Christians: The Nicene Creed?

[sojourner]

That's the Western version of the Creed.

Filioque - Wikipedia

That pesky filioque clause...

 

[TreeOfLife]

Here is the Nicene Creed:

We believe in one God,
the Father almighty,
maker of heaven and earth,
of all things visible and invisible.
And in one Lord Jesus Christ,
the only Son of God,
begotten from the Father before all ages,
God from God,
Light from Light,
true God from true God,
begotten, not made;
of the same essence as the Father.
Through him all things were made.
For us and for our salvation
he came down from heaven;
he became incarnate by the Holy Spirit and the virgin Mary,
and was made human.
He was crucified for us under Pontius Pilate;
he suffered and was buried.
The third day he rose again, according to the Scriptures.
He ascended to heaven
and is seated at the right hand of the Father.
He will come again with glory
to judge the living and the dead.
His kingdom will never end.
And we believe in the Holy Spirit,
the Lord, the giver of life.
He proceeds from the Father and the Son,
and with the Father and the Son is worshiped and glorified.
He spoke through the prophets.
We believe in one holy catholic and apostolic church.
We affirm one baptism for the forgiveness of sins.
We look forward to the resurrection of the dead,
and to life in the world to come. Amen.

Question: Do you either wholly accept it, partially accept it, or reject it all together?

And how important is it to you?

It's important to me as it's a snappy and concise summary of my Christian faith and I like that I share it with a great many other people

I think I entirely accept it

But I used to have a very slight issue where it says Jesus Christ is "the only Son of God"

Because I believe that God directly created other deities too, apart from Jesus Christ

But I now realise that by "son" it means "human male" - I believe that only one human male was ever "begotten" by God and that that person was Jesus Christ. But I believe God created other divine offspring such as The Holy Spirit

For instance, the Holy Spirit was created by God The Father, but is not a "son" of God as it is not a "human male" so cannot be called a "son" of anyone! And I don't believe the other deities who are not parts of the Godhead are human either although they may be humanoid.

So at the end of the day this is not an issue and I accept The Nicene Creed in its entirety

Ok. When does a puppy become a dog.

I do have a problem with this.
I believe that we are all children of the living G-d.
Lets start that I believe in the Bible. Nothing added as above and as is stated we are the children.

Lets start with Gen 1:28. How we are created
Then Psalms 82.6. Again who are we
The John 10:31...36. Even Jesus states we are G-ds children.
Then Rom 8:17
I can go on and on. We are the actual.offspring and therefore have Dominion over things in the flesh and the opportunity to return to live for the enternities with G-d and Jesus

As for the trinity please read John 14:20. It is time Christian to manifest and bring forth that whichbyou say you believe in

 

[Estro Felino]

At the point at mass whereas this is said, I don't participate, and our priest knows that I'm just the kind of person who questions everything, including the Creeds, and he accept this.

May I know why you do not?

 

[Estro Felino]

I do accept it in its entirety.

 

[TreeOfLife]

1. God from God,
Jesus is G-d. But not G-d the father

2. begotten, not made; Rev 3:14. Jesus himself states he is the first creation.

With those 2 things comes the main problems
1. Is the Bible true
2. If true then 1 & 2 above are not.
3. Is Jesus a liar. Angain that is something I can not fathom. (Rom 3:4)
4. If the Bible is not true then absolute truth does not exist. Again unfathomable

 

[Estro Felino]

2. begotten, not made; Rev 3:14. Jesus himself states he is the first creation.

With those 2 things comes the main problems
1. Is the Bible true
2. If true then 1 & 2 above are not.
3. Is Jesus a liar. Angain that is something I can not fathom. (Rom 3:4)
4. If the Bible is not true then absolute truth does not exist. Again unfathomable

Begotten, not made means He was delivered by a woman. He was not created as Adam was.

 

[metis]

May I know why you do not?

Briefly, because my main orientation and also my profession was in science, and with that we are natural skeptics.

