Covid: ICU nurse speaks out

[sun rise]

My 26 year old great niece is in the hospital on oxygen due to Covid. Her aunt's fiancee died from Covid in the first wave. He was in his early 40's.

I'm sorry to hear about this. Many of us are being impacted.

 

[sun rise]

It still is in an FDA "emergency use authorization" - not an truly approved vaccination (if I understand the process correctly)

It will be soon. I know I've been followed by the FDA/CDC after my vaccinations on a voluntary basis. I've been asked if there were any side-effects, how my general health was etc.

It uses new technology (RNA manipulation) - with no historical safety record (as far as I know)

The Johnson & Johnson shot does not.

Keep out of people's business in deciding what they should or should not do with their body. It's their choice, and not yours to make.

Your choice affects my economic well-being.
Your choice affects how overcrowed hospitals become and thus perhaps my life.
Your choice affects peoples lives.

I am all in favor of refusing services, admission to facilities to non-vaccinated people.
I am all in favor of removing health insurance for non-vaccinated people.

Don't like my attitude? Tough.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Sure.... Hopefully I won't violate any rules

Pros of vaccination:

• The higher possibility of you not contracting Covid
• If contracting Covid, it may be at a lesser degree of intensity (although some have died or have been admitted to ICU
• If there is a vaccination passport, there is a certain degree of more comfort for those around you(even if it doesn't have a guarantee)

(shorter list does not equate as less important or less valuable... just less possibilities.)

Cons of vaccination:

• It still is in an FDA "emergency use authorization" - not an truly approved vaccination (if I understand the process correctly)
• It uses new technology (RNA manipulation) - with no historical safety record (as far as I know)
• There are some (though not of great percentage) of immediate side effects that can result from mild discomfort to death and in between the two.
• There is no knowledge that can be determined, at this time, of long term effects. As an example -- an enlarged heart that may be overcome now but don't know what the effects are 40 years later.
• It isn't a guarantee that you won't get Covid, you might need a third booster shot, and since it is a virus, additional vaccinations may be required for variant Covid viruses

Pros of natural vaccination:

• The higher possibility of you not contracting Covid again
• If you contract it again, it may be at a lesser degree of intensity
• If there is a "I have had covid naturally passport (like in Israel)" there is a certain degree of more comfort for those around you (even if it doesn't have a guarantee)

Cons of natural vaccination:

• you could die (even if the percentage is not very large - it gets larger the older you get or the more compromised your body is) - but that is true of the vaccination too
• You could have some lasting effects if it affected your cerebral area.

Pros of no vaccination:

• you maintain your freedom of decision (although you still have your freedom of decision if you DECIDE to take the vaccine

Cons of no vaccination:

• please reference to cons of natural vaccination.

I don't really find the logic of "If you don't get vaccinated, you are a danger to society", no more than if you get in your car to drive. Because if you feel that the unvaccinated are a danger to you, you can go ahead and get vaccinated and not worry about it. (At least in my view)

Would you like to add to my list? More minds makes a better list.

You pretty much touched it all there. Good to look at pros and cons before deciding to take vaccines, meds, treatment.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Your choice affects my economic well-being.
Your choice affects how overcrowed hospitals become and thus perhaps my life.
Your choice affects peoples lives.

I am all in favor of refusing services, admission to facilities to non-vaccinated people.
I am all in favor of removing health insurance for non-vaccinated people.

Don't like my attitude? Tough.

Good luck with that.

It isn't changing my views either nor other people as well. I would simply state it's a solid stalemate.

I guess its just plain tough piddy in kind sunshine.

 

[Revoltingest]

@KenS …
MRNA tech has been around for a couple decades.
Some info about it….
mRNA vaccines — a new era in vaccinology | Nature Reviews Drug Discovery

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Would be interesting to know exactly what these anti vaccine people are afraid of? I would assume that the majority is because of some conspiracy reason. But I doubt that is the only one?

Are there any religious reason why they wouldn't? I mean, as far as I know it is no problem for the "standard" Christian or Muslim believer, but are there some nominations of these or other religions that are against it, does anyone know?

What still shocks me is the amount of evidence for the vaccine, I mean just a quick search on the good old google, it seems that 1.8 billion are fully vaccinated and doubling that for those that have gotten the first one only. That is a pretty huge amount of test cases

But anyway, its sad to see people die from it, if it could have been prevented.

No. A lot of people decide not to take it just as they decide not to take any other treatment/med/vaccine/whatever.

It's a deliberate well informed choice that needs no justifications. They made a decision. Most people disagree. Nothing wrong with that. No interior motive. No conspiracies. They just don't want to take it.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Excuse the comparison but it's like with some christians tell atheist they reject their god and can't understand disbelief. No rejection. No denial. No ignorance. They just don't believe God exist.

Same difference.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

This speaks for itself. And it's being replicated all over. And on top of it, the governor of Texas gets covid, freaks out and gets a treatment reserved for those who are in serious condition.
View attachment 54009 View attachment 54010 View attachment 54011 View attachment 54012 View attachment 54013
Upset Covid Frontline Nurse Delivers A Spot-On Twitter Thread On People’s Mistrust In Modern Medicine

My question is how does this get people to vaccinate?

What's the message you're saying?

 

[Twilight Hue]

My nephew in his mid-40s, healthy, normal weight, no underlying health issues, has been sick with Covid for 2 weeks, in the hospital for the 7th. day today, it'll be at least a week before they release him assuming he makes progress from here, and no, he's not vaccinated.

