Did Jesus die and rise from the dead?

[Spartan]

The overwhelming majority of biblical scholars are devoted Christian theologians so there is no question at all that they believe this, so what would Christian theologians know about historical facts?

Sure, luke, they're all liars and charlatans. But how would you know either way, unless you did your own due-diligence?

 

[Spartan]

Diabolicly clever to dodge the ark question. Scared
you might find out who is the one putting on an act?

Which btw you are lying about me, I have made no
pretense of being a "scholar of some degree".

Why focus on the Ark when you can't accurately discuss the historical evidences for Jesus Christ over a thousand years later in history?

Show me one fictitious person, place, or event in the Gospels and identify the pertinent scripture #'s and provide your evidence.

If you can't do that you need not bother with other Biblical events.

 

[Audie]

Anyone who saw how fast tall tales sproutec after
the towers fell or the "maga kids" supposedly mocked the
Indians would find "too early" as ludicrous as the
Noahs ark tall tale.

And BTW, oh scholar, also on the "too early"
bit? You did just make that up. Tsk.

One more-asap would be exactly when to
start up some "explanation" for why their guy
was so easy to kill. He came back to life,
then floated away!

 

[Spartan]

Wiki says most not all Historians agree a man named Jesus lived was baptized of John The Baptist and crucified. A small percent of historians do still say its a doubt that there was even such a person as Jesus. Mome of the historians have proof or believe he raised from the dead.

They did recently find the dried out foot of a messiah type who was crucified left on the wooden cross he carried like Jesus. They left him up on the cross which is what they would have done to Jesus.

Well first of all there's no evidence from any source from antiquity that Jesus was left on the cross (to rot or whatever). That's an unfounded theory you have.

Second, there are historical sources that say Jesus was taken down from the cross. Even the corrupt Jewish authorities argued that the disciples stole the body.

 

[Spartan]

Anyone who saw how fast tall tales sproutec after
the towers fell or the "maga kids" supposedly mocked the
Indians would find "too early" as ludicrous as the
Noahs ark tall tale.

And BTW, oh scholar, also on the "too early"
bit? You did just make that up. Tsk.

One more-asap would be exactly when to
start up some "explanation" for why their guy
was so easy to kill. He came back to life,
then floated away!

This thread is about Jesus Christ. If you want to discuss Noah's Ark please start your own own, separate thread on that.

 

[Audie]

Why focus on the Ark when you can't accurately discuss the historical evidences for Jesus Christ over a thousand years later in history?

Show me one fictitious person, place, or event in the Gospels and identify the pertinent scripture #'s and provide your evidence.

If you can't do that you need not bother with other Biblical events.

Ah, a cute tu quoque. Who'd have guessed
it would be that ploy?

Just say if you believe in Noah's ark!
Courage my man! Courage of convictions.

Even if your big talk about due diligence is
about to shrivel like a salted slug.

 

[Wandering Monk]

Less than 80 years after George Washington died, a myth sprang up that he had a vision of American history which was given to him by and angel. Myths can spring up very quickly.

 

[Riders]

Well first of all there's no evidence from any source from antiquity that Jesus was left on the cross (to rot or whatever). That's an unfounded theory you have.

Second, there are historical sources that say Jesus was taken down from the cross. Even the corrupt Jewish authorities argued that the disciples stole the body.

No others like Jesus have been found to be left on the cross which is proof Jesus would have been.There was no tomb.

 

[Audie]

This thread is about Jesus Christ. If you want to discuss Noah's Ark please start your own own, separate thread on that.

All I want is a yes or no, not a discussion.
You claim to have done all this study and know
a lot.
Why run away when you see the acid test for your
scholarship?

 

[InChrist]

Why didnt he get down and go after them like he supposedly did
the money changers?

Then go ask Pilate if he is up for trying it again?

That wouldda imlressed the crap out of everyone!

I will give you a poem to explain why.

Sometime During Eternity . . . by Lawrence Ferlinghetti

Why would Jesus get down? He said His hour had come. It was the appointed time for His death. His main purpose for coming to the earth was to go to the cross to pay for the sins of the world. Because of His love for humanity and to provide a way of forgiveness and eternal life, Jesus had no intention of getting off that cross.

Thanks for the poem. Not my style, though.

 

[Audie]

Well first of all there's no evidence from any source from antiquity that Jesus was left on the cross (to rot or whatever). That's an unfounded theory you have.

Second, there are historical sources that say Jesus was taken down from the cross. Even the corrupt Jewish authorities argued that the disciples stole the body.

Are you denying that it was the custom to leave
corpses on display? I offered no "theory".

As for the value of these "historical sources", there are
signrd documents attesting to the J Smith gold plates.

Now, back to diligence. Your "Jesus" is said to have
believed in noahs ark. Do you?

The quality of your diligent study is zip if you
fail this test.

 

[Spartan]

No others like Jesus have been found to be left on the cross which is proof Jesus would have been.There was no tomb.

What evidence do you have for those claims?

 

[Audie]

Why would Jesus get down? He said His hour had come. It was the appointed time for His death. His main purpose for coming to the earth was to go to the cross to pay for the sins of the world. Because of His love for humanity and to provide a way of forgiveness and eternal life, Jesus had no intention of getting off that cross.

Thanks for the poem. Not my style, though.

Ifn he wanted people to believe in him
would be like a totally good reason.

As it is, it has all the ingredients of a hoax
cobbled together.

 

[Audie]

What evidence do you have for those claims?

