All aspects of "pagan" life influenced the New Testament, from grammar to cultural practices to philosophy. Some of these influences were mutually exclusive: philosophy was often counter-cultural, yet philosophy was part of the culture. It's a madhouse in there!

 

[MaddLlama]

What I've heard, however, is thoroughly Platonic.

Aww, so this means they're not kissing cousins?

*running away now*

 

[Katzpur]

Read Plato's Timaeus and compare it to what you believe.

Holy Cow! You're going to ask me to read a book?!?!?

Nailing down precisely what LDS theology is is fairly difficult, so I won't try. What I've heard, however, is thoroughly Platonic.

So why can't we just discuss "what you've heard"?

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Holy Cow! You're going to ask me to read a book?!?!?

So why can't we just discuss "what you've heard"?

Ah, it's not that long. You can just read a few lines and pretend like you understand the whole thing. :yes:

Anyway, LDS get partial credit in my book at least for having modern-day prophets.

 

[love]

I call myself a non-denominational Christian. I look at Jesus' life and how He lived it. To me after Pentecost everything else is history. We are making history everyday.
Christ hand picked His disciples to get us off the ground floor.
Like a tree He was the seed and root. Many branches grew. Many withered and died. Some produced bitter fruit.
The fruit closest to the trunk is still oh so sweet.

 

[Katzpur]

Ah, it's not that long. You can just read a few lines and pretend like you understand the whole thing. :yes:

Okay, I'll give it a try, but if I don't understand it, I won't try to fake it.

Anyway, LDS get partial credit in my book at least for having modern-day prophets.

That's nice, but we really shouldn't. If we've got legitimate called-by-God prophets, we should get full credit. If we've got false prophets, that's worse than having no prophets at all.

 

[Scuba Pete]

That's nice, but we really shouldn't. If we've got legitimate called-by-God prophets, we should get full credit. If we've got false prophets, that's worse than having no prophets at all.

I thought you guys were a "Non-Prophet" organization?

 

[Katzpur]

I thought you guys were a "Non-Prophet" organization?

Actually, just outside Temple Square, there is a huge statue of Brigham Young with his arm extended -- pointing towards Zions Bank, of which he was the founder. The prophet/profit pun is a familiar one here in Salt Lake City.

 

[Comprehend]

Sheesh Daddy, I am trying my best. Give a guy a break, eh. Anyways, it's not really my "job" where I am only here as a part of a global "advance team". The main event will arrive fairly soon.

What do you mean by this? Are you serious or joking?

 

[Katzpur]

What do you mean by this? Are you serious or joking?

He's joking, Comprehend. You must not know him very well.

 

[Comprehend]

Darn... I was hoping not to have to explain that.

Read Plato's Timaeus and compare it to what you believe. Nailing down precisely what LDS theology is is fairly difficult, so I won't try. What I've heard, however, is thoroughly Platonic.

The Internet Classics Archive | Timaeus by Plato

Angellous, I get the feeling you are labelling us as neoplatonists in order to dismiss us rather than address what we have said, which is essentially that the LDS church and our modern prophets fit the bill you have requested exactly.

I have an undergrad degree in philosophy and obviously I am also a mormon. Perhaps you could explain why you view the LDS church as neoplatonic and why that allows you to dismiss our church, and I might be able to make some half-educated response/defense.

 

[Comprehend]

He's joking, Comprehend. You must not know him very well.

Whatever Paul believes is a big mystery to me. I don't think I have ever heard him actually explain what it is but I only get bits and pieces. I am quite curious to find out though and I thought I better be safe than sorry when prodding for info.

 

[YmirGF]

Whatever Paul believes is a big mystery to me. I don't think I have ever heard him actually explain what it is but I only get bits and pieces. I am quite curious to find out though and I thought I better be safe than sorry when prodding for info.

Hehe. You could always start a thread in the One on One section, sire. I'd be happy to answer any questions you have. I will say that I wasn't exactly serious.

 

[Comprehend]

Hehe. You could always start a thread in the One on One section, sire. I'd be happy to answer any questions you have. I will say that I wasn't exactly serious.

I think I'll do that.

An interview with YmirGF...

give me a day or two to ponder some questions and I'll start it up. Thanks Ymir!

 

[Hope]

I'm currently in the third year of a phd program in New Testament, and my 11th year of study. The more I review and study the New Testament, the more I believe that it is completely and utterly insane to apply it with authority to the church today.

The New Testament is set firmly and completely in a social context that is misogynic, ethnocentric, and philosophically backward. I don't mean to argue that the present popular philosophy Western life - that there is no need for God due to existentialist realivism - is superior, but philosophy and social changes from the Enlightenment are significant progress from the blantant stupidity of Aristotle and Plato that birthed and nurished Christian theology.

I'm quite sure that if Arisotle and Plato had known about the scientific progresses made in the Enlightenment that Christianity would be much more friendly to women and homosexuals, and possibly Christianity would have had the forsight to condemn slavery and pederasty as early as the writing of the New Testament.

Anyway, the New Testament profoundly loses its worth when the presuppositions of Greek philosophy are removed, and indeed the later Christian theologies which wholesale reproduced Greek ideals are outdated and mute to contemporary issues.

It is time for a new word from God, and Christians should beg God to send modern prophets to speak fresh words of redemption and grace.

Sounds like you are a spokesman for the emerging/emergent church movement.

 

[Super Universe]

I'm currently in the third year of a phd program in New Testament, and my 11th year of study. The more I review and study the New Testament, the more I believe that it is completely and utterly insane to apply it with authority to the church today.

The New Testament is set firmly and completely in a social context that is misogynic, ethnocentric, and philosophically backward. I don't mean to argue that the present popular philosophy Western life - that there is no need for God due to existentialist realivism - is superior, but philosophy and social changes from the Enlightenment are significant progress from the blantant stupidity of Aristotle and Plato that birthed and nurished Christian theology.

I'm quite sure that if Arisotle and Plato had known about the scientific progresses made in the Enlightenment that Christianity would be much more friendly to women and homosexuals, and possibly Christianity would have had the forsight to condemn slavery and pederasty as early as the writing of the New Testament.

Anyway, the New Testament profoundly loses its worth when the presuppositions of Greek philosophy are removed, and indeed the later Christian theologies which wholesale reproduced Greek ideals are outdated and mute to contemporary issues.

It is time for a new word from God, and Christians should beg God to send modern prophets to speak fresh words of redemption and grace.

Time for a new word from God?

Just because YOU are two thousands years behind doesn't mean others are. It's been out...

 

[YmirGF]

Time for a new word from God?

Just because YOU are two thousands years behind doesn't mean others are. It's been out...

Oy vey. :cover: