Convince me that God is loving

[Brian2]

Convince me that God is loving without referring to scriptures that say that.

Tell me why I should believe that God is loving.

I cannot believe God is loving since it makes no sense to me that there would be so much suffering in the world if God was loving. I am referring to suffering that cannot be tied any free will decision of the person who suffers.

I do not want to hear any religious apologetics about how suffering is for our own good. We all know that there is a lot of gratuitous suffering in the world, suffering that serves no purpose.

A person who loves someone does things to show that they love that person, and they make sacrifices for the other person. If a man tells me he loves me but does nothing to show it, why would I believe him?

What does God do to show He loves us? What sacrifices does God make?

I see no evidence that God is loving, so I have to write that off as a faith-based belief.

P.S. Whether we should love God or not is another discussion. In principle, I think we should love God and other people without expectation of getting anything in return. I do not need God’s love in order to love God. I do not need love from anyone in order to love that person because I consider that selfish.

Christians and Baha’s believe that God is loving, and I think there is a reason for that, other than what their scriptures say. Imo, they have to believe God is loving because they need to feel loved by God in order to love God. I have no idea why since I do not need God’s love in order to love God. The reason I want to know if God is loving is because I am tired of religious people saying that God is loving with nothing but scriptures to back that up.

I exist, I have warmth and food and rain and sun and etc.
If I had a choice I would have chosen this life than nothing at all.

 

[sun rise]

Convince me that God is loving without referring to scriptures that say that.

Tell me why I should believe that God is loving.

I cannot believe God is loving since it makes no sense to me that there would be so much suffering in the world if God was loving. I am referring to suffering that cannot be tied any free will decision of the person who suffers.

I do not want to hear any religious apologetics about how suffering is for our own good. We all know that there is a lot of gratuitous suffering in the world, suffering that serves no purpose.

A person who loves someone does things to show that they love that person, and they make sacrifices for the other person. If a man tells me he loves me but does nothing to show it, why would I believe him?

What does God do to show He loves us? What sacrifices does God make?

I see no evidence that God is loving, so I have to write that off as a faith-based belief.

P.S. Whether we should love God or not is another discussion. In principle, I think we should love God and other people without expectation of getting anything in return. I do not need God’s love in order to love God. I do not need love from anyone in order to love that person because I consider that selfish.

Christians and Baha’s believe that God is loving, and I think there is a reason for that, other than what their scriptures say. Imo, they have to believe God is loving because they need to feel loved by God in order to love God. I have no idea why since I do not need God’s love in order to love God. The reason I want to know if God is loving is because I am tired of religious people saying that God is loving with nothing but scriptures to back that up.

Can a parent love a child but know that children sometimes have to be allowed to make mistakes and suffer the consequences?

 

[Stevicus]

Convince me that God is loving without referring to scriptures that say that.

Tell me why I should believe that God is loving.

I cannot believe God is loving since it makes no sense to me that there would be so much suffering in the world if God was loving. I am referring to suffering that cannot be tied any free will decision of the person who suffers.

I do not want to hear any religious apologetics about how suffering is for our own good. We all know that there is a lot of gratuitous suffering in the world, suffering that serves no purpose.

A person who loves someone does things to show that they love that person, and they make sacrifices for the other person. If a man tells me he loves me but does nothing to show it, why would I believe him?

What does God do to show He loves us? What sacrifices does God make?

I see no evidence that God is loving, so I have to write that off as a faith-based belief.

P.S. Whether we should love God or not is another discussion. In principle, I think we should love God and other people without expectation of getting anything in return. I do not need God’s love in order to love God. I do not need love from anyone in order to love that person because I consider that selfish.

Christians and Baha’s believe that God is loving, and I think there is a reason for that, other than what their scriptures say. Imo, they have to believe God is loving because they need to feel loved by God in order to love God. I have no idea why since I do not need God’s love in order to love God. The reason I want to know if God is loving is because I am tired of religious people saying that God is loving with nothing but scriptures to back that up.

Well, I'm an agnostic, so I guess you could say I take the uncertain, wishy-washy approach to the whole issue.

I was thinking about this the other day, wondering if I was the only person in the entire universe and that all around me was some illusion. Then I thought about how some people talk about all life, all of humanity, and everything in the cosmos as being "one" and part of the same God. It's the idea that we're not really individuals, or at least, not permanently so, and that we all are connected and part of a singular consciousness.

But then, if that's the case, then that single being is absolutely alone in the universe. No friends, no peers, no one to really "love" except itself and parts of itself.