 

[Estro Felino]

Briefly, because my main orientation and also my profession was in science, and with that we are natural skeptics.

Thank you, that is very insightful and interesting.

 

[lostwanderingsoul]

At the point at mass whereas this is said, I don't participate, and our priest knows that I'm just the kind of person who questions everything, including the Creeds, and he accept this.

May I ask for more details about what part you do not believe? Do you believe there is one God? Do you believe he made all things? I am honestly curious about what parts of the creed you believe and do not believe.

 

[metis]

May I ask for more details about what part you do not believe? Do you believe there is one God?

Likely is, but then what do I know?

Do you believe he made all things?

Probably yes, but in a roundabout way [see what I have written for "religion" at the top/right of my posts].

I am honestly curious about what parts of the creed you believe and do not believe.

I'm a scientist, now retired, thus I always question things and avoid what's called "blind faith". So, in answer to your question, I believe those who formulated the Creed tried to do their best based on what the saw or heard, so I can accept it at that level.

BTW, thanks for asking instead of jumping to conclusions like some here do. And, how do you look at the creeds?

 

[paradox]

Question: Do you either wholly accept it, partially accept it, or reject it all together?

I don't find any contradictions with scriptures to make me not believe certain parts of it.

 

[KW]

Here is the Nicene Creed:

We believe in one God,
the Father almighty,
maker of heaven and earth,
of all things visible and invisible.
And in one Lord Jesus Christ,
the only Son of God,
begotten from the Father before all ages,
God from God,
Light from Light,
true God from true God,
begotten, not made;
of the same essence as the Father.
Through him all things were made.
For us and for our salvation
he came down from heaven;
he became incarnate by the Holy Spirit and the virgin Mary,
and was made human.
He was crucified for us under Pontius Pilate;
he suffered and was buried.
The third day he rose again, according to the Scriptures.
He ascended to heaven
and is seated at the right hand of the Father.
He will come again with glory
to judge the living and the dead.
His kingdom will never end.
And we believe in the Holy Spirit,
the Lord, the giver of life.
He proceeds from the Father and the Son,
and with the Father and the Son is worshiped and glorified.
He spoke through the prophets.
We believe in one holy catholic and apostolic church.
We affirm one baptism for the forgiveness of sins.
We look forward to the resurrection of the dead,
and to life in the world to come. Amen.

Question: Do you either wholly accept it, partially accept it, or reject it all together?

And how important is it to you?

It's important to me as it's a snappy and concise summary of my Christian faith and I like that I share it with a great many other people

I think I entirely accept it

But I used to have a very slight issue where it says Jesus Christ is "the only Son of God"

Because I believe that God directly created other deities too, apart from Jesus Christ

But I now realise that by "son" it means "human male" - I believe that only one human male was ever "begotten" by God and that that person was Jesus Christ. But I believe God created other divine offspring such as The Holy Spirit

For instance, the Holy Spirit was created by God The Father, but is not a "son" of God as it is not a "human male" so cannot be called a "son" of anyone! And I don't believe the other deities who are not parts of the Godhead are human either although they may be humanoid.

So at the end of the day this is not an issue and I accept The Nicene Creed in its entirety

I accept it completely. I believe that this is the core of Christian beliefs.

 

[KW]

I believe it in its entirety... but I think the Catholics believe that this means only Catholics. I see it as just the universal church.

We do.

What do you do with the "one"? One church.

 

[KW]

I would like to hear what a Catholic thinks what the Catholic and Apostolic Church means.


.

The universal Church led by the successors of the apostles.

From Pope Clement in about 80 AD:

“Through countryside and city [the apostles] preached, and they appointed their earliest converts, testing them by the Spirit, to be the bishops and deacons of future believers. Nor was this a novelty, for bishops and deacons had been written about a long time earlier. . . . Our apostles knew through our Lord Jesus Christ that there would be strife for the office of bishop. For this reason, therefore, having received perfect foreknowledge, they appointed those who have already been mentioned and afterwards added the further provision that, if they should die, other approved men should succeed to their ministry” (Letter to the Corinthians 42:4–5, 44:1–3 [A.D. 80]).