The thing is you don't know how Covid will affect you. You know this time. You don't know next time. And there will likely be a next time. You can not worry about it all you want. Covid doesn't care.

I can agree with that. There comes a time however to decide if you want to hide under the bed all your life or go out , take some risks , and enjoy what life offers.

Personally, I'd prefer more risk and freedom, to living a sad life spent in safety and bondage.

 

[Daemon Sophic]

Bottom line.

Get the vaccine if you feel its that urgent.

Keep out of people's business in deciding what they should or should not do with their body. It's their choice, and not yours to make.







End of story.

Do you wear your seatbelt? Do you whine that the US government made it mandatory?

 

[anna.]

I can agree with that. There comes a time however to decide if you want to hide under the bed all your life or go out , take some risks , and enjoy what life offers.

Personally, I'd prefer more risk and freedom, to living a sad life spent in safety and bondage.

Am I understanding you correctly, you're equating getting a vaccination with bondage?

 

[Twilight Hue]

Do you wear your seatbelt? Do you whine that the US government made it mandatory?

Yes. And I still whine about seatbelt laws to this day.

Ironically, I will still wear a seatbelt even if they rescind the law.

Unless I have a motorcycle.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Am I understanding you correctly, you're equating getting a vaccination with bondage?

Not any vaccine but rather any or all mandates.

It's just another legal mechanism being placed for totalitarian rule and a few more lost places on the freedom index.

 

[halbhh]

This culture war is having real casualties, which is why those who are not only willfully ignorant but smugly so make my blood boil.

Maybe the aging Republican party has lately shaved a few more years off the years It has left until it's history.

 

[anna.]

Not any vaccine but rather any or all mandates.

It's just another legal mechanism being placed for totalitarian rule and a few more lost places on the freedom index.

Do you want a life without mandates of any kind?

 

[Debater Slayer]

No. A lot of people decide not to take it just as they decide not to take any other treatment/med/vaccine/whatever.

It's a deliberate well informed choice that needs no justifications. They made a decision. Most people disagree. Nothing wrong with that. No interior motive. No conspiracies. They just don't want to take it.

Are you also ready to live with the consequences of your choice, such as being exempted from entry by private businesses and institutions that choose to do so? Or are you going to say they need to accommodate your choice too?

 

[Twilight Hue]

Do you want a life without mandates of any kind?

It would be nice. *grin*

I can understand cases where mandates like taxes, education, and such are welcome because we live better as a functioning society.

However when mandates interferes with personal freedom of choice it's time to take a serious and hard look at the repercussions of doing something like that.

In general, It might help something in the short term, but prove disastrous in the long term in its application to other things that may crop up that the mandate wasn't originally intended for. That's when trouble starts.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Are you also ready to live with the consequences of your choice, such as being exempted from entry by private businesses and institutions that choose to do so? Or are you going to say they need to accommodate your choice too?

We all live with consequences of our choices, but with the vaccine the consequence highly depends on the person's situation. For example, if you go out at night in a dangerous neighborhood your chance of getting hurt is higher than if you go out at night in a calm neighborhood. While you can still get hurt in the calm neighborhood, your chances/risks are less in one place than it is another.

Why would both people consider taking the vaccine as if they were at the same risk of getting COVID and spreading it?

Likewise, if you're always in a crowded area and always right up on people than your risk of catching COVID is higher than someone who barely goes out and has no contact-not even ten feet-with people to even think of being at risk.

It truly and definitely depends.

I didn't mention private businesses and institutions (not in the OP) so I'm not sure how that question relates to saying people make well-informed decisions that need no justifications no matter how much people disagree with them.

People can make choices that others disagree with without needing justifications to warrant their disagreement. It just is.

 

[Debater Slayer]

We all live with consequences of our choices, but with the vaccine the consequence highly depends on the person's situation. For example, if you go out at night in a dangerous neighborhood your chance of getting hurt is higher than if you go out at night in a calm neighborhood. While you can still get hurt in the calm neighborhood, your chances/risks are less in one place than it is another.

Why would both people consider taking the vaccine as if they were at the same risk of getting COVID and spreading it?

Likewise, if you're always in a crowded area and always right up on people than your risk of catching COVID is higher than someone who barely goes out and has no contact-not even ten feet-with people to even think of being at risk.

It truly and definitely depends.

I didn't mention private businesses and institutions (not in the OP) so I'm not sure how that question relates to saying people make well-informed decisions that need no justifications no matter how much people disagree with them.

People can make choices that others disagree with without needing justifications to warrant their disagreement. It just is.

My question was direct; the long paragraphs are off topic.

Perhaps your answer will be more pertinent if I rephrase the question: do you expect others to accommodate your decision by, for instance, allowing you into their business and other private venues even if they choose to only allow entry for vaccinated people? Or are you okay with being turned away and accepting that this is an outcome of your decision in said venues?

 

[halbhh]

It would be nice. *grin*

I can understand cases where mandates like taxes, education, and such are welcome because we live better as a functioning society.

However when mandates interferes with personal freedom of choice it's time to take a serious and hard look at the repercussions of doing something like that.

In general, It might help something in the short term, but prove disastrous in the long term in its application to other things that may crop up that the mandate wasn't originally intended for. That's when trouble starts.

Covid mandates are akin to mandates against open fires in drought dried forest.

Soneone might be able to avoid starting a forest fire, but we don't want to find out.

The mandates typically protect our freedom and by protecting our physical lives.

Sorta like laws that restrict drunk driving, is another good analogy.

In the U.S. mandates have a short lifespan once their usefulness for us ends! The people end them.