 

[Kenny]

Convince me that God is loving without referring to scriptures that say that.

Tell me why I should believe that God is loving.

I cannot believe God is loving since it makes no sense to me that there would be so much suffering in the world if God was loving. I am referring to suffering that cannot be tied any free will decision of the person who suffers.

I do not want to hear any religious apologetics about how suffering is for our own good. We all know that there is a lot of gratuitous suffering in the world, suffering that serves no purpose.

A person who loves someone does things to show that they love that person, and they make sacrifices for the other person. If a man tells me he loves me but does nothing to show it, why would I believe him?

What does God do to show He loves us? What sacrifices does God make?

I see no evidence that God is loving, so I have to write that off as a faith-based belief.

P.S. Whether we should love God or not is another discussion. In principle, I think we should love God and other people without expectation of getting anything in return. I do not need God’s love in order to love God. I do not need love from anyone in order to love that person because I consider that selfish.

Christians and Baha’s believe that God is loving, and I think there is a reason for that, other than what their scriptures say. Imo, they have to believe God is loving because they need to feel loved by God in order to love God. I have no idea why since I do not need God’s love in order to love God. The reason I want to know if God is loving is because I am tired of religious people saying that God is loving with nothing but scriptures to back that up.

For God so loved the world... John 3:16

Question you need to ask IMO, what did Jesus do while on the earth?

. In principle, I think we should love God and other people without expectation of getting anything in return. I do not need God’s love in order to love God. I do not need love from anyone in order to love that person because I consider that selfish.

I think that is a fair statement although I do believe we need love from someone.

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

As a former Christian and survivor of childhood abuse, I don't believe the Abrahamic God is loving. On the contrary, I hold the exact opposite view of the biblical God, assuming he even exists. In my opinion, I think it is complete nonsense when Christians claim that God is love and that he will allow bad things to happen and usually does not intervene in people's lives due to free will. For instance, if I saw another person being physically harmed, I would not turn a blind eye, thinking, "I am not going to intervene and help this poor person because I don't want to infringe on their attacker's free will." And if I saw a child being beaten and abused, I wouldn't ever turn away and not intervene because I didn't want to interfere with their abuser's free will. That seems to be what Christians are telling me when they say that God doesn't usually intervene in people's lives due to free will. That, in my opinion, is total nonsense, and if God exists and doesn't intervene to stop violent acts against people, including children, then I believe he is just as guilty as the perpetrator.

 

[John53]

Can a parent love a child but know that children sometimes have to be allowed to make mistakes and suffer the consequences?

Sure but would they knowingly allow them to be abused when they had the means to prevent it?

 

[samtonga43]

Convince me that God is loving without referring to scriptures that say that.

Tell me why I should believe that God is loving.

I cannot believe God is loving since it makes no sense to me that there would be so much suffering in the world if God was loving. I am referring to suffering that cannot be tied any free will decision of the person who suffers.

I do not want to hear any religious apologetics about how suffering is for our own good. We all know that there is a lot of gratuitous suffering in the world, suffering that serves no purpose.

A person who loves someone does things to show that they love that person, and they make sacrifices for the other person. If a man tells me he loves me but does nothing to show it, why would I believe him?

What does God do to show He loves us? What sacrifices does God make?

I see no evidence that God is loving, so I have to write that off as a faith-based belief.

P.S. Whether we should love God or not is another discussion. In principle, I think we should love God and other people without expectation of getting anything in return. I do not need God’s love in order to love God. I do not need love from anyone in order to love that person because I consider that selfish.

Christians and Baha’s believe that God is loving, and I think there is a reason for that, other than what their scriptures say. Imo, they have to believe God is loving because they need to feel loved by God in order to love God. I have no idea why since I do not need God’s love in order to love God. The reason I want to know if God is loving is because I am tired of religious people saying that God is loving with nothing but scriptures to back that up.

You ask to be convinced God is loving. Do you want to be convinced? I ask because you appear to be convinced that He is not loving. Do you think it is possible you could be convinced by someone on an internet forum?
If you really do want to be convinced --- why do you want to be convinced?

 

[loverofhumanity]

As a former Christian and a survivor of childhood abuse, I don't believe the Abrahamic God is loving. On the contrary, I hold the exact opposite view of the biblical God, assuming he even exists. In my opinion, I think it is complete nonsense when Christians claim that God is love and that he will allow bad things to happen and usually does not intervene in people's lives due to free will. For instance, if I saw another person being physically harmed, I would not turn a blind eye, thinking, "I am not going to intervene and help this poor person because I don't want to infringe on their attacker's free will." And if I saw a child being beaten and abused, I wouldn't ever turn away and not intervene because I didn't want to interfere with their abuser's free will. That seems to be what Christians are telling me when they say that God doesn't usually and intervene in people's lives due to free will. That, in my opinion, is nonsense, and if God exists and doesn't intervene to stop violent acts against people, including children, then I believe he is just as guilty as the perpetrator.

