fascist_crusader
Member
1 Timothy 3:16 states outright that "God was manifest in the flesh" when speaking about Christ. There you have it folks.
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First of all, I think forgiveness of sins, which Jesus Christ did, is a far greater miracle than parting a sea.So how do we know that God didnt do the things through Jesus as he did through Moses.
Yup, there you have it. Note: It doesn't say "God the Father was manifest in the flesh."1 Timothy 3:16 states outright that "God was manifest in the flesh" when speaking about Christ. There you have it folks.
So you are implying that the church fathers and numerous theologians throughout the centuries were wrong? How interesting.Those who taught you are massively confused. They are not able to discern between the temporality of the flesh and the eternality of the spirit.
Actually when Christ stated that he was stating that he was God, which is why the Pharisies acted like they did. I do not however, nor to my knowledge any theologians, beleive that Christ apearing before his human form was infact the same human form.When Jesus says that He existed before Abraham, He is not referring to the body but Christian theologians have trouble seeing this and think that any viewing of God before Jesus must have included the body of Jesus.
Incorrect, hence we have the word incarnate. No where in the bible does it state such, but I could be proven wrong. For God to inhabit a human he must let go of his Godly attributes as the human is not intended to be God. These atributes been all the omni's.The truth is that God can inhabit any body He wishes and is able to create that body fully mature. The visit by God to Abraham before the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah is a case in point.
On this I have to agree. Christ when resurrected had a glorified body hence his ability to appear in a locked room fully flesh.The resurrected Jesus is not in the exact same body that He was in before that body died.
So Jesus (God the Father in flesh) prayed to His God, who was in Heaven. But He was apparently really here on earth. He asked Himself to remove the bitter cup. And when He hung on the cross, He wondered why He'd forsaken Himself. He asked Himself to forgive those who had nailed Him to the cross. He died, commending His spirit into His own hands. After His resurrection, He told His Apostles that He was greater than Himself. He said that He was going to be with Himself in Heaven, even though He was supposedly already there. And today, He sits on His own right hand. Someday, He will give Himself the authority to judge us. I think I've got it now!Yet God the father says that there is but one God, there never was or will be any more gods, and that none are equal to him. The logical conclusion: Jesus is God the father in flesh.
So Jesus (God the Father in flesh) prayed to His God, who was in Heaven. But He was apparently really here on earth. He asked Himself to remove the bitter cup. And when He hung on the cross, He wondered why He'd forsaken Himself. He asked Himself to forgive those who had nailed Him to the cross. He died, commending His spirit into His own hands. After His resurrection, He told His Apostles that He was greater than Himself. He said that He was going to be with Himself in Heaven, even though He was supposedly already there. And today, He sits on His own right hand. Someday, He will give Himself the authority to judge us. I think I've got it now!
Whatever. It sounds like one gigantic contradiction to me, but to each his own.Unlike the God of mormonism the God of the bible is everywhere at once, therefore yes, the christ aspect of God can be at the "right hand(which is metaphorical)" of father God, can speak with the Father, and can choose to humble himself to human form, which made him submissive rto the father, because he was a man.
So how do we know that God didnt do the things through Jesus as he did through Moses.
DreGod - The evidence for Jesus claiming he is God is found within the scriptures. Aside from the miracles that He preformed, in NO way does he try to seperate Himself from God - instead He says that He is God in the flesh.
When Jesus is quoted as saying "Son of Man", this is not primarily referring to Jesus' humanity. Instead, it is a direct allusion to Daniel 7:13-7:14. The "Son of Man" is a figure that would come at the end of the world to judge mankind and rule forever. In essence, the "Son of Man" truly indicates a claim of divinity, someone who has universal authority and dominion. Additionally, Jesus claims to forgive sins in the synoptics - something only that God can do.
"Whoever acknowledges me, I will acknowledge before my Father in heaven." So, you would claim that final judgement is based upon this mere human being? To think that is, in my opinion, arrogant. Instead final judgment is based upon on one's reaction to Jesus AS God.
Well, in a "sense" he would be inferior to the Father, since he is the Father in the Flesh - mans flesh. As I said earlier,
Of course the Bible never explicitly states "Trinity", but there are many terms we say that are not in the Bible. For example, the word "bible" is not found in the "bible."
Regardless though, the books in the NT are not formal, point by point writings of doctrine. Nowhere in the Bible do the authors show difficulty in using the Father, Son or Holy Spirit - almost interchangably.
Three verses from the Bible that link the "trinity" concept.
All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and ofthe Son and ofthe Holy Spirit [Matthew 28:19].
May the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all
[2 Corinthians 13:14].
To Gods elect. . .who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit, for obedience to Jesus Christ and sprinkling by his blood [1 Peter 1:1-2].
1 Timothy 3:16 states outright that "God was manifest in the flesh" when speaking about Christ. There you have it folks.
First of all, I think forgiveness of sins, which Jesus Christ did, is a far greater miracle than parting a sea.
In Mark 2:10, Jesus was being questioned by some scribes as to how He could declare a paralyzed man's sins forgiven, and He said, "But that you may know that the Son of Man has power on earth to forgive sins..." Clearly Christ did, and still does, have that authority. If we believe (as I hope you do) that only God can forgive someone's sins, and we see here that Jesus forgives someone's sins, then what would that make Jesus?
Yet God the father says that there is but one God, there never was or will be any more gods, and that none are equal to him. The logical conclusion: Jesus is God the father in flesh.
So Jesus (God the Father in flesh) prayed to His God, who was in Heaven. But He was apparently really here on earth. He asked Himself to remove the bitter cup. And when He hung on the cross, He wondered why He'd forsaken Himself. He asked Himself to forgive those who had nailed Him to the cross. He died, commending His spirit into His own hands. After His resurrection, He told His Apostles that He was greater than Himself. He said that He was going to be with Himself in Heaven, even though He was supposedly already there. And today, He sits on His own right hand. Someday, He will give Himself the authority to judge us. I think I've got it now!
Any sixth grader can mock the divinity of Christ and spew vapid remarks about the relationship of the Holy Spirit, God the Father and His Son.
However, few have the intellectual acuity to perceive the spiritual nuances of biblical truth or possess the ability to articulate a depth of understanding.
In order to support the traditional Christian view of the relationship of Jesus to the Father, we must understand the background for certain claims about the nature and identity of Jesus in the New Testament. Our general argument may be outlined as follows:
Jesus, as God's Word and Wisdom, was and is eternally an attribute of God the Father. Just as our own words and thoughts come from us and cannot be separated from us, so it is that Jesus cannot be completely separate from the Father. But there is more to this explanation, related to the distinction between functional subordination and ontological equality. We speak of Christ as the "Word" of God, God's "speech" in living form. In Hebrew and Ancient Near Eastern thought, words were not merely sounds, or letters on a page; words were things that "had an independent existence and which actually did things." Throughout the Old Testament and in the Jewish intertestamental Wisdom literature, the power of God's spoken word is emphasized (Ps. 33:6, 107:20; Is. 55:11; Jer. 23:29; 2 Esd. 6:38; Wisdom 9:1). "Judaism understood God's Word to have almost autonomous powers and substance once spoken; to be, in fact, 'a concrete reality, a veritable cause.'" (Richard N. Longenecker, The Christology of Early Jewish Christianity , 145.) But a word did not need to be uttered or written to be alive." (excerpt from 1st link below).