College students unclear about Free Speech - FIRE

[beenherebeforeagain]

If I understand correct there is no problem there except that the number of people on the latter category should be much higher.

I'm guessing 100% of the rest of them would change their view as soon as someone insults them publicly.

libel and slander are not protected forms of speech, nor is speech that tends to incite violence or panic...although it is a very rare situation that would see preemptive censorship by the government. Whether or not 'insults' qualify as protected free speech is still a gray area, and it is difficult to prove libel or slander...

 

[Epic Beard Man]

The term "acceptable speech" is subjective.

So is the idea of "free speech."

 

[Shad]

So is the idea of "free speech."

Nope.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

How does punishing intolerant and hateful speech violate the principle of free speech?

If it's punished, you aren't free to say it. And, honestly, I would rather have our system than one where it is criminally illegal to deny the Holocaust. We could do better in regards to speech that can reasonable be understood to incite violence and discrimination, but people are intolerant and often become more intolerant when they can't express their views.

 

[Revoltingest]

If it's punished, you aren't free to say it. And, honestly, I would rather have our system than one where it is criminally illegal to deny the Holocaust. We could do better in regards to speech that can reasonable be understood to incite violence and discrimination, but people are intolerant and often become more intolerant when they can't express their views.

I notice that even some here on RF are sympathetic to government
restricting offensive speech. What horror would they envision if
they were to grant that power, & then see Trump re-elected?
People....those critters are not inclined to consider all consequences, eh.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I notice that even some here on RF are sympathetic to government
restricting offensive speech. What horror would they envision if
they were to grant that power, & then see Trump re-elected?
People....those critters are not inclined to consider all consequences, eh.

Trump would get for more years of restricting speech in government science research, which he has already done.

 

[Shad]

That is the problem with free speech absolutionists to think that you should absolutely say whatever you want whenever is the major problem. Free speech protects you from the government, not the rest of society. If certain speech is disruptive to the tranquility of an environment especially when learning is involved, it needs to be mitigated. Not a hard concept.

Tranquility is vague and can be applied in contexts in which the harm is merely being uncomfortable with a spoken fact. Apply your idea to cults.

 

[Shad]

If it's punished, you aren't free to say it. And, honestly, I would rather have our system than one where it is criminally illegal to deny the Holocaust. We could do better in regards to speech that can reasonable be understood to incite violence and discrimination, but people are intolerant and often become more intolerant when they can't express their views.

Thought crimes. One can not merely be wrong they must be punished! 1+3=5. Off with their head!

 

[sun rise]

According the to survey of 2225 U.S. college students linked to below:

- 96% think it's important to have their rights and liberties (e.g. free speech) protected on campus.
- But 57% think that "offensive" or "intolerant" views should be restricted.

Apparently, many students are unclear on the concept of free speech.

https://d28htnjz2elwuj.cloudfront.n...4349/Student-Attitudes-Association-Survey.pdf

What? College students are inconsistent in their beliefs? How can that be when non-collect people and older adults are perfectly clear and consistent about what they believe.

The answer is that it's all the brain's fault. How Your Brain Makes You Hold Contradictory Beliefs

 

[Rational Agnostic]

How does punishing intolerant and hateful speech violate the principle of free speech?

Who decides what is hateful and intolerant? What I see as being hateful and intolerant, you may not, and vice versa. The problem is the subjectivity. There is no objective definition of "hateful" and "intolerant." For instance, I see many verses of the Bible and Qur'an as being hateful and intolerant, but I am not in favor of banning the public reading of them. And, in any case, the first amendment wasn't made to protect popular speech, because popular speech does not need special protection. Only unpopular speech needs protection.

 

[Twilight Hue]

According the to survey of 2225 U.S. college students linked to below:

- 96% think it's important to have their rights and liberties (e.g. free speech) protected on campus.
- But 57% think that "offensive" or "intolerant" views should be restricted.

Apparently, many students are unclear on the concept of free speech.

https://d28htnjz2elwuj.cloudfront.n...4349/Student-Attitudes-Association-Survey.pdf

I think the consensus is it's free speech, as long as it agrees with me.

They're pretty screwed-up people.

 

[Twilight Hue]

How does punishing intolerant and hateful speech violate the principle of free speech?

Because it's not free speech then.

 

[Stevicus]

According the to survey of 2225 U.S. college students linked to below:

- 96% think it's important to have their rights and liberties (e.g. free speech) protected on campus.
- But 57% think that "offensive" or "intolerant" views should be restricted.

Apparently, many students are unclear on the concept of free speech.

https://d28htnjz2elwuj.cloudfront.n...4349/Student-Attitudes-Association-Survey.pdf

It's interesting how the attitudes of college students change over the decades.

Back in the 60s, they used to fight for civil rights, free speech, peace, love.

By the time I got to college in the 80s, we had to fight for our right to party. I suppose that's a part of free speech.

But now, I'm not so sure.

 

[The Reverend Bob]

That is the problem with free speech absolutionists to think that you should absolutely say whatever you want whenever is the major problem. Free speech protects you from the government, not the rest of society. If certain speech is disruptive to the tranquility of an environment especially when learning is involved, it needs to be mitigated. Not a hard concept.

You can't just yell fire in a crowded theater. Speech has consequences

 

[The Reverend Bob]

Because it's not free speech then.

Do you ever want to meet me in IRL and talk the crap you do on here and see if something you will not like happens? @Revoltingest

 

[HonestJoe]

The term "acceptable speech" is subjective.

That's my point. The OP is presenting that impression that there are no limits when in truth they're just applying their own interpretation of "acceptable speech".

 

[Twilight Hue]

Do you ever want to meet me in IRL and talk the crap you do on here and see if something you will not like happens? @Revoltingest

You think thats somehow unique? Through my time in the military and living in this godforsaken state I've heard just about everything and anything directed at me. I really don't care. It doesn't mean a goddamn thing.

And I'll protect your right to say it too.

 

[Skwim]

Students?
Just look at the adults here on RF.
The Constitution is despised, ignored, misread, & even uncapitalized !!!
Of course, I can forgive ignant ferriners, but the Ameristanians should know better.

With half the population harboring IQs below 100 (25% are "Dull Normal" or below) I'm not so sure.

.

 

[Audie]

Students?
Just look at the adults here on RF.
The Constitution is despised, ignored, misread, & even uncapitalized !!!
Of course, I can forgive ignant ferriners, but the Ameristanians should know better.

We newcomers are often the best educated and most
patriotic.

I am hardly from a 3rd world s hole, but one does not
have to be to appreciate the USA for what it is.

Id like to see all these whiners and complainers go overseas
for a year at least. No, not the cote d'azure or new zealand.

Cambodia. Uruguay. Cameroon. One of those.
Or China. Make your own way in one of those
societies. See if it suits, or
why newcomers
actually appreciate America.

We dont even want a civil war so we
can kill those unpatriotic americs haters
who make up the other 50%!!

Americans are so freakin' entitled!

 

[icehorse]

That's my point. The OP is presenting that impression that there are no limits when in truth they're just applying their own interpretation of "acceptable speech".

Nope. The tacit context here is that we're talking about how free speech is currently defined in the U.S. It's not absolute - for example you cannot incite imminent violence - but it does allow for offense giving.