Hi. I was also a victim of child abuse. I had a very traumatic childhood where I became orphaned resulting in me attempting suicide six times and eventually receiving six courses of shock therapy. After all this ‘trauma and deep depression’ I found Baha’u’llah.
Then my understanding of my own suffering changed. Would I have found the truth any other way? Now I thank God every moment and see my suffering as a great act of love that I never ever consider to be worthy of.

But for many others, they still suffer not knowing what awaits them or whether it will ever end. Some suicide so we do not know their end. Everyone’s life plays out differently but from my own personal experience I’m absolutely 100% sure God loves me and humanity because He sends us wonderful Enlightened Educators like Buddha, Christ and Baha’u’llah to guide us.

But in the world today we have become very materialistic and I believe that’s where all our misery and suffering comes from. I believe a spiritual attitude creates mostly contentment, inner peace and joy but this can only happen through obedience to God’s laws for each age.

 

[samtonga43]

In my opinion, I think it is complete nonsense when Christians claim that God is love and that he will allow bad things to happen and usually does not intervene in people's lives due to free will. For instance, if I saw another person being physically harmed, I would not turn a blind eye, thinking, "I am not going to intervene and help this poor person because I don't want to infringe on their attacker's free will." And if I saw a child being beaten and abused, I wouldn't ever turn away and not intervene because I didn't want to interfere with their abuser's free will. That seems to be what Christians are telling me when they say that God doesn't usually intervene in people's lives due to free will. That, in my opinion, is total nonsense...

See bolded words.
I have to say, as a Christian, that it is total nonsense in my opinion also.

(You're not building a strawman are you?)

 

[loverofhumanity]

Convince me that God is loving without referring to scriptures that say that.

Tell me why I should believe that God is loving.

I cannot believe God is loving since it makes no sense to me that there would be so much suffering in the world if God was loving. I am referring to suffering that cannot be tied any free will decision of the person who suffers.

I do not want to hear any religious apologetics about how suffering is for our own good. We all know that there is a lot of gratuitous suffering in the world, suffering that serves no purpose.

A person who loves someone does things to show that they love that person, and they make sacrifices for the other person. If a man tells me he loves me but does nothing to show it, why would I believe him?

What does God do to show He loves us? What sacrifices does God make?

I see no evidence that God is loving, so I have to write that off as a faith-based belief.

P.S. Whether we should love God or not is another discussion. In principle, I think we should love God and other people without expectation of getting anything in return. I do not need God’s love in order to love God. I do not need love from anyone in order to love that person because I consider that selfish.

Christians and Baha’s believe that God is loving, and I think there is a reason for that, other than what their scriptures say. Imo, they have to believe God is loving because they need to feel loved by God in order to love God. I have no idea why since I do not need God’s love in order to love God. The reason I want to know if God is loving is because I am tired of religious people saying that God is loving with nothing but scriptures to back that up.

The fact that God sent Baha’u’llah and that you have been led to believe in Him means is not the most precious and priceless gift you could ever have received in this world?

 

[stvdv]

I remember when I was young, 18 years old, coming home feeling life was empty of any happiness whatsoever. I saw those who were smiling as pretending to be happy. It all seemed fake to me. It was around early May and I asked my mother what was it that people see in life that they acting happy about. I told her all their smiling and acting happy seemed completely fake to me. "What is there to be happy about", I believe was my question to her.

She pointed me to look outside the window and said, "Well look outside. It's a beautiful spring day. You can hear the birds singing, you can smell the snow melting, and feel see the blue sky." I stood there looking, honestly trying to see what she was seeing, as I respected and trusted my mother. I saw nothing. I felt nothing. I was completely empty inside. I told her honestly, "I don't see anything".

It was only a couple days later that I had a spontaneous experience of coming face to face with the Infinite. It was not based on any belief or any religious context, as I was not a religious person, nor raised with any of those kinds of beliefs. That experience was one of Absolute Love that is beyond words to describe, and I had a life-review experience where I saw my entire life pass before me, and then this knowledge that that whole time where I felt I was all alone and isolated, that same Love was always there with me. It was pure, timeless, still, and infinite beyond any comprehension. It broke me open and forever changed my life.