A rephrase would be in order, the claims
make no sense as written.

 

[InChrist]

his body most likely stayed on the cross and rotted out along with others. They know this because recently they found the dried out foot of another Messiah type who got crucified on the cross and his foot was still on the cross.

They said this is what they do with people like Jesus ...............Jesus would have never been allowed to have a tomb for himself it was against the law for anyone outside of the rulers and royalty and important leaders to even get a tomb sorry.

His body did not stay on the cross. The Jews wanted the bodies off before the Sabbath. (Now it was the day of Preparation, and the next day was to be a special Sabbath. Because the Jewish leaders did not want the bodies left on the crosses during the Sabbath, they asked Pilate to have the legs broken and the bodies taken down. John 19:31) Do you read the biblical accounts at all? Joseph of Arimathea placed the body of Jesus in his own tomb.

Joseph of Arimathea, a prominent member of the Council, who was himself waiting for the kingdom of God, went boldly to Pilate and asked for Jesus’ body. 44 Pilate was surprised to hear that he was already dead. Summoning the centurion, he asked him if Jesus had already died. 45 When he learned from the centurion that it was so, he gave the body to Joseph. 46 So Joseph bought some linen cloth, took down the body, wrapped it in the linen, and placed it in a tomb cut out of rock. Mark 15:43-46

 

[Riders]

His body did not stay on the cross. The Jews wanted the bodies off before the Sabbath. (Now it was the day of Preparation, and the next day was to be a special Sabbath. Because the Jewish leaders did not want the bodies left on the crosses during the Sabbath, they asked Pilate to have the legs broken and the bodies taken down. John 19:31) Do you read the biblical accounts at all? Joseph of Arimathea placed the body of Jesus in his own tomb.

Joseph of Arimathea, a prominent member of the Council, who was himself waiting for the kingdom of God, went boldly to Pilate and asked for Jesus’ body. 44 Pilate was surprised to hear that he was already dead. Summoning the centurion, he asked him if Jesus had already died. 45 When he learned from the centurion that it was so, he gave the body to Joseph. 46 So Joseph bought some linen cloth, took down the body, wrapped it in the linen, and placed it in a tomb cut out of rock. Mark 15:43-46

Using the biblle as proof of the bible does not work for me.

 

[Audie]

His body did not stay on the cross. The Jews wanted the bodies off before the Sabbath. (Now it was the day of Preparation, and the next day was to be a special Sabbath. Because the Jewish leaders did not want the bodies left on the crosses during the Sabbath, they asked Pilate to have the legs broken and the bodies taken down. John 19:31) Do you read the biblical accounts at all? Joseph of Arimathea placed the body of Jesus in his own tomb.

Joseph of Arimathea, a prominent member of the Council, who was himself waiting for the kingdom of God, went boldly to Pilate and asked for Jesus’ body. 44 Pilate was surprised to hear that he was already dead. Summoning the centurion, he asked him if Jesus had already died. 45 When he learned from the centurion that it was so, he gave the body to Joseph. 46 So Joseph bought some linen cloth, took down the body, wrapped it in the linen, and placed it in a tomb cut out of rock. Mark 15:43-46

That might be so, but it was the custom to have
a display.

British did it with pirates, hung till they rotted away as a
suggestion to others.

 

[Riders]

Why would Jesus get down? He said His hour had come. It was the appointed time for His death. His main purpose for coming to the earth was to go to the cross to pay for the sins of the world. Because of His love for humanity and to provide a way of forgiveness and eternal life, Jesus had no intention of getting off that cross.

Thanks for the poem. Not my style, though.

I actually do agree there was a good spiritual purpose in crucifixion on the cross. However I don't believe Jesus is God and did not do it to save the world. But rather he saved the world on a human level in the sense by providing the right spiritual example, laying his life down for his community instead of doing the wrong thing.

Turning the other cheek taking up the cross and laying your life down for others as a spiritual truth is something I can buy into. Iiteraly does not mean even having to die literally for someone else but giving up your own needs and your own time for others is in a sense laying your life down for others.

So the Messiah message is good if you buy into the idea that he was crucified. Other Messiahs were crucified the same way too.But its a good message but theres no proof he is God.

 

[whirlingmerc]

Oh Im tap dancing am I? Your saying Jesus ancestry report in the Gospels did not contradict each other? How about love your enemy and love your neighbor from a guy who attacked the money changers table and said that we will hate our families and brothers and sisters will war against each other? I have many more this is just a start.

I know of no so called contradictions that are not resolvable in the New Testament

I think what you are describing as a bit of 'tough love' with the moneychangers.

 

[whirlingmerc]

I actually do agree there was a good spiritual purpose in crucifixion on the cross. However I don't believe Jesus is God and did not do it to save the world. But rather he saved the world on a human level in the sense by providing the right spiritual example, laying his life down for his community instead of doing the wrong thing.

Turning the other cheek taking up the cross and laying your life down for others as a spiritual truth is something I can buy into. Iiteraly does not mean even having to die literally for someone else but giving up your own needs and your own time for others is in a sense laying your life down for others.

So the Messiah message is good if you buy into the idea that he was crucified. Other Messiahs were crucified the same way too.But its a good message but theres no proof he is God.

Merely providing an example would be insufficient.

Jesus traded our sins for His righteousness and made a way so that we could get new desires and new strength. No matter what the example we can only love what we want to love and Jesus made a way to even change our desires to turn from loving gutter water of the world to loving God

We don't have it in us on our own