 

[pearl]

Creed at Catholic Mass
Nicene Creed

I believe in one God,
the Father almighty,
maker of heaven and earth,
of all things visible and invisible.
I believe in one Lord Jesus Christ,
the Only Begotten Son of God,
born of the Father before all ages.
God from God, Light from Light,
true God from true God,
begotten, not made, consubstantial with the Father;
through him all things were made.
For us men and for our salvation
he came down from heaven,
and by the Holy Spirit was incarnate of the Virgin Mary,
and became man.
For our sake he was crucified under Pontius Pilate,
he suffered death and was buried,
and rose again on the third day
in accordance with the Scriptures.
He ascended into heaven
and is seated at the right hand of the Father.
He will come again in glory
to judge the living and the dead
and his kingdom will have no end.
I believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the giver of life,
who proceeds from the Father and the Son,
who with the Father and the Son is adored and glorified,
who has spoken through the prophets.
I believe in one, holy, catholic and apostolic Church.
I confess one Baptism for the forgiveness of sins
and I look forward to the resurrection of the dead
and the life of the world to come. Amen.

Jospeh Ratzinger in his book "Introduction to Christianity" presents a development on the Creed and the problems of unbelief. Introduction to Christianity, 2nd Edition (Communio Books): Ratzinger, Joseph Cardinal: 9781586170295: Books: Amazon.com
The excerpt allows a look at some of the need for development from the ancient Creed with Paul stating For I delivered to you in the foremost importance what I also received: that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures.

 

[paradox]

I would like to hear what a Catholic thinks what the Catholic and Apostolic Church means.

It means the church which doesn't contradict catholic teachings where the "church" is not a physical building but rather a flock of Jesus:
John 10:27

 

[metis]

Is the Catholic Church the "only one true church"? Actually, the answer is no.

The mark of the Church was and is the lineage of bishops traceable back to the Apostles? In our case, yes, we can-- but we ain't the only ones. Who else? Thanks for asking. Here they are: Orthodox Church [includes the Coptic Church], Moravian, Hussite, Anglican/Episcopal, some Scandinavian Lutheran Churches, and a couple of other churches I'm not familiar with but as considered as such.

It's called "apostolic succession" that involves the laying on of hands as the new bishops are ordained. See: Apostolic succession - Wikipedia

 

[Kenny]

We do.

What do you do with the "one"? One church.

I'm not exactly sure what your question is.

If I understand correctly, I would say it this way...

There is One Church with many rooms... there is the Catholic room, Church of God room, Nazarene room et al.

 

[paradox]

It's called "apostolic succession" that involves the laying on of hands as the new bishops are ordained. See: Apostolic succession - Wikipedia

Right, only a bishop may ordain another bishop.

Sadly Martin Luther was not a bishop, and thus denominations succeeded from and based on him are not apostolic.

 

[lostwanderingsoul]

Likely is, but then what do I know?


Probably yes, but in a roundabout way [see what I have written for "religion" at the top/right of my posts].
I'm a scientist, now retired, thus I always question things and avoid what's called "blind faith". So, in answer to your question, I believe those who formulated the Creed tried to do their best based on what the saw or heard, so I can accept it at that level.

BTW, thanks for asking instead of jumping to conclusions like some here do. And, how do you look at the creeds?

Metis, I am sure you are an intelligent person. I may sometimes question what a person believes but I never question their right to believe what they want. I am sure many here would use some colorful words to describe what I believe. I believe God is made up of two persons, not three. There is a father and a son. Together they are God just like a human father and son together are a family. The Bible says God is a spirit and God is holy. So this "family" called God is a holy spirit. There is no third person. Thanks for asking. Now I will get some of those colorful words when people read this.