And that is why I see the truth of this Absolute, the Infinite that embraces all that is, which we happen to call "God", is in fact pure, infinite, unconditional, and absolute Love. It has never left me, and the only time I do not see it, is when as before, I am not seeing. I am in my own mind, looking into my own thoughts and away from that which is always there without effort.

It's only later I learned about things from religion that sometimes match that experience, such as God is Love. With that I agree, because that knowledge came first through direct experience. I only believe it to be true, because I had tasted it directly already. What I was taught that didn't match, I discarded. The truth of that Love could never be doubted by me.

Wonderful experience

Thank you for sharing

 

[Kenny]

As a former Christian and survivor of childhood abuse, I don't believe the Abrahamic God is loving. On the contrary, I hold the exact opposite view of the biblical God, assuming he even exists. In my opinion, I think it is complete nonsense when Christians claim that God is love and that he will allow bad things to happen and usually does not intervene in people's lives due to free will. For instance, if I saw another person being physically harmed, I would not turn a blind eye, thinking, "I am not going to intervene and help this poor person because I don't want to infringe on their attacker's free will." And if I saw a child being beaten and abused, I wouldn't ever turn away and not intervene because I didn't want to interfere with their abuser's free will. That seems to be what Christians are telling me when they say that God doesn't usually intervene in people's lives due to free will. That, in my opinion, is total nonsense, and if God exists and doesn't intervene to stop violent acts against people, including children, then I believe he is just as guilty as the perpetrator.

I'm sorry you went through that.

But i think rather than letting our experience define God, we should let God define our experience.

 

[Trailblazer]

In general, I find it very strange that humans would expect that-which-is-not-human to operate by frames of reference that are human. I find it downright bizarre when we are limiting the field of consideration to that god.

I do not expect God to operate by frames of reference that are human. However, that is the only frame of reference in which I as a human can operate.

I'm not going to tell you why you should believe that god is loving. I'd instead invite an examining of assumptions - why does it make sense to believe that god understands love in the same way you do? How is your human understanding of love at all relevant to an entity whose frame of reference is vastly alien to your own?

I do not believe that God understands love in the same way I do. However, I can only understand what God's love is from a human frame of reference, since I am a human.

So here we go. I am just supposed to believe that God is loving, even though I cannot understand why God is loving, because scriptures say that God is loving. That is blind faith and I want no part of it.

 

[Trailblazer]

Could it be that there is no God?

What would be the difference if there was or wasn't, since God does not do anything anyway?

 

[Trailblazer]

I exist, I have warmth and food and rain and sun and etc.
If I had a choice I would have chosen this life than nothing at all.

If I had the choice, I would have chosen never to be born at all.....
but I don't have that choice so I have to try to make the best of my life in this world.

 

[Trailblazer]

Can a parent love a child but know that children sometimes have to be allowed to make mistakes and suffer the consequences?

How is that related to anything I said? Are you saying that the consequences of our mistakes are what causes suffering?
I said "I am referring to suffering that cannot be tied any free will decision of the person who suffers."

 

[Exaltist Ethan]

If I had the choice, I would have chosen never to be born at all.....
but I don't have that choice so I have to try to make the best of my life in this world.

I don't believe you actually believe that. Or know what it would mean if you didn't exist.

Have you seen It's a Wonderful Life?

 

[Trailblazer]

Well, I'm an agnostic, so I guess you could say I take the uncertain, wishy-washy approach to the whole issue.

Lucky you! Where do I sign up?

 

[Trailblazer]

For God so loved the world... John 3:16

Question you need to ask IMO, what did Jesus do while on the earth?

Jesus did a whole heck of a lot for the good of humanity.
Jesus gave His life so we could have eternal life, but God did nothing.

I think that is a fair statement although I do believe we need love from someone.

Maybe so, from someone, and it is going to come from people, not from God. It also comes from animals because they too can love in their own way.

 

[Trailblazer]

You ask to be convinced God is loving. Do you want to be convinced? I ask because you appear to be convinced that He is not loving. Do you think it is possible you could be convinced by someone on an internet forum?
If you really do want to be convinced --- why do you want to be convinced?

Why would I ask to be convinced if I did not want to be convinced?
I am not convinced that God is loving or that God is not loving - I simply don't know.

It is possible to be convinced by someone on an internet forum, if they had a good argument.

I explained why I want to be convinced.

I said:
"The reason I want to know if God is loving is because I am tired of religious people saying that God is loving with nothing but scriptures to back that up."