cult characteristics

[Booko]

and at the end, it does say "The SGA workshop provides help for a handful of
lucky cult survivors. It’s not enough, but it is a start." Meaning to me that
it may not be sufficient in helping someone get out completely.

I humbly suggest you reconsider linking to sites that list groups like these as "cults":

Baha'i (uh...that would be my religion...thanks :sarcastic)
Mormons
Amish
Neopaganism (laughable...who's the "charismatic leader" in a religion with no leaders?)
Theosophy (huh?)

Oh...I'm sure there are others on the list that don't belong there.

Of course, those who maintain the site claim this list doesn't really mean something is a "cult"...so I guess that Pontius Pilate routine makes it all ok.

 

[Booko]

Please note the following from their web-page under 'groups.'

Sorry, kiwimac, but imo this site's abdication of responsibility doesn't actually make them not responsible for what they put out there.

If they're not willing to do as little as 30 minutes web research on a group before they list them to see if they'd fit their own criteria, then they have a problem.

 

[exit_and_how]

another announcement for a ICSA workshop:

Ex-Member Workshop: Colorado
"AFTER THE CULT"
ESTES PARK, COLORADO
July 20 – July 22, 2007

Topics Covered

• The nature of psychological manipulation and abuse
• Conditions of thought reform programs
• General recovery needs of former members
• Coping with depression and guilt
• Effects of hypnosis and trance techniques
• Critical thinking
• Relationships and intimacy
• Post-traumatic stress syndrome
• Boundaries: re-establishing trust
• Coping with feelings of anger
• Coping with anxiety
• Decision-making
• Reestablishing trust in yourself and others
• Dependency issues
• The grieving process
• Reintegration/identity issues
• Spiritual and philosophical concerns
• Special track for those born into or raised in a cultic group

i might add that these workshops are for some serious cults, not just trying to fit the word to a religion that isn't popular, you don't particularly like, that has some far-out belief system, etc. Cults cause serious and lasting harm...

 

[drew22]

"whoever is the most humble is the greatest"

If the motto of the group is the above, and it is the leader who said that, do think that group is a cult?

 

[Popeyesays]

"whoever is the most humble is the greatest"

If the motto of the group is the above, and it is the leader who said that, do think that group is a cult?

I hate the term cult, it means little in any real sense. small charismatic religious groups can be based around individuals who use the force of their personality to manipulate others. However, I do not think the words coming out of their mouths are as important as what their followers mirror in their behavior.

Jim Jones was able to manipulate almost a thousand close followers through his powerful personality, Heaven's Gate far fewer.

Regards,
Scott

 

[drew22]

The leader could not then be say... the Dali Lama. I think the leaders of groups that go astray and hence don the name cult, have big egos.


peace, OM, and God be with you
Drew

 

[Scuba Pete]

cults prey on vulnerable people - people who lack social networks, friends - people who desperately need a group for support. in fact, the cult group may provide some love, but it does more harm than good, i.e. has costs - monetary, social, physical, spiritual, mental that all end up hurting.

This is not true. Many cults specialize in attracting those we would not normally consider to be "vulnerable". There are many, many successful people (even movie stars) who have fallen for cults. Cults and those who beget them are exceedingly good at deception often taking in the intelligent along with the gullible.

I know. I belonged to a cult know as the Boston Movement or the ICOC and saw it work from the inside. They will do their best to disguise their real motives. Watch out for the charismatic leaders.

 

[drew22]

I don`t like the word, cult, very much, mostly because it is used to fit any organized new set-up, e.g. Bahais, many times people have told me it is a cult without understanding it or the people in it; of course maitreya.org , just by looking at the yantra, with the swatstikas and all, causes fast thinking, no need to look further, cult, cult, cult.
All movements try to convert and they have their special, inside ways, to do--so what. I agreee too that, "cults", attract anyone and not just the vulnerable ones who are looking to belong to something.
Jim Jones, he was full of himself, follow me is what he wanted, never sit back and meditate, and pray, and then say, follow God, no, no, drink this poison, because God told you to follow me. If you think you are in a cult, just say, ok, God I am following You, and does the leader fulfill prophecy.

 

[exit_and_how]

would like to know a bit more about the Boston Movement and the ICOC...and i'm guessing other readers would as well. could you post links to pages or give some basic information?

 

[exit_and_how]

here's a link to a webpage about the Boston Movement and the ICOC
(in case anyone else was interested)...

http://www.spiritwatch.org/icoc.htm

there's a section called
"Things The ICC Won't Tell You"

which might fit for any cult: "Things _______ Won't Tell You", such
as scandals, lawsuits, etc.

 

[DeepShadow]

The problem with this is too many false positives: what group can you name that tells new members about lawsuits and scandals?

I mean seriously, does the Catholic Church sit people down and say, "now to be fair to our critics, there have been several incidents of child molestation, but none so far in our area."

Do the Masons tell initiates, "Four years ago, our Masonic lodge was scandalized by a treasurer who appropriated funds, and there's a steady supply of hazing lawsuits trickling through the courts of one state or another at any given time. If you still want to join...."

It's certainly worthwhile to be informed, but as a selection criteria for cults, this is...poor.

 

[Scuba Pete]

would like to know a bit more about the Boston Movement and the ICOC...and i'm guessing other readers would as well. could you post links to pages or give some basic information?

There are tons of "help groups" out there for the ICOC, but REVEAL is the most successful. I seemed to have escaped the emotional harm and bear no grudges towards any that were or are in leadership. In fact, I still consider MANY of them personal friends including Randy McKean, Kip's brother. Now, I met and spoke with Kip on numerous occasions and heard him speak at the various conferences, but he was never a part of my circle of friends.

Feel free to ask any questions, and I will do my best to answer them. I saw it start while I was at Crossroads church of Christ in Gainesville and ultimately went through a "reconstruction" here in Orlando. Of course, a separate thread might be in order.

Edit: I started a thread... http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=48660

 

[exit_and_how]

it was interesting to see another thread about the ICOC...

As for groups that do not admit wrong - it would be hard to deny it
if it happened in your parish/organization. I think most priests doing a sermon
would say something like "the trouble occurring in our parish, bla bla bla" -
in other words not get into details but no way to deny it.

I suppose the same thing happened to Jim Jones' group when they
moved to Guyana - the members would at least ask why, wouldn't they?
But maybe i'm wrong - perhaps there's a glaze or a veil of fear of
the members to even question the leadership...but the point is that
if a member finds out and starts to face some ugly truth,
doesn't that scream out CULT?!

 

[DeepShadow]

but the point is that if a member finds out and starts to face some ugly truth, doesn't that scream out CULT?!

I agree with you in theory, EAH. The problem is that it's still up to the individual to decide what's an "ugly truth that everyone's avoiding."

Our church is labeled a "cult" more often than not by those outside of it. You could paper a stadium in stories of ex-Mormons who fled after they found out some "ugly truth": polygamy, deification, Heavenly Mother, corrections to the Book of Mormon, "false prophesies," different accounts of Joseph's First Vision, etc. According to our critics, anyone who doesn't flee the church upon discovering one of these is avoiding the truth.

So my question is, does that scream "cult" to you? And if so, do you need more criteria to avoid your cult-o-meter blaring wherever you point it?

 

[exit_and_how]

Here's the next conference of ICSA - there seems to be over 60 talks being given (many in French only which are probably interesting if only I knew the language...).



Annual International Conference of International Cultic Studies Association (ICSA)

Brussels, Belgium

June 29-July 1, 2007

and the link to the webpage...
http://www.icsahome.com/infoserv_conferences/2007brussels/2007_a_home.htm

 

[exit_and_how]

one of the talks at the conferences which caught my eye:

How Memory Illusions and False Memories are Influenced by Social Expectations in the Real World
Tor Endestad, Ph.D.; Cathrine Moestue, Ph.D.


i saw this with some neighborhood kids one time - the older ones were talking like "remember when...." until the younger one said something like "oh yeah, i remember that.". Then, later, they confessed that they had made it up and wanted to trick the younger one into "remembering" something that had not happened (or was only partially true).

perhaps readers could see how a cult could do something similar...
perhaps remembering a dream and suggesting it had actually happened in a previous lifetime or saying that a particular feeling was from outer space or something...

 

[DeepShadow]

Elizabeth Loftus pioneered the field of false memory implantation. It takes place all over, and most of the time it's not deliberate. It's actually far more effective when it takes place accidentally.

 

[Scuba Pete]

Most cults appeal to passion. A passion for FRIENDS, which many want but few are willing to devote the time to create. A passion far a CAUSE. We seem to need to believe in and support something bigger and more important than ourselves.

Most cults are accidents. Their leader starts with high ideals then slips into delusions of grandeur which he passes on to his willing followers. He believes the hype more and more until he himself cannot serparate fact from fantasy.

 

[exit_and_how]

Here's another talk that is scheduled to be given:

Catholic Sects and the Catholic Church
Alberto Moncada, Ph.D.

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wonder what that's all about...
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[Quiddity]

Here's another talk that is scheduled to be given:

Catholic Sects and the Catholic Church
Alberto Moncada, Ph.D.

wonder what that's all about...​

It depends what you are looking for. If you are looking for a correct understanding of Catholicism, there is several places I'd recommend. But if you are looking for a twisted version full of goodies........Alberto Moncada is the man for that. Or if that doesn't fill you, try Chick Tracts..........they are absolutely brutal.